Audiobus: Use your music apps together.
What is Audiobus? — Audiobus is an award-winning music app for iPhone and iPad which lets you use your other music apps together. Chain effects on your favourite synth, run the output of apps or Audio Units into an app like GarageBand or Loopy, or select a different audio interface output for each app. Route MIDI between apps — drive a synth from a MIDI sequencer, or add an arpeggiator to your MIDI keyboard — or sync with your external MIDI gear. And control your entire setup from a MIDI controller.
Download on the App StoreAudiobus is the app that makes the rest of your setup better.
Comments
This is the most exciting aspect to me - do you have any pointers to vids that show how far this can be pushed sonically? We really need a top class physical modeling synth on iOS with an interace that lays that all open in the same elegant way that something like Plasmonic does on desktop (so I'm excluding Geoshred here, however capable it might be, because deep tweaking, while possible, involves unenjoyable menu diving)
I may be the only one here, but I'm waiting for the iOS version only for the harpsichord. It sounds incredible.
Oh yes. Pianoteq, my favourite desktop plugin of all time, for iOS? Where there is nothing even close to it, as it stands?
Squee!
That’s fair. I don’t currently own a laptop. iPads (and iPhone) and Mac desktop. So for me, it’s an insta-purchase. Not many of those come up (for me).
Deals, I don’t know. Hopefully..?
Seems like the majority of people in this forum are into generative music, using sequencers and various other apps to create midi streams that they feed to synth apps. No keyboards involved at all. Piano apps like Ravenscroft and Pure Piano are among the targets they use for this generated music. Many of these people would love to have an (arguably) better sounding and (certainly) more flexible alternative on iOS, like Pianoteq.
I’m not sure Ravenscroft and even PurePiano are not “close” to Pianoteq. Certainly they are not as flexible. I’ve demoed Pianoteq on a laptop. I was not blown away, but I’d definitely like to try an iOS version. Here’s what I think is one of my best tracks re Ravenscroft tone. How does it compare for you with Pianoteq?
I think it is a false generalization that most folks here follow a generative prescription. I certainly don’t. Also, a very small percentage of members are regular creation contributors, so we don’t know what they are doing.. Many that do post are non generative like @richardyot, @Paulieworld @Edward_Alexander @GeoTony @JanKun @pbelgium @DavidEnglish @jo92346 @Lady_App_titude @Daveypoo @barabajagal @jwmmakerofmusic @Svetlovska @barabajagal @McD and quite a few more.
At most there is a sub-section of people here that are into generative music, but also plenty of songwriters, composers, performers, and musicians of all stripes. I don't think you can really say the majority here are into generative stuff.
I swing both ways myself 😊
On a more serious note I’m not really a great collector of apps so Ravenscroft, NUMA, Scaler 2 etc are fine for what I want but then again when I’m playing I use GeoShred so perhaps lose some of the nuances of a ‘real’ keyboard.
This is probably the best I’ve managed with a combination of GS and R275…
I’m another Pianoteq fan. But I haven’t really made comparisons with sampled pianos. I haven’t used the most recent and advanced of the sample based instruments. The ones here (@LinearLineman, @GeoTony and others) all sound great to me.
It seems like the big advantage to Pianoteq is the small footprint and the ability for continual upgrades to the modeling engine and also the amazing ability to modify and create an apparently endless supply of piano models. Of course you’re paying extra for some of the models they produce but they’re apparently good enough that the original companies like Steinway allow them to use their names on the instruments.
I like the historical pianos too; many of them are included with the price.
Back in the early ‘90s I worked for a CD Rom publisher. ( remember that quaint enterprise? There was a brief period before the internet took hold when this was the best way to distribute digital stuff ).
We began a project to sample the historic instruments of the Schubert Club collection here in Saint Paul. Back then there were limitations on the size of samples of course. It was a laborious and educational job for me. Unfortunately the the company changed direction before the discs came out.
Among the pianos and forte pianos I sampled was a real Conrad Graf. Now on Pianoteq I can just dial in a Graf that sounds pretty dang good.
Here’s a piece I constructed, partly using iOS generative help and partly with actual keyboard playing. @hes - I like to use both. I wouldn’t enjoy just having a generative app crank everything out by itself; where’s the fun in that? But I think they can help bring up possibilities that give me something to build on.
This piece uses the Pianoteq Graf
Is that PianoTeq @Stochastically? Sounds excellent!
Both great tracks @LinearLineman and @Stochastically , obviously very different in style which makes it difficult to compare the sounds.
They are obviously different but in situations like this, like most things in life, there is no better or worse , they are just different.!
You pay your money and take your choice 😊
+1
Yeah, as others have pointed out, I should of course have said merely 'many' and not 'majority'. No need for me to exaggerate things; Pianoteq makes sense on iPad for lots of people, not just those into generative music. I'm into piano as primary instrument, not generative music, and I like the idea of having Pianoteq on my iPad/iPhone rather than my laptop. Lots of reasons, including: extra mobility, extra flexibility, (imo) better sound than iOS alternatives, better playability (response to keyboard playing simply feels better), and something that as far as I'm aware no other piano on iOS has, ability to properly respond to a continuous sustain pedal.
