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Cubasis 3.2 - Multicore-rendering & Latency Settings

LFSLFS
edited December 2020 in General App Discussion

Hi all,

We've received several questions regarding the performance optimizations in Cubasis 3.2.

Below please find further information about the new multicore rendering, and how to configure the latency settings, provided by our lead engineer, Alex.

Multicore-rendering overview
Multicore-rendering has been implemented in Cubasis 3.1 for Android and in Cubasis 3.2 for iOS.
This means that on devices with more than two CPU cores*, the rendering of multiple tracks during playback and mixdown is simultaneously performed on multiple cores.
On devices with 2 CPU cores*, multi-core rendering is disabled in order to keep one of the cores available for all the non-audio stuff (UI, touch, the operating system…)
Note that a project must contain at least 2 tracks in order for multi-core rendering to kick in.

Latency setup options
In the Setup under Audio, “Audio Engine Latency” must be enabled in order for Cubasis to perform multi-core rendering. Note that this setup option is only available on devices with more than two CPU cores*. In most cases, the sweet spot for rendering performance is with Audio Engine Latency set to twice the Device Latency (on iOS), or 16-32ms (on Android).
However, this introduces additional latency to monitoring and live keyboard input, since the engine uses additional internal buffers to render into, which also prevents drop-outs.
Multi-core rendering yields the most performance benefit when playing projects with many tracks and effects on devices with many CPU cores, where Audio Engine Latency is enabled.
On some devices (possibly those with 3 cores) and in certain situations (monitoring or when using specific AU plug-ins), it might be beneficial to turn off Audio Engine Latency.

DSP meter
The DSP level in the Inspector’s "System Info” tab measures the time duration that a rendering cycle takes, divided by the buffer duration (the time available to perform rendering).
With Audio Engine Latency disabled, rendering is performed on the system’s single ultra high priority audio thread, which means that a DSP peak of 100% always results in a drop-out (crackling).
When Audio Engine Latency is enabled, rendering is performed in engine threads and a short peak of 100% doesn’t always mean that there is a drop-out, because the engine's buffers might have been able to prevent it. A dropout will only occur if DSP is 100% for longer than “Audio Engine Latency” is set to. Note that the DSP usage might be higher than with Audio Engine Latency disabled, which is normal because engine threads don’t get the same priority as the system's audio thread, but that's not a problem because multi-core rendering more than makes up for it.

*Note that on some devices with more than 2 cores, only 2 cores are considered by Cubasis because the other ones are energy efficient (lower performance) cores and might be unsuited for real-time audio rendering.

Best wishes,
Lars

Comments

  • edited December 2020

    @LFS
    Multicore-rendering overview

    This is really great news !! But does this is applied only to build in plugins and internal Cubasis processing, isn't it ? Or host can affect also threading of used AUv3 plugins ?

  • Wow, thanks for the details!

  • edited December 2020

    hm looks like at least on iPad Mini 5 2019 (A12 cou with 2 high performance cores) multicore feature is not much useful - i can run 6 instances of Model D with multicore disabled, after i enable it (no matter how big latency i add) there is lot of crackles in sound (even with just 4 instamces there are crackles)

  • Does the a14 cpu benefit from multicore? I know it’s a 6 core cpu, but I’m not sure about high performance cores. It doesn’t seem to help much if any at all on my iPhone 14 pro max. Unless I don’t have it set up right.

  • edited December 2020

    It seems that only A12X and A12Z can benefit from that new feature, as they both have 4 performance cores, all other CPU have only 2 performances core including A14. Only recent Pro iPads are concerned, now they are really advantaged.

  • edited December 2020

    @dendy you have audio engine latency setting available?

    @LFS shouldn’t that setting be unavailable with A12 which has only 2 performance cores? You should make a list of compatible devices, that will be easier for users.

  • @dendy said:

    @LFS
    Multicore-rendering overview

    This is really great news !! But does this is applied only to build in plugins and internal Cubasis processing, isn't it ? Or host can affect also threading of used AUv3 plugins ?

    Hi @dendy,

    Thanks for your comment.

    From our engineering:
    Indeed, multicore-rendering means that rendering of the AU plug-ins can be distributed to multiple threads (cores) simultaneously.

    Best,
    Lars

  • @Jmd8928 said:
    Does the a14 cpu benefit from multicore? I know it’s a 6 core cpu, but I’m not sure about high performance cores. It doesn’t seem to help much if any at all on my iPhone 14 pro max. Unless I don’t have it set up right.

    @Janosax
    It seems that only A12X and A12Z can benefit from that new feature, as they both have 4 performance cores, all other CPU have only 2 performances core including A14. Only recent Pro iPads are concerned, now they are really advantaged.

    Here comes the feedback from our engineering:
    We can confirm that multicore-rendering is available on the A14 (iPhone 12). So it seems that although it only has 2 high-performance cores, iOS reports 6 cores to Cubasis, probably because the energy-efficient cores are fast enough to be considered "useful" for multi-threading.

