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People getting sidetracked

edited September 22 in Recent Events
This discussion was created from comments split from: Vintage Rack by Igor Vasiliev has been released!.
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Comments

  • @Stuntman_mike said:
    Kinda, although still spent less than $50 for everything. I can blow just as much buying a meal for my family at Chick-fil-A 😂

    …and buying this has the added bonus of not supporting a homophobic CEO…

  • @michael_m said:

    @Stuntman_mike said:
    Kinda, although still spent less than $50 for everything. I can blow just as much buying a meal for my family at Chick-fil-A 😂

    …and buying this has the added bonus of not supporting a homophobic CEO…

    👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼

  • @michael_m said:

    @Stuntman_mike said:
    Kinda, although still spent less than $50 for everything. I can blow just as much buying a meal for my family at Chick-fil-A 😂

    …and buying this has the added bonus of not supporting a homophobic CEO…

    No high fructose corn syrup nor sodium as well 😂

  • What is chick fil a? Is it like kfc?

  • @sevenape said:
    What is chick fil a? Is it like kfc?

    Sort of, chick fi la is more of a chicken sandwich restaurant. KFC serves a bucket of chicken along with sandwich options and more.

  • This is totally off topic and I'd like to hear what these effects actually sound like!

    But

    My many gay friends are VERY conflicted about Chick-fil-a. It sells THE best fast-food chicken sandwich by some margin, and apparently the company has altered its philanthropy to exclude anti-LGBTQ organizations.

  • @ExAsperis99 said:
    This is totally off topic and I'd like to hear what these effects actually sound like!

    But

    My many gay friends are VERY conflicted about Chick-fil-a. It sells THE best fast-food chicken sandwich by some margin, and apparently the company has altered its philanthropy to exclude anti-LGBTQ organizations.

    I can’t stop thinking about the impact of all the small little homophobic actions that companies, and people, who have these sort of policies commit. How many people not hired, or fired, how many contracts not met, proposals not gone through…. The risk is too large imo to not think of them as public enemies.

  • edited September 21

    @magnusovi said:

    @ExAsperis99 said:
    This is totally off topic and I'd like to hear what these effects actually sound like!

    But

    My many gay friends are VERY conflicted about Chick-fil-a. It sells THE best fast-food chicken sandwich by some margin, and apparently the company has altered its philanthropy to exclude anti-LGBTQ organizations.

    I can’t stop thinking about the impact of all the small little homophobic actions that companies, and people, who have these sort of policies commit. How many people not hired, or fired, how many contracts not met, proposals not gone through…. The risk is too large imo to not think of them as public enemies.

    Yeah, this is disturbing.
    Thank you all for educating me.
    For Chick fi la to blatantly support groups that are against a community of people is messed up. 👎🏼
    Where’s the love in that?
    This is a “if you don’t have something nice to say, why say anything at all” situations.

  • For those in the states, you can get your Chick-Fil-A chicken nuggets guilt-free at Costco. Just Bare is the brand. They taste EXACTLY like the restaurant’s minus the oil they fry them in. I always keep some on hand for those lazy air fryer nights.

  • @oat_phipps said:
    For those in the states, you can get your Chick-Fil-A chicken nuggets guilt-free at Costco. Just Bare is the brand. They taste EXACTLY like the restaurant’s minus the oil they fry them in. I always keep some on hand for those lazy air fryer nights.

    And just in case you’re wondering, they fry in peanut oil if you’re trying to replicate.

  • @oat_phipps said:
    For those in the states, you can get your Chick-Fil-A chicken nuggets guilt-free at Costco. Just Bare is the brand. They taste EXACTLY like the restaurant’s minus the oil they fry them in. I always keep some on hand for those lazy air fryer nights.

    Oh wow!

  • edited September 21

    @michael_m said:

    @Stuntman_mike said:
    Kinda, although still spent less than $50 for everything. I can blow just as much buying a meal for my family at Chick-fil-A 😂

    …and buying this has the added bonus of not supporting a homophobic CEO…

    Do not continue to throw this thread off topic. Start an Off Topic thread if you want to get political.

  • @oat_phipps said:
    For those in the states, you can get your Chick-Fil-A chicken nuggets guilt-free at Costco. Just Bare is the brand. They taste EXACTLY like the restaurant’s minus the oil they fry them in. I always keep some on hand for those lazy air fryer nights.

    Folks, get back on topic. If people want to discuss politics and restaurants, please do it in a new thread.

  • edited September 22

    @magnusovi said:
    I can’t stop thinking about the impact of all the small little homophobic actions that companies, and people, who have these sort of policies commit. How many people not hired, or fired, how many contracts not met, proposals not gone through…. The risk is too large imo to not think of them as public enemies.

