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App to detect time signatures
Is there an app that I can play a riff into and it will tell me the time signature?
Yes, I have asked about this before but it has been quite some time and no luck yet.
For whatever reason I naturally do not write in 4/4. I may think that I do but it does not work. I tend to write in multiple time signatures sometimes even changing the time signature mid riff.
My brain does not comprehend time signatures, I have tried… for years. Many have tried to explain it to me. I just do not get it, they may as well speak in multiple foreign languages. I do not understand how or why. It must be a problem with my brain.
Sometimes I get lucky and it is really in 4/4 I can’t tell why or how but it happens sometimes, other times it is 5/4 or 3/4 or some time signature that does not exist in my daw. It is always guess work after the fact. Imagine how frustrating that is, for a musician that’s has music in movies, been on multiple tours with bands performing material that I have written.
I can play to a click or metronome but often it feels stilted and wrong to me when I want a bit of funk or swing.
I got around this by recording the songs live with my drummer ( I play keys) and creating a “Click track” manually based on that performance .
That click and the original keyboard track is what was used as the basis to record all the other instruments including the drums.
It would be very helpful for me to know the time signature of a riff for:
- Recording
- Editing
- Communicating that time signature to other musicians
Also it there a way to have some funk and swing in a time signature?
Comments
There's no new software that I know of since the last time you asked.
Have you tried "ear training/aural theory"? I had to go through ear training/aural theory in uni and I made it through just fine. Helped mold the musician I am today.
That said, your brain is fine mate. You may simply have a learning disability, which means those who have tried to teach you may not have known how properly to teach you. You may benefit from being evaluated by a psychologist if you haven't been diagnosed yet.
I say this as someone who has Autism and ADHD and had to be taught in specific ways.
Got any musical output I can listen to on Spotify and Youtube?
Yeah I haven't used a metronome while learning new music to play on a piano in years. It's just too strict and precise and doesn't allow for the music to flow naturally.
That's a pretty cool workaround mate.
Just by playing by feel rather than using a metronome. As I said, I haven't used a metronome in years.
Odd question for you...do you know how to notate music yet?
I’m not aware of anything, but I would imagine it’s hard to detect time signatures with software when it changes during a piece of music. Even two people listening to the same piece of music can disagree on the time signature(s) used during a piece of music.
Maybe people can post tips here that help them determine time signature? What instruments do you play? That might be helpful to know.
No, I have not and it is a good suggestion I will look into this
I am friggin nuts but that is my own diagnosis, I have never been officially evaluated in my adult life but I suspect there is some thing going on. I can build, draw, paint, sculpt, play music, sing, cook, read and write pretty well, but I cannot dance and could not pass basic algebra!
Yes:
In that first video is an example of what I did as a work around for me not knowing time signatures, creating a manual click based on a live recording. The keys are on the the left track of an iPod nano and the click on the right both go to the drummer and the just the keys to front of house. I did this so I could be more of a “front man” and not stay trapped behind keys.
We had songs in The movies: “Turbulence 3, Heavy Metal” and the Remake of “Night of the Demons”
In the second video there is the keyboard melody line that is in 3/4 while the rest of the band is playing in 4/4. I did not know that until someone else told me about it. I do stuff like that all the time by accident and it makes figuring out time signatures that much harder
Yes I agree. I would write and we would rehearse the songs but when it came time for me to create a backing track for live performances (Oxymoron, I know!) I would search for different time signatures in the DAW that fit the song, often having to change time signatures multiple times to make it work. It still was not 100% and yes, completely lost the flow of the song
Which is why I came up with the work around
Thanks
I just may have to continue that way,
Sort of, I can read and write notes in bass and treble clef but, slowly and I just bypass the time signature, I see it, I can read it and repeat it out loud but in all honesty I do not comprehend it.
Thank you for your response
Not possible.
I am hoping for a time signature version of Shazam!
I am a hack keyboardist and vocalist
And yes yes yes!!!!! I have brought a riff into rehearsal that is cool and has a groove and I asked the band member’s what time signature it is in and they could not agree and after a half an hour of back and forth I gave up and shelved the riff (I still secretly play it for my own enjoyment)
It sounds like you need to find musicians that understand your music. Knowing the time signature won’t solve the problem.
If you are able to consistently play along with the rhythms you come up with, you need to find people that hear what you hear.
Try looking at some sheet music from some Prog Rock bands, and try to follow along while listening.
Try songs that change tempo/time signatures so you get a better feel of how it works.
I learned a lot trying this with La Villa Strangiato by Rush. It changes time signatures often.
That is probably more important. There are plenty of musicians who can just play but know nothing about theory. Knowing the time signature(s) in a piece of music isn’t a prerequisite to being able to play it.
And even knowing the time signature won’t always help someone feel an idiosyncratic rhythm.
Two stories to illustrate.
There is a Milton Nasciemento song “Ponta de Areia” that he recorded with Wayne Shorter and some of the best musicians on the planet. If you listen to it, it sounds simple and straightforward… try to count it out and your head may explode. The recording is great but I read an interview where he explained that someone had distributed a chart to the musicians and that none of them could play it right because even though the song is in 9…it doesn’t feel right if you simply count it. He had to convince them to listen ignore the chart and pick the rhythm up from him.
Another story. Snarky Puppy bandleader talked about how even though everyone in the band can read charts, he never gives charts out before they learn songs. He sends out home demos of the parts so that the musicians pick up the feel directly. He mentioned that there is one song where the groove is a six against four thing. And when they hot together to start rehearsing, he found that have the band heard it in four and the other half in six. They all played the same groove and it felt right but all had a different idea of how to express that time.
But it is important if you are trying to sequence anything that goes with your live players, like the backing tracks mentioned.
It’s not prerequisite to playing a piece, but it is critical in trying to write it down or sequence it, or even communicating musical ideas between people.
Yes, that’s true. Not sure how to progress with that then if entering into a sequencer is required - you really do need to know something about recognizing time signatures to do that.
Hence my issue. I did see an app that Detects the Key and BPM So I was feeling hopeful
Maybe AI is not up to it yet, especially considering that it’s somewhat of an art rather than a science.
You should persevere with try to learn to do it yourself though. Perhaps you could get people who haven’t explained it to you before to try - maybe someone will hit on the explanation you need.
I try to tap it out on an app that offers that, you can get a sense of the time signature by tapping the beats, while counting. Tap and Count like this… One and two and three and four and… It’s not always easy or an exact science but most songs fall into only a few times. I tap and count it can’t catch it look it up, lol. I’m not certain but I’m pretty sure… Songs can be written in one time signature but easily fit into or be played in other time signatures, as long as they have the same beats per bar. ie 2/4 and 4/4, or 3/4 and 6/4. Maybe someone could chime in on this…
Edit I posted this before reading your entire post.
Heck maybe that’s a blessing in disguise. To me, if it works, it works.
Just thinking out loud but you can Play your riffs along with a metronome app, take a guess to get close, adjust the time, see if it fits. If not try another.
That is what I do but… I often write a riff that Changes time signatures or must be in between some obscure thing like an 11/7 or 7/4