Of course it all depends on Pianoteq on iOS being available for a reasonable price. I trust Modarrt will make sure this is the case, they have one of the best licensing schemes I've come across for desktop/laptop apps: have up to 3 active installs of Pianoteq across whatever mix of Windows/Linux/MacOS machines you want.
Cheers mate.
I did mess around with generative or semi-generative when experimenting with Ambient back in the summer, my favourite MIDI plugin being Ioniarics.
Thanks guys; it's the pianoteq Graf here; it's not a full-bodied sound like a modern piano; but I thought it fits the 19th century vibe of my piece.
I still have the original samples I recorded back then. The only playable version I made was in the format for Kurzweil sampler/synth K2000.
I wanted to follow up after having played around with the Classical Guitar add-on for a while (and a little back & forth with Modartt).
I mentioned the pluck sound being fingernail-based, but there is a "THUMB" mode which changes the attack to a softer one.
There is a preset called "a la Piano" which allows the bass to go way down. However, this preset does not have "thumb mode" so the only thing that can be done is to soften the attack via the controls.
I don't think it has been mentioned that the Standard and Pro versions have this Layer/Morph mode that allows you to make hybrids that crossfade/morph (I realize those are two different things, but it does both) between two completely different instruments/settings. Create organic hybrids that drip with realism.
Agreed. Pianoteq is fantastic, super flexible and very compact so it stands on its own.
Knowing many commercially available piano sample libraries, I cannot confirm that Pianoteq generally sounds better though. It's just different.
If you have an iPad that is constantly complaining about a lack of storage, you want apps that use math over disk streaming. My Staffpad install is over 3OGB… so I bought a 1TB iPad. Spending more for modeling apps starts to make sense for the overall spend. And the real payoff is customization and the end of “one trick pony” sample-based engine apps. Probably 5 years to get more cheap physical modelers in the store but prices will likely re-adjust between desktop and mobile a bit. Sunk costs for development is impossible to ignore. Physical modelers might be beyond the reach of the lone wolf developer unless Apple throws one into the core set of API’s and developers just provide sources to emulate and a GUI… that would be a nice update. If it’s needed for VR we might get there. It’s like the difference between video play back and CGI but for audio reality: virtual audio reality.
@McD isn't that always some sort of compromise? Ram vs CPU usage? In my last piano piece, the piano patch in audiolayer is less than 200MB, but it isn't supposed to sound like a real clean pretty piano. My biggest audiolayer piano patch is 6GB. both barely use any CPU power. Meaning more power left for other instruments and for the reverbs (those damn things are CPU hogs).
I guess for piano solo, the CPU vs RAM thing wouldn't really matter. What about in a full orchestration? and how customizable is pianoteq?
@jo92346 Your recent projects validate that a user can get extremely good results with NanoStudio’s sound engine for running a lot of parallel disk streaming instruments. @ScottVanZandt showed the way for this approach before he just committed to Staffpad for his “composing on mass transit” needs.
The trade off between CPU and RAM forgets about another resource: system buses for transporting data. These buses are used to schedule block copies of data between storage and the audio output buffers. They have limits and dozens of parallel instruments using them in a DAW like AUM has scheduling contention and AUv3 apps like iSymphonic just fall over and are given a “forced termination” by IOS when their backlog of data exceeds 340MB. Now, NanoStudio is using it’s own rules about system memory and is NOT an AUv3 app so it can queue up GB’s of data to be slipped into the Audio Output buffers at just the right moment to avoid the dreaded “clicks and pops” of an AUv3 app struggling to stay in it’s lane for memory consumption.
StaffPad and the other “orchestral” simulators like Musescore, Notion, etc are also not AUv3’s and they can dominate system bus usage and load up GB’s of system “ram” (Note: on an SSD based IOS device the physical difference between “storage” and system RAM is really just a distinction of “address” or RAM neighborhood and NOT performance specs… (of course, there are these little high speed caches for the apps to keep their hot pages in).
Anyway, data management is a huge factor to provide an orchestra and anyone wanting to create real film style projects will study at your feet: the work speaks for itself:
Made with:
NanoStudio 2 (a DAW),
AudioLayer )a Disk-streaming Sample recording and playback engine
Neon Audio Editor to patch the Audio Recording hole in NS2
Even Staffpad can’t touch this level of quality in this genre of IOS Music Production. But 3 apps won’t get you there without the additional engineering skills required to build “instruments” in Nanostudio and AudioLayer.
NOTE: @jo92346 is not averse to using some excellent desktop products (like SoundPaint) to get even better “musicians” on his projects. SoundPaint instruments sell for ~$30 which I think could work for IOS products based on SWAM apps which sell for $30 on IOS but also have sales events and some bundles.
Anyway, image a physical modeling app that accepts sample input of a recording and generates a model that simulates that sound. After the engine is developed a company like SWAM just keeps feeding it inputs and tweaking the model. With the right user controls we could tweak up a storm. Some IOS musicians just enjoy thr tweaking and rarely share a finished good… some just share their presets of tweaked “instruments”. This type of hardware emulator is taking over the world of live “guitar amp” modelers. Can the physical “modeler” be far behind for general purpose “sample” to model use cases? I hope not. M1, M2, etc.
