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Getting iPad MIDI instruments into Windows DAW - Confusion regarding correct hardware
Hello
I am really very new to the concepts of using ipad as an instrument in a Windows DAW ( eg Presonus Studio 6+).
My concern is primarily on the hardware that I need to buy.
I read the entire two pages of the following post and I empathise with the struggle faced by the OP to fix the basics.
https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/43727/ios-instruments-to-windows-daw/p1
https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/43727/ios-instruments-to-windows-daw/p2
My equipment:
Ipad 12.9 inch 3rd Gen with USB C
Apple USB-C digital AV Multiport Adaptor
Old generation MIDI interfaces like MOTU Micro Lie, MOTU Pocket Express, & ESI ROMI/O
Presonus Studio One+ 6
Presonus Studio 1824c
Maschine Mikro Mk III
From what I gather from the above posts, what I need to make this happen are:
A CCK (I don't know if the Apple USB-C digital AV Multiport Adaptor can be used as CCK). I believe the CCK came in for lightning connector while mine is USB.
An interface like the iRIG Pro. iRIG MIDI 2 etc. none of which are available now. I found the Connectivity MIO 1/1 but it’s a plain MIDI interface, so no means to get audio out. I also had a look at TC-Helicon GO TWIN and the iRIG PRO DUO I/O. But I’m not aware whether these can actually transfer MIDI data from an iPad synth
I shall be more than grateful if someone could please guide me on the correct hardware because my budget is tight.
Sumit
Comments
Hi. Your Multiport Adapter is the USB-C equivalent of the "CCK". It was just the means of connecting a USB audio interface. Actually, the CCK (Camera Connection Kit) refers to a pair of adapters for the original 30-pin iPhone dock connector, but people use it to refer to the Lightning USB adapters.
Thanks Uncle Dave for the insight.
I would like to add that I just happened to read Focusrite now started their Scarlett 4i4 supports iPad connectivity. But what they showed in the video is recording audio into Focusrite and onwards into iPad. No mention of recording MIDI from iPad to Windows PC.
Could you please clarify what you're looking for:
Most iPad audio interfaces have some outputs as well as inputs. Those outputs can be used to send audio generated on the iPad to the PC.
If an interface includes 5-pin MIDI, it can likely send and receive MIDI to/from a 5-pin interface on the PC. Not sure about MIDI over USB tho.
Yes I am looking for a way to play and record midi synth sounds from iPad to pc.
I use a similar setup. I have a Presonus Studio 1810c for the WIndows laptop, and a Presonus Audiobox USB96 for the iPad. The Studio 1810c also works with the iPad, so I'd recommend you get one of those Studio-series interfaces instead of the Audiobox USB96. You'll need the 'USB-C to Digital AV Multiport Adapter' detailed at the link below:
https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MUF82AM/A/usb-c-digital-av-multiport-adapter
This link will also help you:
https://support.presonus.com/hc/en-us/articles/360059975732-PreSonus-Hardware-iOS-iPadOS-Compatibility
And depending on your setup, you may need MIDI Thru and Merge boxes.
Another option is the iConnectivity Audio4c or a used iConnectAudio4+ which works with both PC/Mac and iPad. It serves as the Audio+MIDI interface for both devices. Routing MIDI and audio is done using software.
https://www.iconnectivity.com/audio4c
There's also software called Studiomux but I haven't used it.
I wanted to keep it simple, so I went with the dual interfaces.
It sounds like OP just wants to connect an iPad to a Windows PC. If this is the setup then there should be no 5-pin MIDI involved at all. Everything will just go through standard USB cables.
If only audio is needed often the far simpler thing is simply to export the audio on the iPad, copy it to a USB stick, and hand-carry it to the PC. Not only is it easier and less cluttered, but you don't have to deal with adjusting the resulting audio for the inevitable latency issues.
Hi thanks everyone. I see a collective of suggestions all of which are good and correct.
My objective as you can see from thee title of this post, is not to sequence in the iPad but only to use the iPad as an instrument in my Windows PC based DAW.
May I kindly ask @StudioES whether the setup that you use is similar to what I am looking for? Also will the Audiobus do the function of the interface as the orange box in my diagram?
I would like to consider buying a device like iRIG Pro DUO I/O or TC-Helicon Go Twin or similar, it ONLY IF COMPULSORILY REQUIRED TO DO THE JOB. This device should work as an interface to connect to the USB-C Digital AV Multiport Adapter connected to my iPad Pro 3rd Gen USB C port.
The objective is to utilise the vast software synthesiser libraries in the iPad ecosystem and play and record them in my Windows based DAW as MIDI tracks. I suppose that this hardware interface device will allow my MIDI keyboard to trigger MIDI commands into the iPad based synth and out to a MIDI interface and an Audio interface, both connected to a Windows based DAW, Presonus Studio One. The MIDI interface will allow MIDI commands to be sequenced in the DAW, while the Audio interface will allow me to hear the sound from the iPad as it is being sequenced.
It’s best that I show it in the form of a diagram. Here’s it is attached. Everything in the diagram, except the orange coloured box, I already have with me.
Okay, I've reread your posts and looked at your diagram.
You'll need a USB Audio+MIDI interface for your iPad.
No, it won't. That's what the USB Audio+MIDI interface is used for.
You can host synths in Audiobus, AUM, apeMatrix or in iPad DAWs. They each have their advantages and disadvantages.
