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Noise from charging on iPad when using Usb Hub

Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

Comments

  • @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Your audio interface may be prone to this problem. It might indicate a ground loop or flow in your home’s power. My iRig pro hd2 is hummy in my house when ac is powering my USB adapter… it doesn’t happen at a friend’s house. And I don’t have the same issue with my zoom interface.

  • edited July 2022

    @espiegel123 said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Your audio interface may be prone to this problem. It might indicate a ground loop or flow in your home’s power. My iRig pro hd2 is hummy in my house when ac is powering my USB adapter… it doesn’t happen at a friend’s house. And I don’t have the same issue with my zoom interface.

    Understood. I use Steinberg UR22C. That is, the problem is in voltage and grounding? Tell me, can a voltage stabilizer fix the situation? Or without a ground loop it doesn't make sense? And what is the Zoom model?

  • edited July 2022

    I have one of those cheap tiny Vava usb-c hubs, a 7 in 1 or an 8 in 1. It’s not powered. If it’s plugged into my iPad Pro and then I have it charging the iPad via the extra usb-c port, and then I have an audio interface plugged in via usb, and midi keyboard plugged in or a midi transmitter plugged into another usb, and those have their own power supply plugged into a wall socket, I get hum and noise. Even if I don’t have an audio interface plugged in, the hub still gives hum and noise if other things are plugged in. I haven’t resolved the issue. It comes down to the devices needing to use the same wall socket, or a different wall socket, isolated power, ground lift switches, phase switches, or perhaps a fancy usb hub solves this. In any case, I don’t use the hub at all as a result. I just charge my iPad and use my audio interface bus powered, and I connect a midi device wirelessly via Bluetooth with a Yamaha BT dongle.

    The problem is probably grounding loops and/or lack of isolated outputs… I just avoid the issue by using midi data over Bluetooth. Also, my audio interface has its own Midi i/o, so that’s another way to avoid using a hub. Buy the interface that has all of the i/o you need.

  • edited July 2022

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Edit: Since you mention the Apple Multiport Adapter, I assume you are using a USB-C iPad and a USB-C hub/dock. So you are powering the dock and charging the iPad (via PD) with the same power adapter. Are you using an Apple power adapter or other?

  • @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Exactly. This is the checklist.

  • edited July 2022

    @JoyceRoadStudios said:
    I have one of those cheap tiny Vava usb-c hubs, a 7 in 1 or an 8 in 1. It’s not powered. If it’s plugged into my iPad Pro and then I have it charging the iPad via the extra usb-c port, and then I have an audio interface plugged in via usb, and midi keyboard plugged in or a midi transmitter plugged into another usb, and those have their own power supply plugged into a wall socket, I get hum and noise. Even if I don’t have an audio interface plugged in, the hub still gives hum and noise if other things are plugged in. I haven’t resolved the issue. It comes down to the devices needing to use the same wall socket, or a different wall socket, isolated power, ground lift switches, phase switches, or perhaps a fancy usb hub solves this. In any case, I don’t use the hub at all as a result. I just charge my iPad and use my audio interface bus powered, and I connect a midi device wirelessly via Bluetooth with a Yamaha BT dongle.

    The problem is probably grounding loops and/or lack of isolated outputs… I just avoid the issue by using midi data over Bluetooth. Also, my audio interface has its own Midi i/o, so that’s another way to avoid using a hub. Buy the interface that has all of the i/o you need.

    Thank you very much for the detailed answer. I will try to understand and experiment. It seems to me that you can try an Apple adapter, but something tells me that the problem is deeper. Although I have now connected the adapter to the minijack to the ipad and it works much better than the hub with audio output. In any case, you need to try to fix this problem. I connect the synthesizer via midi, but there is no avoiding charging the background when connected.

  • edited July 2022

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Edit: Since you mention the Apple Multiport Adapter, I assume you are using a USB-C iPad and a USB-C hub/dock. So you are powering the dock and charging the iPad (via PD) with the same power adapter. Are you using an Apple power adapter or other?

    The hub used both inexpensive and slightly more expensive-but not the original Apple. I connect the audio interface via usb c (Steinberg) usb a (hub). The hub is connected via usb c. The power comes from an outlet and a separate power supply. The noise is not too low, but also not high. It's just faintly fainting. There is no noise without charging. I tried to connect the power bank for the sake of experiment-there is sound, there is no noise, but the Steinberg light volume indicator flashes. Aum and hardware synth are working. I can't say about the recording right now. We need to check.

    Edit-I use the original Apple adapter. Ipad pro 2021.

  • @JoyceRoadStudios said:

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Exactly. This is the checklist.

    Absolutely agree

  • @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Edit: Since you mention the Apple Multiport Adapter, I assume you are using a USB-C iPad and a USB-C hub/dock. So you are powering the dock and charging the iPad (via PD) with the same power adapter. Are you using an Apple power adapter or other?

    А может попробовать применить фильтр (сетевой кондиционер)? Может помочь, как думаете? Или это бесполезно?

