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AUM saving issues

I am opening old projects in AUM, making little adjustments and then saving. I have just noticed however, that the usual “overwrite?” prompt that usually appears is not appearing, and the project is being saved as an entirely new project with the same name as the original.
Anyone know why this is happening? Anyone else noticed it? @j_liljedahl

Comments

  • Obviously not….

  • I’ve never seen that before… what iOS are you on?

    Let me do a quick test for you…

  • Just worked for me. I’m on iOS 16.6.1. When you go to save it again you do have to hit save session first, then It says Overwrite. Which actually just threw me off for a quick second…

  • @Poppadocrock said:
    Just worked for me. I’m on iOS 16.6.1. When you go to save it again you do have to hit save session first, then It says Overwrite. Which actually just threw me off for a quick second…

    Thanks for checking Pops. Yep, hitting “save session” is what I’ve been doing for months . Years, in fact, and then it asks “overwrite “, in blue text I believe, and I click it again to overwrite….but in the last couple of days it just stopped doing that. It’s weird that it’s not happening for anyone else. I’m still on 15.1 , 6th gen 2018 iPad

  • I should clarify; when I say “old” projects, I just mean existing projects…

  • Yea, exactly, I figured that’s what you meant. Basically opening up a previously saved session, making adjustments then trying to overwrite the save. I do this all the time.

    This is an odd one. It worked as it always does when I tested it earlier today. Maybe someone else has some insight, experienced something similar, or can chime in...

    I’m guessing you did the first step in any troubleshooting process… Turn off device, wait a few minutes, turn back on? Other than that I’m not sure. You could offload, not delete, but offload AUM by going into device settings, storage, find AUM, offload, and then reinstall it, to see if that helps. Offload keeps all your data, and only removes the app, so upon reinstall everything should be there. Just a thought. Good luck, let us know if you find a solution.

  • edited September 2023

    Are you definitely using the same folder to save it? Or no folder at all?

  • wimwim
    edited September 2023

    @Kashi said:
    I should clarify; when I say “old” projects, I just mean existing projects…

    I could be wrong, but it seems like I remember you posting about odd file system issues often. I don't have a clue what could be causing this issue though.

  • I can't reproduce the behaviour you're describing. Opening a session, and then tapping Save, asks to Overwrite as expected for me. Also, two files with the same name can't co-exist in the same folder, so that sounds very weird. How does it look if you view the AUM documents folder in the iOS Files app?

  • @j_liljedahl said:
    I can't reproduce the behaviour you're describing. Opening a session, and then tapping Save, asks to Overwrite as expected for me. Also, two files with the same name can't co-exist in the same folder, so that sounds very weird. How does it look if you view the AUM documents folder in the iOS Files app?

    Thanks for getting in touch. The problem persists, however I have realised that out of habit , I always keep the date in the project name - so you're absolutely right that there are not two projects with identical names in the same folder - my mistake. I have made a short video demonstrating the problem - can I email it to you?

    @Poppadocrock - thanks again for your help man, really appreciate it. Hopefully , now that @j_liljedahl is here we can sort it out!

    @wim You're not wrong at all - I have never, and will never understand the iOS files system. It is obtuse, user unfriendly, unintuitive, and it drives me fuckin' NUTS :'(

  • @Kashi said:

    @j_liljedahl said:
    I can't reproduce the behaviour you're describing. Opening a session, and then tapping Save, asks to Overwrite as expected for me. Also, two files with the same name can't co-exist in the same folder, so that sounds very weird. How does it look if you view the AUM documents folder in the iOS Files app?

    Thanks for getting in touch. The problem persists, however I have realised that out of habit , I always keep the date in the project name - so you're absolutely right that there are not two projects with identical names in the same folder - my mistake. I have made a short video demonstrating the problem - can I email it to you?

    @Poppadocrock - thanks again for your help man, really appreciate it. Hopefully , now that @j_liljedahl is here we can sort it out!

    @wim You're not wrong at all - I have never, and will never understand the iOS files system. It is obtuse, user unfriendly, unintuitive, and it drives me fuckin' NUTS :'(

    If you are changing the name with the new date when you go to save, you won't get an overwrite confirmation. That message only happens if a file with the same name already exists.

  • @espiegel123 said:

    @Kashi said:

    @j_liljedahl said:
    I can't reproduce the behaviour you're describing. Opening a session, and then tapping Save, asks to Overwrite as expected for me. Also, two files with the same name can't co-exist in the same folder, so that sounds very weird. How does it look if you view the AUM documents folder in the iOS Files app?

    Thanks for getting in touch. The problem persists, however I have realised that out of habit , I always keep the date in the project name - so you're absolutely right that there are not two projects with identical names in the same folder - my mistake. I have made a short video demonstrating the problem - can I email it to you?