    Very convenient (and dangerous) to label anyone with a political view not the same as you as "public enemies".

    The far left do it, as does the far right.

    Not a good direction for society to go.

  • edited September 22

    @Simon said:

    @magnusovi said:
    I can’t stop thinking about the impact of all the small little homophobic actions that companies, and people, who have these sort of policies commit. How many people not hired, or fired, how many contracts not met, proposals not gone through…. The risk is too large imo to not think of them as public enemies.

    Very convenient (and dangerous) to label anyone with a political view not the same as you as "public enemies".

    The far left do it, as does the far right.

    Not a good direction for society to go.

    What is very convenient is phrasing the situation the way you just did. Homophobic people who think that other human beings are something disgusting that needs to be hidden in their closets do not just have different views. Those are the people who are my enemies, and should be yours too.
    This is not the Tucker Carlson show where we babble about some made up left and right in America, its the real world where real and innocent people are being hurt, harassed, and forced to justify their existence.

  • @magnusovi said:
    What is very convenient is phrasing the situation the way you just did. Homophobic people who think that other human beings are something disgusting that needs to be hidden in their closets do not just have different views. Those are the people who are my enemies, and should be yours too.

    LOL. You are as intolerant as the people you are criticising.

  • @Simon said:

    @magnusovi said:
    What is very convenient is phrasing the situation the way you just did. Homophobic people who think that other human beings are something disgusting that needs to be hidden in their closets do not just have different views. Those are the people who are my enemies, and should be yours too.

    LOL. You are as intolerant as the people you are criticising.

    I think I touched a nerve man. But yeah, some things should not be tolerated.

  • It's definitely worth knowing and informing people. Then let people make up their own mind. I would probably avoid such an establishment knowing this, if others choose not to (eg their religious or other beliefs might make them think that being gay is an aberration) , I would certainly argue with them , but ultimately it's their decision whether to go there or not.

    Anyway.... Back to Vintage Rack.... Curious what people who've actually bought it think of it so far?

  • Sorry everyone, this will be my last “political” comment on this thread but I am forced to speak up when the issues I think are so very serious are trivialized the way it has been here. In addition I should clarify once again that people can have different opinions, that is fine. However, attributing the difficulties that people in the lgbtq community go through, as well as other disadvantaged groups, to differences of opinions is disingenuous and quite frankly, if we are going to talk about danger, quite dangerous.

  • Being intolerant of intolerant bigots is not bigotry.

    Are there actually people here that think homophobia isn't despicable, that think it is unfair and intolerant to call homphobia despicable?

  • @magnusovi said:
    Sorry everyone, this will be my last “political” comment on this thread but I am forced to speak up when the issues I think are so very serious are trivialized the way it has been here. In addition I should clarify once again that people can have different opinions, that is fine. However, attributing the difficulties that people in the lgbtq community go through, as well as other disadvantaged groups, to differences of opinions is disingenuous and quite frankly, if we are going to talk about danger, quite dangerous.

    If anyone is guilty of disingenuous trivializing it is you.

    The world is more complicated than you present it. People all have different opinions and you might not share some of them.

    Trying to get people to change their mind about social issues is difficult and takes time. Attacking them and calling them names like "public enemies" won't do it. If anything, it makes the other side dig in deeper.

  • @magnusovi said:
    Sorry everyone, this will be my last “political” comment on this thread but I am forced to speak up when the issues I think are so very serious are trivialized the way it has been here. In addition I should clarify once again that people can have different opinions, that is fine. However, attributing the difficulties that people in the lgbtq community go through, as well as other disadvantaged groups, to differences of opinions is disingenuous and quite frankly, if we are going to talk about danger, quite dangerous.

    I totally agree with you and anyone who tries to use semantics or whatever to justify hate against a certain portion of people ( sexuality has nothing to do with politics by the way) or who believes that one set of people is better than another is not only wrong but dangerous.

    What’s interesting is that people with extreme right views always claim in their arguments they are moderate. They are not.

  • Oh Simon, not again.

  • edited September 22

    Thank you Michael for brilliantly creating this offshoot thread, and patiently dealing with my off topic comments.

    @Simon said:

    @magnusovi said:
    Sorry everyone, this will be my last “political” comment on this thread but I am forced to speak up when the issues I think are so very serious are trivialized the way it has been here. In addition I should clarify once again that people can have different opinions, that is fine. However, attributing the difficulties that people in the lgbtq community go through, as well as other disadvantaged groups, to differences of opinions is disingenuous and quite frankly, if we are going to talk about danger, quite dangerous.