  • @solncekreeze said:

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Edit: Since you mention the Apple Multiport Adapter, I assume you are using a USB-C iPad and a USB-C hub/dock. So you are powering the dock and charging the iPad (via PD) with the same power adapter. Are you using an Apple power adapter or other?

    А может попробовать применить фильтр (сетевой кондиционер)? Может помочь, как думаете? Или это бесполезно?

    "Or maybe try applying a filter (mains air conditioner)? It might help, what do you think? Or is it useless?"

    A filter might help; it's difficult to say. Can you try stopping the air conditioner to see if it helps? That would be a clue.

  • @solncekreeze said:

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Edit: Since you mention the Apple Multiport Adapter, I assume you are using a USB-C iPad and a USB-C hub/dock. So you are powering the dock and charging the iPad (via PD) with the same power adapter. Are you using an Apple power adapter or other?

    The hub used both inexpensive and slightly more expensive-but not the original Apple. I connect the audio interface via usb c (Steinberg) usb a (hub). The hub is connected via usb c. The power comes from an outlet and a separate power supply. The noise is not too low, but also not high. It's just faintly fainting. There is no noise without charging. I tried to connect the power bank for the sake of experiment-there is sound, there is no noise, but the Steinberg light volume indicator flashes. Aum and hardware synth are working. I can't say about the recording right now. We need to check.

    Edit-I use the original Apple adapter. Ipad pro 2021.

    So, this sounds like a typical setup for a USB-C iPad.

    I suspect the power bank was not supplying enough power for the audio interface. USB-C Power Delivery relies on voltages higher then 5 V to work effectively, but the power bank was probably only 5 V.

    If you can detect the noise in AUM or Audiobus, you could try a spectrogram like Oscilloscope by Mani Consulting or TB Spectrogram, to see what the frequency is. That could be a clue. Ordinary AC hum is at double the mains frequency. Higher frequencies could be generated by external sources; motors with speed control (fans?) are likely suspects.

  • @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Edit: Since you mention the Apple Multiport Adapter, I assume you are using a USB-C iPad and a USB-C hub/dock. So you are powering the dock and charging the iPad (via PD) with the same power adapter. Are you using an Apple power adapter or other?

    The hub used both inexpensive and slightly more expensive-but not the original Apple. I connect the audio interface via usb c (Steinberg) usb a (hub). The hub is connected via usb c. The power comes from an outlet and a separate power supply. The noise is not too low, but also not high. It's just faintly fainting. There is no noise without charging. I tried to connect the power bank for the sake of experiment-there is sound, there is no noise, but the Steinberg light volume indicator flashes. Aum and hardware synth are working. I can't say about the recording right now. We need to check.

    Edit-I use the original Apple adapter. Ipad pro 2021.

    So, this sounds like a typical setup for a USB-C iPad.

    I suspect the power bank was not supplying enough power for the audio interface. USB-C Power Delivery relies on voltages higher then 5 V to work effectively, but the power bank was probably only 5 V.

    If you can detect the noise in AUM or Audiobus, you could try a spectrogram like Oscilloscope by Mani Consulting or TB Spectrogram, to see what the frequency is. That could be a clue. Ordinary AC hum is at double the mains frequency. Higher frequencies could be generated by external sources; motors with speed control (fans?) are likely suspects.

    Thanks a lot to UnkleDave. By air conditioning, I meant a device that is both a stabilizer and a filter of interference in the network. I've seen similar ones on Aliexpress. They go as audio equipment. But I am concerned about the first answer to the question related to the fact that the Zoom audio interface does not have such a thing. And it's interesting. In any case, it is not possible to make a ground loop yourself. Therefore, I will try to use exclusively technical methods of solution. The same ferrite, for example, does not help at all. Therefore, an AC interference filter is probably needed.

  • @solncekreeze said:

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Edit: Since you mention the Apple Multiport Adapter, I assume you are using a USB-C iPad and a USB-C hub/dock. So you are powering the dock and charging the iPad (via PD) with the same power adapter. Are you using an Apple power adapter or other?

    The hub used both inexpensive and slightly more expensive-but not the original Apple. I connect the audio interface via usb c (Steinberg) usb a (hub). The hub is connected via usb c. The power comes from an outlet and a separate power supply. The noise is not too low, but also not high. It's just faintly fainting. There is no noise without charging. I tried to connect the power bank for the sake of experiment-there is sound, there is no noise, but the Steinberg light volume indicator flashes. Aum and hardware synth are working. I can't say about the recording right now. We need to check.

    Edit-I use the original Apple adapter. Ipad pro 2021.

    So, this sounds like a typical setup for a USB-C iPad.

    I suspect the power bank was not supplying enough power for the audio interface. USB-C Power Delivery relies on voltages higher then 5 V to work effectively, but the power bank was probably only 5 V.

    If you can detect the noise in AUM or Audiobus, you could try a spectrogram like Oscilloscope by Mani Consulting or TB Spectrogram, to see what the frequency is. That could be a clue. Ordinary AC hum is at double the mains frequency. Higher frequencies could be generated by external sources; motors with speed control (fans?) are likely suspects.