    @Poppadocrock - thanks again for your help man, really appreciate it. Hopefully , now that @j_liljedahl is here we can sort it out!

    @wim You're not wrong at all - I have never, and will never understand the iOS files system. It is obtuse, user unfriendly, unintuitive, and it drives me fuckin' NUTS :'(

    If you are changing the name with the new date when you go to save, you won't get an overwrite confirmation. That message only happens if a file with the same name already exists.

    I am not changing the name. That's the whole point.
    I am opening projects, like I have done for several years, making slight changes, then clicking "save". Instead of the prompt to "overwrite", the project is saving as a different project, but with the current date. Meaning that every time I open that project and make a slight change, I have multiple projects in the same folder with the same name (but not exactly the same name because the date is different) .....which is a total mystery

  • see "ear wash"

  • I'm intrigued - I hear you @Kashi - if you try to delete a file via AUM does that still work?

    It's almost like each file created has Write Protect / Read Only set so that AUM has to create a new file - the bit that makes no sense to me is how come each is date time stamped - isn't that' a 'feature' of AUM saving coded by @j_liljedahl ?

    SO no I don't know what's going on but I know you need it sorting out. :s

  • edited September 2023

    @Kashi said:
    see "ear wash"

    Was the original name the one with the “.02” or the “:02”?

    EDIT. I see . The original file had a colon in it.

  • edited September 2023

    It looks like the colons may be causing the issue.

    If you use “.” Instead see if the behavior is what you expect.

  • @espiegel123 that's well spotted - I can't get AUM to even save a file with colons in a date - so where did they come from!??

  • @espiegel123 said:
    It looks like the colons may be causing the issue.

    If you use “.” Instead see if the behavior is what you expect.

    Good detective work! Except I can't understand why this would suddenly start happening? I'm doing the exact same thing I've been doing for 2 and a half years....So where have these colons suddenly appeared from?!

  • @danimal said:
    @espiegel123 that's well spotted - I can't get AUM to even save a file with colons in a date - so where did they come from!??

    Exactly!
    Thanks for your input folks - I appreciate it :)

  • Btw, I just tried this and I do get the overwrite dialog . Did you recently update the OS or change any OS settings?

  • @espiegel123 said:
    Btw, I just tried this and I do get the overwrite dialog . Did you recently update the OS or change any OS settings?

    Nope. Not changed anything
    Thanks for testing on your machine.

  • As a test, what happens if you save with a name that is just something like “test” with no punctuation then try to save again?

  • @espiegel123 said:
    As a test, what happens if you save with a name that is just something like “test” with no punctuation then try to save again?

    ok, just tried that, and "overwrite" is back. It functions as it should. So yes, possibly the punctuation is something to do with it. But that still doesn't explain why it's just suddenly started happening...

  • wimwim
    edited September 2023

    @Kashi said:
    ... But that still doesn't explain why it's just suddenly started happening...

    I expect the issue started for you with the most recent update. AUM replaces the ":" with "." in filenames, but didn't go back and rename previously saved sessions with the colon. When you go to re-save it's probably renaming (or tripping up renaming) the session.

    What's new (version 1.4.5 Sep 13 2023)

    • Add setting to show system status bar.

    • Add some close-buttons on various popup views.

    • Improve waiting for save at app termination.
    • Keep track of unmatched state when loading AUv3 MIDI mappings, and try to re-apply it if the available parameters changes.
    • Fix audio engine not restarting when coming back from background.
    • Show name of currently loading node when loading state.
    • Replace : with . in filenames since : is not allowed in some file systems.
    • Add Share button in Engine Info to copy info to pasteboard, for improved user support.
    • Workaround minor Ableton Link glitch, fixes FilePlayer not starting at some tempos.
    • Fix some alert popups appearance in combination with some iOS accessibility settings.
    • Various minor tweaks and improvements.
  • @wim said:

    @Kashi said:
    ... But that still doesn't explain why it's just suddenly started happening...

    I expect the issue started for you with the most recent update. AUM replaces the ":" with "." in filenames, but didn't go back and rename previously saved sessions with the colon. When you go to re-save it's probably renaming (or tripping up renaming) the session.

    What's new (version 1.4.5 Sep 13 2023)

    • Add setting to show system status bar.

    • Add some close-buttons on various popup views.