    If anyone is guilty of disingenuous trivializing it is you.

    The world is more complicated than you present it. People all have different opinions and you might not share some of them.

    Trying to get people to change their mind about social issues is difficult and takes time. Attacking them and calling them names like "public enemies" won't do it. If anything, it makes the other side dig in deeper.

    I believe you are misunderstanding me, and I partly blame myself for it. The harsh tone and seemingly combative attitude are normally not adequate for debate. But I am not here to debate nor to persuade. My hope is simply to expose the dangers of certain ideologies and how they work, so that some people who perhaps are not aware of it now are.

    @espiegel123 said:
    Being intolerant of intolerant bigots is not bigotry.

    Are there actually people here that think homophobia isn't despicable, that think it is unfair and intolerant to call homphobia despicable?

    I truthfully would hope not man. Some things are not too complex. People’s right to freedom and peace is not one of them.

    @sevenape said:

    @magnusovi said:
    Sorry everyone, this will be my last “political” comment on this thread but I am forced to speak up when the issues I think are so very serious are trivialized the way it has been here. In addition I should clarify once again that people can have different opinions, that is fine. However, attributing the difficulties that people in the lgbtq community go through, as well as other disadvantaged groups, to differences of opinions is disingenuous and quite frankly, if we are going to talk about danger, quite dangerous.

    I totally agree with you and anyone who tries to use semantics or whatever to justify hate against a certain portion of people ( sexuality has nothing to do with politics by the way) or who believes that one set of people is better than another is not only wrong but dangerous.

    What’s interesting is that people with extreme right views always claim in their arguments they are moderate. They are not.

    Yeah. And taking a firm stand against it is the right thing. It’s baffling how some people flip the script and try to make the good guys the bad guys, and very successfully too!

    I blame the media for this, and politicians of course. They have created this false paradigm where there is this dichotomy of positions, left or right, that is so easy for some to just kinda hallucinate and navigate their lives through.

  • There is a reason why racism, homophobia, and other forms of bigotry are not tolerated in liberal democracies.

  • edited September 22

    @magnusovi said:

    @Simon said:

    @magnusovi said:
    I can’t stop thinking about the impact of all the small little homophobic actions that companies, and people, who have these sort of policies commit. How many people not hired, or fired, how many contracts not met, proposals not gone through…. The risk is too large imo to not think of them as public enemies.

    Very convenient (and dangerous) to label anyone with a political view not the same as you as "public enemies".

    The far left do it, as does the far right.

    Not a good direction for society to go.

    What is very convenient is phrasing the situation the way you just did. Homophobic people who think that other human beings are something disgusting that needs to be hidden in their closets do not just have different views. Those are the people who are my enemies, and should be yours too.
    This is not the Tucker Carlson show where we babble about some made up left and right in America, its the real world where real and innocent people are being hurt, harassed, and forced to justify their existence.

    I reckon that homophobes who think like this can be put into a couple of categories:

    • Won't listen to reason, are too far gone to see alternative points of view. Militantly believe they're always right.

    • Only have their views because of a lack of education about particular subjects, probably because of their environment growing up and who they hang around with. These people can be persuaded to adopt a more enlightened POV through the medium of argument.

    This is why I think having a blanket statement that homophobes are 'enemies' is ultimately self-defeating. In order to bring about societal change, as many of these people as possible need to be persuaded or shown that homosexuality is in fact normal and there's nothing wrong with it. While there are some who are too far gone, there are plenty of others who would change their views if they're exposed to better sources, or - as we've seen - live in a society where homosexuality becomes more and more accepted, and see how that has become the default point of view. Living among it without the sky suddenly falling in!

    I also think that the left often don't do themselves any favours by how they approach contentious issues in a black and white way, eg. the current debates about trans rights and gender identity.

  • edited September 22

    @Michael_R_Grant said:

    @magnusovi said:

    @Simon said:

    @magnusovi said:
    I can’t stop thinking about the impact of all the small little homophobic actions that companies, and people, who have these sort of policies commit. How many people not hired, or fired, how many contracts not met, proposals not gone through…. The risk is too large imo to not think of them as public enemies.

    Very convenient (and dangerous) to label anyone with a political view not the same as you as "public enemies".

    The far left do it, as does the far right.

    Not a good direction for society to go.

    What is very convenient is phrasing the situation the way you just did. Homophobic people who think that other human beings are something disgusting that needs to be hidden in their closets do not just have different views. Those are the people who are my enemies, and should be yours too.
    This is not the Tucker Carlson show where we babble about some made up left and right in America, its the real world where real and innocent people are being hurt, harassed, and forced to justify their existence.