    Thanks a lot to UnkleDave. By air conditioning, I meant a device that is both a stabilizer and a filter of interference in the network. I've seen similar ones on Aliexpress. They go as audio equipment. But I am concerned about the first answer to the question related to the fact that the Zoom audio interface does not have such a thing. And it's interesting. In any case, it is not possible to make a ground loop yourself. Therefore, I will try to use exclusively technical methods of solution. The same ferrite, for example, does not help at all. Therefore, an AC interference filter is probably needed.

    Ah. I think you meant "power conditioning"; error of Google Translate.

    One other thing I should ask: Are all your devices USB powered, or does any have separate mains power? Separate power supplies could cause hum.

  • @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:

    @uncledave said:

    @solncekreeze said:
    Hi everybody. Please help me. When the audio interface is connected to the iPad and charging is connected, there is noise (current interference). I use an inexpensive usb hub. Will there be a similar noise if connected via Apple Multiport Adapter? Thank you🙌

    Could you describe your setup in a bit more detail?

    • Inexpensive USB hub (powered, not powered)?
    • Hub connected to iPad by USB-C cable, Apple USB-3 Camera Adapter (Lightning), other?
    • Charging is connected to Apple adapter Lightning port, USB-C Power Delivery, other?
    • Charging power from the powered hub, from a separate charger?
    • Noise is hum (100/120 Hz steady) or higher frequency?
    • No noise if charging is not connected?
    • Is the noise present in recorded audio, or only in audio output (headphones/speakers)?

    Edit: Since you mention the Apple Multiport Adapter, I assume you are using a USB-C iPad and a USB-C hub/dock. So you are powering the dock and charging the iPad (via PD) with the same power adapter. Are you using an Apple power adapter or other?

    The hub used both inexpensive and slightly more expensive-but not the original Apple. I connect the audio interface via usb c (Steinberg) usb a (hub). The hub is connected via usb c. The power comes from an outlet and a separate power supply. The noise is not too low, but also not high. It's just faintly fainting. There is no noise without charging. I tried to connect the power bank for the sake of experiment-there is sound, there is no noise, but the Steinberg light volume indicator flashes. Aum and hardware synth are working. I can't say about the recording right now. We need to check.

    Edit-I use the original Apple adapter. Ipad pro 2021.

    So, this sounds like a typical setup for a USB-C iPad.

    I suspect the power bank was not supplying enough power for the audio interface. USB-C Power Delivery relies on voltages higher then 5 V to work effectively, but the power bank was probably only 5 V.

    If you can detect the noise in AUM or Audiobus, you could try a spectrogram like Oscilloscope by Mani Consulting or TB Spectrogram, to see what the frequency is. That could be a clue. Ordinary AC hum is at double the mains frequency. Higher frequencies could be generated by external sources; motors with speed control (fans?) are likely suspects.

    Thanks a lot to UnkleDave. By air conditioning, I meant a device that is both a stabilizer and a filter of interference in the network. I've seen similar ones on Aliexpress. They go as audio equipment. But I am concerned about the first answer to the question related to the fact that the Zoom audio interface does not have such a thing. And it's interesting. In any case, it is not possible to make a ground loop yourself. Therefore, I will try to use exclusively technical methods of solution. The same ferrite, for example, does not help at all. Therefore, an AC interference filter is probably needed.

    Ah. I think you meant "power conditioning"; error of Google Translate.

    One other thing I should ask: Are all your devices USB powered, or does any have separate mains power? Separate power supplies could cause hum.

    Yes, that's it. I have now disconnected all the power supplies from the filter. And still there is a background. In general, you need to save money for a good filter or improve the wiring.

  • Do you have your keyboard audio output connected to your soundcard and your keyboard midi connected via usb? This will cause the groundloop.
    Can you connect your keyboard midi with midi cables to your sound interface? The old midi ports use an optical connection inside to prevent the ground loop.
    Using bluetooth midi will also prevent the groundloop.
    I use some small groundloop isolators for use in a car.
    Got mine directly from China for 3 euros a piece.

    https://www.amazon.nl/Isolator-Zadelhaken-Geluidsfilter-Speaker-Systeem/dp/B07KDQT9Z4/ref=pd_lpo_3?pd_rd_i=B07KDQT9Z4&psc=1

  • @Alfred said:
    Do you have your keyboard audio output connected to your soundcard and your keyboard midi connected via usb? This will cause the groundloop.
    Can you connect your keyboard midi with midi cables to your sound interface? The old midi ports use an optical connection inside to prevent the ground loop.
    Using bluetooth midi will also prevent the groundloop.
    I use some small groundloop isolators for use in a car.
    Got mine directly from China for 3 euros a piece.

    https://www.amazon.nl/Isolator-Zadelhaken-Geluidsfilter-Speaker-Systeem/dp/B07KDQT9Z4/ref=pd_lpo_3?pd_rd_i=B07KDQT9Z4&psc=1

    Thanks for the feedback. But this switching method will not work for me. I connected it via midi. But the problem is still in the power grid. To begin with, I will try to take an Apple adapter, then if there is no progress, I will study the issue of anti-interference in more detail. Thank you all very much. The topic can be closed. Music for everyone🙌

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