  • Thank you for the quick response,
    I mainly use iPad Air 3 for music, it’s a12 cpu must also be fast enough as the setting is also present with it.

  • @LFS said:

    @Jmd8928 said:
    Does the a14 cpu benefit from multicore? I know it’s a 6 core cpu, but I’m not sure about high performance cores. It doesn’t seem to help much if any at all on my iPhone 14 pro max. Unless I don’t have it set up right.

    @Janosax
    It seems that only A12X and A12Z can benefit from that new feature, as they both have 4 performance cores, all other CPU have only 2 performances core including A14. Only recent Pro iPads are concerned, now they are really advantaged.

    Here comes the feedback from our engineering:
    We can confirm that multicore-rendering is available on the A14 (iPhone 12). So it seems that although it only has 2 high-performance cores, iOS reports 6 cores to Cubasis, probably because the energy-efficient cores are fast enough to be considered "useful" for multi-threading.

    And IPad Air 2020 then ?

  • I see multi-core settings on iPhone SE 2020 (A12), which is 2 fast cores, 4 slow iirc. I think we need a support list...

  • iPad Pro 12.9 2020 1tb, if I use late by setting (both high or low) after the third Auv3 plug-ins I experienced a lot of crackles in sound. With latency off no problems. I really can’t understand why since the IPad is a multicore and should benefit of the setting turned on.

  • edited December 2020

    @Charlesalbert said:
    iPad Pro 12.9 2020 1tb, if I use late by setting (both high or low) after the third Auv3 plug-ins I experienced a lot of crackles in sound. With latency off no problems. I really can’t understand why since the IPad is a multicore and should benefit of the setting turned on.

    Is it on iPad speakers, USB-C EarPods or external audio interface? Which sample rate and latency settings?

  • @Janosax said:
    It seems that only A12X and A12Z can benefit from that new feature, as they both have 4 performance cores, all other CPU have only 2 performances core including A14. Only recent Pro iPads are concerned, now they are really advantaged.

    Thanks for the info. I was wondering all the time while reading Lars article, to which Apple chips it refers.

  • edited December 2020

    @israelite said:

    @Janosax said:
    It seems that only A12X and A12Z can benefit from that new feature, as they both have 4 performance cores, all other CPU have only 2 performances core including A14. Only recent Pro iPads are concerned, now they are really advantaged.

    Thanks for the info. I was wondering all the time while reading Lars article, to which Apple chips it refers.

    It seems in fact that some 2 high performance cores CPU are also supported... but results seems not as good as with 4 cores ones!!? ...so confusing.

    A list should be available here on AB forum, on Cubasis forum, on AppStore description and in manual. Or that will lead to perpetual discussion, asks and answers, or even bad settings habits... and/or bad reviews, which should be shame for such a nice feature.

  • does this mean, if the option for audio engine latency is available, the device will actually profit from multithreading?

  • You would hope so, wouldn’t you? My experience suggests that is not the case. I have a 10.5 Pro and I have been advised by Steinberg in this forum to turn it off...

  • edited January 2021

    With the A10X processor, right? Then maybe there's hope for my mini 5 which has an A12 something something... ?

  • @LFS said:

    @Jmd8928 said:
    Does the a14 cpu benefit from multicore? I know it’s a 6 core cpu, but I’m not sure about high performance cores. It doesn’t seem to help much if any at all on my iPhone 14 pro max. Unless I don’t have it set up right.

    @Janosax
    It seems that only A12X and A12Z can benefit from that new feature, as they both have 4 performance cores, all other CPU have only 2 performances core including A14. Only recent Pro iPads are concerned, now they are really advantaged.

    Here comes the feedback from our engineering:
    We can confirm that multicore-rendering is available on the A14 (iPhone 12). So it seems that although it only has 2 high-performance cores, iOS reports 6 cores to Cubasis, probably because the energy-efficient cores are fast enough to be considered "useful" for multi-threading.

    Hi Lars - is there finally a list of supported devices which do benefit from the multi-core rendering?

  • After the dust settled how is peoples experience now with multicore support?

  • and also, is there finally a list of compatible/supported devices?!

  • @Crabman said:
    After the dust settled how is peoples experience now with multicore support?

    It’s fantastic but there are a few caveats. I have found in some cases, apps like Sunrizer distort or stutter when you have multiple instances.

    Also, when using multi track audio out, like DigiStix, FAC drumkit and hammerhead, they click and pop quite often causing me to switch multi core off, which is very frustrating.

    I haven’t reported this to Steinberg yet as the workaround to switch off multicore and freeze instead gets me by.

  • @timforsyth said:

    @Crabman said:
    After the dust settled how is peoples experience now with multicore support?

    It’s fantastic but there are a few caveats. I have found in some cases, apps like Sunrizer distort or stutter when you have multiple instances.

    Also, when using multi track audio out, like DigiStix, FAC drumkit and hammerhead, they click and pop quite often causing me to switch multi core off, which is very frustrating.

    I haven’t reported this to Steinberg yet as the workaround to switch off multicore and freeze instead gets me by.