    • Improve waiting for save at app termination.
    • Keep track of unmatched state when loading AUv3 MIDI mappings, and try to re-apply it if the available parameters changes.
    • Fix audio engine not restarting when coming back from background.
    • Show name of currently loading node when loading state.
    • Replace : with . in filenames since : is not allowed in some file systems.
    • Add Share button in Engine Info to copy info to pasteboard, for improved user support.
    • Workaround minor Ableton Link glitch, fixes FilePlayer not starting at some tempos.
    • Fix some alert popups appearance in combination with some iOS accessibility settings.
    • Various minor tweaks and improvements.

    Ok, cool, that makes sense, thanks Wim. So is the reason that it's not happening for other people because I always leave the date in my project name?

  • wimwim
    edited September 2023

    @Kashi said:

    @wim said:

    @Kashi said:
    ... But that still doesn't explain why it's just suddenly started happening...

    I expect the issue started for you with the most recent update. AUM replaces the ":" with "." in filenames, but didn't go back and rename previously saved sessions with the colon. When you go to re-save it's probably renaming (or tripping up renaming) the session.

    What's new (version 1.4.5 Sep 13 2023)

    • Add setting to show system status bar.

    • Add some close-buttons on various popup views.

    • Improve waiting for save at app termination.
    • Keep track of unmatched state when loading AUv3 MIDI mappings, and try to re-apply it if the available parameters changes.
    • Fix audio engine not restarting when coming back from background.
    • Show name of currently loading node when loading state.
    • Replace : with . in filenames since : is not allowed in some file systems.
    • Add Share button in Engine Info to copy info to pasteboard, for improved user support.
    • Workaround minor Ableton Link glitch, fixes FilePlayer not starting at some tempos.
    • Fix some alert popups appearance in combination with some iOS accessibility settings.
    • Various minor tweaks and improvements.

    Ok, cool, that makes sense, thanks Wim. So is the reason that it's not happening for other people because I always leave the date in my project name?

    Maybe just nobody else noticed it. I'll confess I only skimmed your descriptions of the problem but here's what I think you may be seeing:

    1. Open an old session with a colon in the name due to the old date naming system.
    2. Make a change and save it. It is saved but with dots in the name replacing the commas. No overwrite prompt occurs because it's not overwriting the old file. You'll notice that the old one still exists along with the new one.
    3. Open the new file with the dots in the name, make a change, and save it. You get the overwrite prompt and its saved as expected.
    4. Open the original file again, make a change, and save it. You get the overwrite prompt but instead of overwriting the old file with the colon in it, it overwrites the new one with the dot in it.

    The key to understanding is AUM isn't renaming the original file with the colons in it. It's saving a copy with the new naming scheme.

    So, things get confusing if you're not carefully watching which file you open. Say you made a change in the original file and saved it, resulting in a new file with dots in it. Now you open the new file and make some further changes and save it. It overwrites the new file. But, not noticing it you then open the original file. The recent changes won't be there. If you now save it and overwrite, you overwrite the new file, thus losing the original changes.

    If you sort your file list by last saved date you're less likely to notice what's going on because the original will be further down the list.

    If you sort by name it's easy for it to appear that you have duplicate file names because the difference between the dot and colon isn't easy to spot unless you're looking for it. If you sort your file list by name it would probably be a good idea to delete the original file after the new one is saved with the colon/dot replacement.

  • tagging @j_liljedahl in case there's a better way to handle this. I think it's best the way it is now but can see why it could lead to confusion and lost changes.

    Maybe it's best to save the file, then rename it rather than saving a new file and leaving the old one in place? I can see how there could be unexpected ramifications to that as well.

  • Just to confirm I've gone back to sessions saved with colons in the date (pre last AUM update) and I have the same behaviour as @Kashi - so yes, only you've noticed this so far - good find all round and no real harm done eh!

  • @wim - you're a star! Thanks so much for taking the time to help out. It does seem that you've nailed it.
    And thanks @danimal for your input too :)

  • @wim said:
    tagging @j_liljedahl in case there's a better way to handle this. I think it's best the way it is now but can see why it could lead to confusion and lost changes.

    Maybe it's best to save the file, then rename it rather than saving a new file and leaving the old one in place? I can see how there could be unexpected ramifications to that as well.

    Very good detective work :)

    This is a good example of how a seemingly small change can have bigger impacts. A user reported that he was having issues copying/backing up AUM files because the filesystem of the backup didn't support ":" in the filenames. (Actually macOS doesn't support ":" either, just try to rename a file in Finder and add a ":" and it will complain..)

    So I made any save/rename dialogs replace colons with dots. I wouldn't want to automatically rename already existing user files. But I didn't think of the fact that since the default session names did contain colons, it would lead to this confusion when re-saving old sessions.

    I'm not sure what's best to do now. Maybe it would help to pop up a warning that some characters will be replaced with dots when it happens, so at least the user realizes that the given filename is not what will actually be used.

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