“Software is eating the physical world”… there is a musical “metaverse” I’d like to live in on an iPad… maybe I already do. OK. I do.
I must be one of the few that finds pianoteq impressive programming feat but disappointing as an actual piano. I haven’t yet heard a pianoteq demo where I thought it sounded as good as a high-quality sample-based instrument in a setting where the piano is by itself.
@mcd wow that is some technical knowledge! that makes things a little bit clearer.
seems I made the right choice with NS2 and audiolayer for my kind of music.
So, if I understand correctly, I could use a modeled instrument in NS2 without having to compromise much on performances? and having the advantage of almost infinite tweaking options for the instrument?
Also, > @McD said:
does that mean I could just leave my patches nd samples on my external SSD instead of copying them in the iPad?
Have you tried doing a string section made with SWAM Violin, Viola, Cello, Contrabass? I have in AUM and it’s nothing like
An orchestra but more like a quartet (there are 2 violin instances). It would never be as good as your string sections which I would love to know more about? Did you sample the better AUv3 apps into AudioLayer or NS2 instruments?
No. I confused the message by using SSD to describe iPad “RAM”… iPad RAM is indeed “a Solid State Drive” but it has this massive throughput system bus because it’s baked into the iPad Chip. An external SSD device is connected via a limited USB bus into some I/O section of the iPad chip set with it’s own set of buffers on the system buses. So, samples “in the iPad” are given much better support for getting to the audio output buffers. Samples outside the box require a series of buffer transfers and much slower busses at various points.
I always have to Google iPad “RAM” to find out how much of the quoted Storage is dedicated to IOS “RAM” used for running the Operating Sytem code and it’s data buffers, apps and their data buffers.
I think my 1TB iPad has 8GB of “RAM”…. Google, google… HINT: Go to settings -> General -> About -? Model (then tap the displayed model to get the simpler A2379 label and Google for “A2379 RAM”. Aha! With the 1TB I get 16GB of RAM. Life is good with 16GB of “RAM” and still having 1,008 for app/data storage. NOTE: I was dying with a 256GB iPad and I have everything installed and I’m using 300GB… I over spec’ed but at some point I’ll use it all. Right? I should download GB’s of videos… Put my entire collection of burned DVD’s on my iPad just for grins. Does 4K Video look better on an iPad than streaming video?
Oh 😥 ok. Was planning on buying a new iPad anyway
I agree. There are many of us who actively dislike the sound, particularly in the upper registers. They said, I was surprised to try it the demo recently and found myself enjoying playing it for hours. How can that be?? I still dislike the sound, yet I find it inspiring to play! I still haven't fully reconciled that conundrum, but it seems true for me.
@orand your comment about the upper register might have to do with the fact that our ears got trained for the sampled libraries and some weird mastering habits in recent decades for piano pieces. Maybe? or the presets?
I just listened to the demos on the pianoteq website. For sure what they call a Steinway model D doesn't sound like a D. Even the free Soundpaint Steinway D sounds more like a D.
But it doesn't sound bad at all. The upper register wouldn't be what I'd complain about: it is quite natural to me. What sounds sometimes a bit weird is the sustained low register notes, not always but sometimes there is some strange artifact that sounds a bit like natural time stretch. More generally, the sostuneto pedal could sound better.
The resonances sound quite good, the dynamic is also realistic, and the way notes overlap and die in fast play is definitely better than most sampled libraries.
Two demos are especially impressive: the Chopin Fantasy in F minor Op49 https://www.modartt.com/data/audio/pianoteq8/modeld/Chopin - Fantasy in F Minor, Op. 49 - Andrej Jussow.mp3
and the Nocturne OP48-2
https://www.modartt.com/data/audio/pianoteq8/modeld/Chopin - Nocturne Op. 48 No. 2 - Phil Best.mp3
The other demos are less impressive.
Now, considering the price they ask for the pro version, I'd rather stay with my samples.
iPad RAM is actual RAM. SSD is not as fast, not accessed the same way, and not available in units as small as the 2 - 4 GB you find in most iPads.
Just to update: In last November, I asked the support for the iOS version and they say "6 months from now".
Try Genuine Sounds Volume 1 for iPad. It combines modeling with some sampling to let you play the piano’s. I also own Pure Piano, Pure Upright, Ravenscroft 275 and so on. These are all really great. Imho, Genuine Sounds volume 1 is (for now) the best sounding piano you can find in the App Store. It’s made by GSi. PianoTEQ 8 will be an instant buy for me. It will release as early as this month (March 2023), maybe next month, probabilities are high for a March release. It works fine with A12 and up. It is the same quality as the desktop version and also can be used alongside PianoTEQ 8 on your desktop/laptop. As far as I know, it’s AUv3, not AUv2 like Mac. So the price is relative high. But that’s something I am already used to when it comes to anything music making and production related apps for my iPad Pro.
Source? Why do you have theses informations?