    Interesting. You should report, perhaps they will improve this in a future update.

  • @timforsyth said:

    @Crabman said:
    After the dust settled how is peoples experience now with multicore support?

    It’s fantastic but there are a few caveats. I have found in some cases, apps like Sunrizer distort or stutter when you have multiple instances.

    Also, when using multi track audio out, like DigiStix, FAC drumkit and hammerhead, they click and pop quite often causing me to switch multi core off, which is very frustrating.

    I haven’t reported this to Steinberg yet as the workaround to switch off multicore and freeze instead gets me by.

    I’m using FAC Drumkit all the time in CB3 but I don‘t have any noises. Does it happen constantly? Can it be that I just don’t hear it when other instruments play?

  • edited November 2021

    @krassmann said:

    @timforsyth said:

    @Crabman said:
    After the dust settled how is peoples experience now with multicore support?

    It’s fantastic but there are a few caveats. I have found in some cases, apps like Sunrizer distort or stutter when you have multiple instances.

    Also, when using multi track audio out, like DigiStix, FAC drumkit and hammerhead, they click and pop quite often causing me to switch multi core off, which is very frustrating.

    I haven’t reported this to Steinberg yet as the workaround to switch off multicore and freeze instead gets me by.

    I’m using FAC Drumkit all the time in CB3 but I don‘t have any noises. Does it happen constantly? Can it be that I just don’t hear it when other instruments play?

    Perhaps it’s thanks to your M1. The more I use it the more I find it wonderful and in laptop power class.

  • I’m using FAC Drumkit all the time in CB3 but I don‘t have any noises. Does it happen constantly? Can it be that I just don’t hear it when other instruments play?

    I just opened a new project, with just hammerhead and can't reproduce this! When I load up a previous project where I experienced this, it's there. Random clicks and pops.

    I've been taking a break from making music the past few weeks, but I'll try to reliably reproduce this and report it.

    Other than that, I will say multicore lets you run many more concurrent auv apps.

    The project I mentioned above with it disabled and about 63 plugs loaded sits around 99%. Enable it and it drops to around 70%.

    This is on an air 4

  • LFSLFS
    edited May 24

    Hi all,

    PLEASE NOTE THAT THE TOPIC HAS BEEN UPDATED (Status: May 24, 2022).

    To learn more, please refer to the “Setup” chapter in the Cubasis in-app help or the additional online help version at:

    https://download.steinberg.net/downloads_software/Cubasis/Cubasis_3_Web_Help/SETUP.html

    Best wishes,
    Lars

  • @LFS said:
    Hi all,

    PLEASE NOTE THAT THE TOPIC HAS BEEN UPDATED (Status: May 24, 2022).

    To learn more, please refer to the “Setup” chapter in the Cubasis in-app help or the additional online help version at:

    https://download.steinberg.net/downloads_software/Cubasis/Cubasis_3_Web_Help/SETUP.html

    Best wishes,
    Lars

    Ok thanks Lars. Are you just saying that documentation has been updated to reflect the best way to set up regarding multi-core and latency? Not sure what is said before TBH.

    Anyway, performance on my Air 3 (with multi-core enabled) seems fantastic since changes were made (in 3.4?) So big thanks to the team - it's saved me from having to upgrade my iPad so I'm very happy.

    I didn't think a non-M1 device like mine was ever going to benefit from multi-core but it certainly seems to have.

  • @FPC said:

    @LFS said:
    Hi all,

    PLEASE NOTE THAT THE TOPIC HAS BEEN UPDATED (Status: May 24, 2022).

    To learn more, please refer to the “Setup” chapter in the Cubasis in-app help or the additional online help version at:

    https://download.steinberg.net/downloads_software/Cubasis/Cubasis_3_Web_Help/SETUP.html

    Best wishes,
    Lars

    Ok thanks Lars. Are you just saying that documentation has been updated to reflect the best way to set up regarding multi-core and latency? Not sure what is said before TBH.

    Yeah, the documentation covers it more clearly now. Before one of the latest updates multicore support was broken on my 2021 base ipad, now it's much better.

  • @ehehehe said:

    @FPC said:

    @LFS said:
    Hi all,

    PLEASE NOTE THAT THE TOPIC HAS BEEN UPDATED (Status: May 24, 2022).

    To learn more, please refer to the “Setup” chapter in the Cubasis in-app help or the additional online help version at:

    https://download.steinberg.net/downloads_software/Cubasis/Cubasis_3_Web_Help/SETUP.html

    Best wishes,
    Lars

    Ok thanks Lars. Are you just saying that documentation has been updated to reflect the best way to set up regarding multi-core and latency? Not sure what is said before TBH.

    Yeah, the documentation covers it more clearly now. Before one of the latest updates multicore support was broken on my 2021 base ipad, now it's much better.

    Right. I'd (wrongly) assumed that all non-M1 machines weren't going to benefit. Very happy to have such a performance boost. Was running a stupid amount of synths and effects on my last project :)

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