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What is Audiobus?Audiobus is an award-winning music app for iPhone and iPad which lets you use your other music apps together. Chain effects on your favourite synth, run the output of apps or Audio Units into an app like GarageBand or Loopy, or select a different audio interface output for each app. Route MIDI between apps — drive a synth from a MIDI sequencer, or add an arpeggiator to your MIDI keyboard — or sync with your external MIDI gear. And control your entire setup from a MIDI controller.

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Animoog Z playback vs performance

edited November 24 in General App Discussion

When using the in app controller in Animoog Z, the playback is much different than the recorded performance. Slides from one note to the next don’t sound the same on playback 😢 This is true in Cubasis or GarageBand. With the IAA version this obviously wasn’t an issue because it was recording the audio. Is there anyway to overcome this obstacle, or is this just an unfortunate limitation of midi?

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Comments

  • You’d need to record MPE midi in order to capture all the extra expression. Not sure if these hosts can do it.

  • @wawelt said:
    You’d need to record MPE midi in order to capture all the extra expression. Not sure if these hosts can do it.

    Thanks for the info. GarageBand has a switch in settings that says Support MPE Controllers but I guess that doesn’t mean it will record that data. Looking in to whether or not Cubasis 3 will. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction!

  • @Bassey said:

    @wawelt said:
    You’d need to record MPE midi in order to capture all the extra expression. Not sure if these hosts can do it.

    Thanks for the info. GarageBand has a switch in settings that says Support MPE Controllers but I guess that doesn’t mean it will record that data. Looking in to whether or not Cubasis 3 will. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction!

    I think Atom 2 will record MPE midi. Or you could just record the audio instead.

  • Now that I've gotten used to recording in audio after so many years of there being no DAW that can handle MPE midi editing/recording, I honestly and truly have zero desire to ever stop recording via audio.

  • edited November 24

    Yup, just record audio. Editing and recording midi just slows things down.

    Less of an issue with midi and more that hosts don't support MPE adequately or at all.

  • I have the same problem with GeoShred / GeoSwam. Most of MPE expression gestures are lost during recording.
    So I record in audio format with IAA connectivity.
    This leads me to the question of AUv3 supposed to be "superior" to IAA : how will we do once IAA will have disappeared from apps (see Animoog Z for instance) ? Full MPE support in AU hosts becomes now more and more mandatory.

  • I haven’t tested myself but from memory Loopbud and Atom2 both capable of capturing mpe, but without editing, so pretty much the same as audio recording... except the size of the recorded material.

  • It would be good to capture full MPE, but generally I also prefer to capture audio performances from my ipad work.
    I think it's the best way of capturing long term imo.
    Apps and hosts and song files can break in the long term so if you have audio captures these can be stored and used.

    Also I think it helps my personal workflow because it restricts more fiddling with midi later on :)

  • But how do you record just the audio of an AUv3?

  • @0tolerance4silence said:
    I haven’t tested myself but from memory Loopbud and Atom2 both capable of capturing mpe, but without editing, so pretty much the same as audio recording... except the size of the recorded material.

    I don't think Loopbud records mpe... Atom yes.

  • Track freeze in Cubasis is not going to work if Cubasis hasn't recorded all of the MPE midi ... which begs the question why Cubasis still can't route output to audio tracks after all this time?
    Is it doable to use something like Neon for capturing the audio inside Cubasis?

    Better stay with flexible routing in AUM, I suppose.

  • @Bassey said:
    But how do you record just the audio of an AUv3?

    Route the audio output to a recorder? AUM has one built-in. I suppose you're thinking of a specific DAW host, so the question is really related to that host.

  • @Bassey said:
    But how do you record just the audio of an AUv3?

    It depends on the app. In Auria Pro, for instance, one can just route the audio output of an AUv3 instrument to an audio track. Does Cubasis still not allow this?

  • edited November 25

    @Bassey
    So far there is just the one iOS DAW that records MPE, and meets midi 2.0 standard, MultitrackStudio

    The caveat there is that one still needs an MPE keyboard to input the note info

    Edit: uninformed again

  • @Bassey There are apps like Neon Audio Editor which can record audio when placed in an AU FX location and then the recorded audio can be edited and exported out.

  • @Bassey said:
    When using the in app controller in Animoog Z, the playback is much different than the recorded performance. Slides from one note to the next don’t sound the same on playback 😢 This is true in Cubasis or GarageBand. With the IAA version this obviously wasn’t an issue because it was recording the audio. Is there anyway to overcome this obstacle, or is this just an unfortunate limitation of midi?