    I reckon that homophobes who think like this can be put into a couple of categories:

    • Won't listen to reason, are too far gone to see alternative points of view. Militantly believe they're always right.

    • Only have their views because of a lack of education about particular subjects, probably because of their environment growing up and who they hang around with. These people can be persuaded to adopt a more enlightened POV through the medium of argument.

    This is why I think having a blanket statement that homophobes are 'enemies' is ultimately self-defeating. In order to bring about societal change, as many of these people as possible need to be persuaded or shown that homosexuality is in fact normal and there's nothing wrong with it. While there are some who are too far gone, there are plenty of others who would change their views if they're exposed to better sources, or - as we've seen - live in a society where homosexuality becomes more and more accepted, and see how that has become the default point of view. Living among it without the sky suddenly falling in!

    I also think that the left often don't do themselves any favours by how they approach contentious issues in a black and white way, eg. the current debates about trans rights and gender identity.

    Thanks for your comment brother. I feel you are missing the point of why I am calling them enemies. I’m not trying to persuade those people to change their mind. I’m trying to expose the risk that they pose to the freedom of some of us. Some people do not see it. The reason for why they are the way they are is only relevant to me when we are talking about kids. As we get old we have a personal responsibility to grow as human being who live in a society, not just like biological mammals.
    There is very little room for forgiveness or patience in my book when people’s actions hurt others. I know that no matter what we do we won’t be able to change their hearts if they themselves don’t do it all in their own. All we can do is expose info that they might not have. And I don’t think we have to be too nice about it in some cases.

    I also want to remark that I’m not sure where anyone is getting out that I am from the left and someone else is from the right. I have not read any post where anyone self-professed to be anything. I am, in this case, simply a person who believes that people who are different from myself have the SAME rights as me, and should be treated just as I wish I was treated. It’s not complex, it is not political, it is not really religious, it’s just like…. Common sense. AND people who don’t agree with those views are undoubtedly enemies of those whom they are willing to turn a blind eye when abused, or even abuse them themselves.

  • It is interesting that Karl. R. Popper uses Nazis in his cartoon to support his views. Interesting and lazy.

    What if we took the Nazis out and swapped them for Trump supporters? Or Biden supporters? Or people who say abortion should be illegal? Or legal? Or people who say that their God is the one true God. Or that God hates gays. Or God loves everyone. Or people who say guns should be banned. Or there should be no limit on gun ownership?

    The point I have been trying to make (and failing at) is that tolerance and free speech are complex. If you and your buddies are all left wingers then it is not complex. If your buddies are all right wingers it is not complex. If all your buddies agree that eating meat is murder then it is not complex. And so on. But the world has a vast number of people with different, often conflicting views. You and I might disagree with their views but to label them as "public enemies" is exactly what they do when they label gays as "freaks" or "abominations in the eyes of the Lord" or whatever.

    Disagree with their views, have your own views, but don't demonise people - that is what homophobes do. It doesn't convince the other side and it only splits society.

  • edited September 22

    @Simon said:
    It is interesting that Karl. R. Popper uses Nazis in his cartoon to support his views. Interesting and lazy.

    What if we took the Nazis out and swapped them for Trump supporters? Or Biden supporters? Or people who say abortion should be illegal? Or legal? Or people who say that their God is the one true God. Or that God hates gays. Or God loves everyone. Or people who say guns should be banned. Or there should be no limit on gun ownership?

    The point I have been trying to make (and failing at) is that tolerance and free speech are complex. If you and your buddies are all left wingers then it is not complex. If your buddies are all right wingers it is not complex. If all your buddies agree that eating meat is murder then it is not complex. And so on. But the world has a vast number of people with different, often conflicting views. You and I might disagree with their views but to label them as "public enemies" is exactly what they do when they label gays as "freaks" or "abominations in the eyes of the Lord" or whatever.

    Disagree with their views, have your own views, but don't demonise people - that is what homophobes do. It doesn't convince the other side and it only splits society.

    No one cares about what they say or think. The danger is what they do.

    Also Karl Popper probably didn’t create that infographic, some college kid probably did.

    You are talking this too personally instead of simply acknowledging that being a racist or a homophobe is a bad thing. You know, just being on the right side man.

  • @magnusovi said:
    You are talking this too personally instead of simply acknowledging that being a racist or a homophobe is a bad thing. You know, just being on the right side man.

    How dare I voice an opinion in my own words instead of just shutting up and agreeing with you?

    You want it simple: your arrogance is amazing man.

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