You'll be able to sequence the iPad synths from Studio One. And also record the audio from them.
Thanks. I made a typo error. I meant to ask “Also will the Presonus Audio Box 96USB do the function of the interface as the orange box in my diagram?”
If not, why not?
And if not not, what is the kind of USB Audio+MIDI interface for my iPad that will be able to transfer the MIDI data and audio data to my Windows DAW. I do have a spare Focusrite 4i4 4th Gen. Will that work? Do I really need to buy an iRig Duo I/O or similar portable as is being hammered down by many of the YouTube videos?
One thing I noticed is that you mentioned you’re using two interfaces, one for the windows laptop and the other for the iPad. The one for the iPad would then have to communicate with the 1810c to be sequenced in windows. I believe Windows based sequencers do not accept more than one Audio interface at one time. How do you go around this limitation?
The Focusrite should do a great job as the orange box in your diagram. You certainly don’t need to get any of the other ones you are referring to. It has MIDI in/out and 4 audio outs. All your MIDI and audio to and from the iPad would go through the Focusrite, the MIDI would go into your MIDI interface and the audio outs from the Focusrite would go to the corresponding audio inputs on the Presonus interface that is connected to the PC. Easy peasy. Think of the Focusrite as the audio/MIDI interface for the iPad and the Presonus as the audio interface for the PC and it should hopefully make sense.
You have everything you need to make the connection between the PC and iPad work the way you want it to.
“audio outs from the Focusrite would go to the corresponding audio inputs on the Presonus interface that is connected to the PC”
Thanks a lot @Mountain_Hamlet for your help. I missed an important issue in my original post and I can see you have already mentioned the issue in the quoted text.
As per my latest information from Focusrite and Presonus help centres, Windows based DAWs recognise only one Audio/MIDI interface at a time. Could this mean that the Focusrite and the Presonus cannot work together within the Studio One DAW in the PC? If so, how do I get the iPad synth MIDI through the Focusrite into the DAW?
Did you now understand how MIDI & audio will be routed?
Each device is using 1 Audio+MIDI interface:
1824c MIDI OUT >> 4i4 MIDI IN. (or 5x5 MIDI interface in your diagram)
4i4 AUDIO OUT >> 1824c AUDIO IN.
In Studio One, create a MIDI track and for its output select the 1824c MIDI OUT (or the 5x5 MIDI interface).
In Audiobus or AUM, create an audio track, insert the AU synth, and for its MIDI Source choose the 4i4.
Set the appropriate MIDI channels.
Now you can play the iPad synth from Studio One. And hear it as well.
This can be complicated to describe and ultimately understand, so for now get the Apple adapter, and connect it to your iPad and Focusrite 4i4. Things will make sense once you do that.
I'm no expert with this stuff, but this midi routing seems kind of unnecessary, and potentially, latency-increasing. These midi interfaces we seem to be talking about (two of them, one on each end) are converting USB midi to 5-pin regular MIDI, then converting 5-pin regular midi back to USB-midi.
Since we start with USB midi on iPad and go to USB midi on PC, more direct route would be to avoid the unnecessary midi interfaces. Just have a USB hub on iPad end and run USB cable from there into PC, or into USB hub connected to PC. Route midi entirely over USB, no USB-to-5pin-midi interfaces required. Or maybe I'm missing something about what OP wants. . . .
Are you sure this works on a windows pc? That would be nice.
Wow! Interesting things coming out now. So much to learn thanks to all your experts.
Ultimately though I feel ill first try out suggestions by @StudioES and @Mountain_Hamlet and then revert with observations. 🙏🏼
Audio and midi don't work over usb on Windows PC , the apps that used to work are abandoned or discontinued
I'm not sure what you mean by this, but as blanket statement it's clearly false. I used to hook up direct USB midi between my digital piano and my Windows PC all the time, as did and as do, probably, hundreds of thousands or millions of other people. This is not different from hooking up a Windows PC as "USB midi host" to any "USB midi device", which includes iPads.
EDIT: Well, just tried with a Windows PC and maybe USB to 5-pin and then back to USB is a good solution. Running my WIndows PC I plug in my digital piano USB cable and it's recognized and gives midi input to Pianoteq 6. Not so with iPad. It seems there may be a way to do it with the free TouchOSC bridge utility, but I doubt whether I'm going to press on further. . . For anyone interested, here's link to TouchOSC page: https://hexler.net/touchosc-mk1/manual/getting-started-midi And here's page with supposed info on "Using an iPAD as a MIDI Controller / Installing TouchOSC on Windows and MacOSX": https://forums.pluginguru.com/unify-live/using-an-ipad-as-a-midi-controller-installing-touchosc-on-windows-and-macosx/
But I stand corrected, I think. Amazingly, to get going with iPad as midi controller for Windows PC maybe it does indeed make sense to use a USB to 5-pin midi converter on one end and a 5-pin midi to USB on the other. Amazing.
To use the iPad as a MIDI controller the MIDI will work over Windows PC USB connections. You need to configure the app on the iPad properly to send MIDI out and then make the necessary connection selections on the PC in the programme you desire to use.
All cool. Let us know how you go. As @StudioES said it will probably make a lot more sense once you are physically connecting things together.
I mean single usb cable , which is what I understood from your post and it doesn't work on Windows , please don't insist.
5 din midi usb converters is a different story