    Good catch…at least in garage band it seems to capture the pitch slides correctly while using the GarageBand keyboard. So perhaps the MIDI out implementation in the plug-in needs to be updated

    @MoogMusicInc

  • @realdawei said:

    @Bassey said:
    When using the in app controller in Animoog Z, the playback is much different than the recorded performance. Slides from one note to the next don’t sound the same on playback 😢 This is true in Cubasis or GarageBand. With the IAA version this obviously wasn’t an issue because it was recording the audio. Is there anyway to overcome this obstacle, or is this just an unfortunate limitation of midi?

    Good catch…at least in garage band it seems to capture the pitch slides correctly while using the GarageBand keyboard. So perhaps the MIDI out implementation in the plug-in needs to be updated

    @MoogMusicInc

    Have you all checked if the midi out is set to MPE? (It’s after 16 in the midi-channel list).

  • @Samu said:

    @realdawei said:

    @Bassey said:
    When using the in app controller in Animoog Z, the playback is much different than the recorded performance. Slides from one note to the next don’t sound the same on playback 😢 This is true in Cubasis or GarageBand. With the IAA version this obviously wasn’t an issue because it was recording the audio. Is there anyway to overcome this obstacle, or is this just an unfortunate limitation of midi?

    Good catch…at least in garage band it seems to capture the pitch slides correctly while using the GarageBand keyboard. So perhaps the MIDI out implementation in the plug-in needs to be updated

    @MoogMusicInc

    Have you all checked if the midi out is set to MPE? (It’s after 16 in the midi-channel list).

    Just tried that…same result (in GB).

  • True, I also couldn’t figure out a way to record Animoog Z in Cubasis. Probably the audio via Audiobus?

  • @krassmann said:
    True, I also couldn’t figure out a way to record Animoog Z in Cubasis. Probably the audio via Audiobus?

    you could use an AUfx like multitrack recorder inserted on Animoog's track to record its audio.

  • wimwim
    edited November 25

    @Bassey said:
    When using the in app controller in Animoog Z, the playback is much different than the recorded performance. Slides from one note to the next don’t sound the same on playback 😢 This is true in Cubasis or GarageBand. With the IAA version this obviously wasn’t an issue because it was recording the audio. Is there anyway to overcome this obstacle, or is this just an unfortunate limitation of midi?

    Is MPE selected for output channel in Animoog? If it's not selected then no pitch bend is sent when sliding between notes on the internal keyboard.

  • @wim: good point. I think MPE is not the default.

  • @krassmann said:
    True, I also couldn’t figure out a way to record Animoog Z in Cubasis. Probably the audio via Audiobus?

    @LFS
    Animoog…Another app like TC-11, MiRack, all Lumbeat apps, Beatcutter, FRMS, spacecraft, SoundScaper, SynthScaper, Nave AND imo ALL touch expressive apps would benefit from audio routing to record directly inside Cubasis.

  • I wanted to add to the conversation that screen recording is an option, and a valid way of recording any audio on an iPad or iPhone. Audiophiles may argue the quality, but I’ve never heard the difference. Especially if it’s some sick Lo-Fi beat!

  • Thanks for the responses, traveling for the holiday. Will try some of these suggestions when I get back home.

  • After a little testing in GarageBand, it didn’t seem like GarageBand was recording the MPE from Animoog Z (I had turned on the MPE settings in GB’s prefs and set Animoog’s midi in/out to MPE. It makes me wonder if GB records MPE only from external controllers.

  • edited November 25

    @espiegel123 said:
    After a little testing in GarageBand, it didn’t seem like GarageBand was recording the MPE from Animoog Z (I had turned on the MPE settings in GB’s prefs and set Animoog’s midi in/out to MPE. It makes me wonder if GB records MPE only from external controllers.

    If there’s a bug, they’ll figure it out.

  • Yah Moog always gets things sorted out in short order.

  • edited November 25

    @Bassey said:
    But how do you record just the audio of an AUv3?

    I have NO IDEA if this is helpful but I seem to remember it from ages ago (I don't have time to rewatch it now):

  • It does appear to be a problem with Z MPE out (or in). I set everything up correctly, as far as I can tell, in AUM recording from Atom2. Then I switched the routing around so that Atom2 played back to Z. Glide (and maybe automation) weren’t picked up.

    A much better test, if anyone wants to try it, is to set up two instances in AUM.

    • Mute the audio from the first.
    • Load the same preset (one that uses glide between notes) in both
    • Make sure input and output on both are set to MPE
    • Turn on Send Pressure and Send Controls in the first instance
    • Set the second instance to receive midi from the first
    • Play the first. The second should sound as though it’s being played locally. If not then something is being lost with midi out, midi in, or both.

    My Air 2 doesn’t have enough power to run two instances, so I can’t successfully try this test. But, as a test, it eliminates the maximum external influences.

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