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Off-Topic discussion about Bitcoin and cryptocurrency.

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Comments

  • u0421793u0421793

    @richardyot said:

    @wim said:

    @richardyot said:
    Enough with Bitcoin’s greenwashing ! Bitcoin runs mostly on fossil fuels.

    With research from the University of Cambridge

    Good post. Some meat rather than simply dropping an assertion as though it's fact (as I'll admit I've done too). Thanks for that.

    My pleasure, thanks for engaging.

    It did come over as a trifle hysterical to me, as though it was written by someone who does Extinction Rebellion part-time on Saturdays, and who probably used to pelt eggs at Huntingdon Life Sciences staff without knowing why. I mean, not completely, only slightly.

    One thing that has made a shift over the past several years is that mining has gravitated away from places in the world that have, well, basically expensive electricity, to places where electricity bills are lower. That doesn’t mean it is ‘green’ energy or renewable or sustainable or any of those nice things, it just means the electricity bills are not as high as other places, so more POW mining happens there. The other thing that has concurrently started to occur is that mining has drifted into colder climates, so that the energy spent cooling the rigs is again lower. Places that have a lot of snow and ice all the time are ideal, and if those places have favourable electricity rates (as some do), that’s where a lot of the crypto mining tends to happen. Cooling is a big power draw, so being cool to start with is good.

    I’m not aware of anyone doing serious mining based off of solar, or wind come to that, but of course in theory this could occur. I’m just not aware of it. If anything, there’s probably more incentive to do mining based off of stolen ordinary electricity than ecologically low-impact electricity, but if you can’t steal it, at least pay less for it.

  • wimwim
    edited April 2021

    @espiegel123 said:

    @wim said:
    Of course, I always keep circling back to the reality that debating from the energy consumption standpoint serves little purpose anyway. It's a reality, and being unhappy about it isn't going to make it go away.

    I don't understand this logic at all. Historically, humans have sometimes been able to abandon things in use because we recognize that they are destructive. This notion that bitcoin is so intrinsically embedded that it couldn't be abandoned for something less destructive doesn't make sense. It is POSSIBLE we won't abandon it, we sadly do stick with lots of destructive practices, but we also abandon some -- and we ONLY abandon them by people unhappy about them working towards their abandonment.

    Good luck with that effort. Sincerely. No sarcasm.
    I just won't be participating. I'm not that much of an idealist.

  • CarnbotCarnbot

    Some interesting comparisons here. https://cbeci.org/cbeci/comparisons
    The amount of electricity consumed every year by always-on but inactive home devices in the USA alone could power the bitcoin network for 1.6 years.
    It seems that's an easier one to fix and more unnecessary than bitcoin, but that's not changing fast either :)

  • PZooPZoo

    @ashh said:ion making

    You just seem very invested in telling others how bad this investment is. Go on, live a little and get one. You know you want to.

    So nothing on the substance, then?

  • PZooPZoo

    But, yes, I think much of the crypto hype is early adaptors looking for the greater fool, and finding them. I don’t like that and I am trying to help, even if nobody wants the help - guilty. I’ve seen this through many asset classes and many cycles and it too often ends in regret.

    Happy to engage if you’d like to debate the meris though. I would love to be wrong. It’s why I love good surprise endings in movies. But right now this is looking more like pretty predictable rom-com

  • NeuMNeuM
    edited April 2021

    @PZoo said:
    But, yes, I think much of the crypto hype is early adaptors looking for the greater fool, and finding them. I don’t like that and I am trying to help, even if nobody wants the help - guilty. I’ve seen this through many asset classes and many cycles and it too often ends in regret.

    I don’t know about you, but I know a number people who’ve done very well for themselves (on paper) by buying low and holding. That’s how investments work. Buy low, sell high. Now, compare a person who bought Bitcoin, Ethereum, Litecoin or Filecoin or whatever, with a person who either invested in the stock market or just kept their money in a savings account. Who is doing well today and who is sitting on devaluing assets?

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @Neum: I am not saying that BTC is definitely a bubble about to burst, but the reasoning you articulate: "know a number people who’ve done very well for themselves (on paper) by buying low and holding. That’s how investments work. Buy low, sell high. Now, compare a person who bought Bitcoin, Ethereum, Litecoin or Filecoin or whatever, with a person who either invested in the stock market or just kept their money in a savings account. Who is doing well today and who is sitting on devaluing assets?"

    Is something that could be said about many bubbles before they collapse -- people having made money thus far does not mean that the rise in value is sustainable and/or that it won't collapse. It doesn't carry analytical weight.

    The reasoning you provide is true of any number of investments that were unsound in the long run. Again, I am not saying that BTC is definitively unsound, just that the reasoning that you have articulated doesn't speak to the lines of reasoning articulated by people who have proposed analysis as to why BTC is not sound in the long-term. I am not weighing on the merits of those arguments -- simplying saying that "so-and-so has done well for themselves the past ten years holding BTC" doesn't speak to long-term viability.

  • PZooPZoo

    @espiegel123 said:

    I have noted that in much discussion of BitCoin that people that feel strongly that BitCoin is fundamentally different (in a good way) from any past currency or investment vehicle

    Totally. But I’m not sure it actually is that different as a form of money (if it was money). Monetary history moves back and forth between the extremes of fixed quantity (eg money denominated as a weight in gold with no money in excess of gold, Bitcoin) and elastic quantity (eg ability of the Fed to create money at will to refinance collateralized short term instruments like repo, defend govt interest expense).

    Ultimately I think we never really live in either extreme and we move between them as politicians react to break up concentrations of wealth. When we have a strict gold standard, wealth gets hoarded and money eventually goes elastic to print around it. When money gets too elastic, we get like today with excess leverage and speculation - historically that would drive inflation or a bust. For now, at least though, the fed thinks they’ve cracked the code and just created an everything bubble that keeps their handlers happy.

    I think that has caused much of the social unrest that has led many to grasp at Bitcoin. But, the technology of Bitcoin is pretty much just fed wire with broad access. And the monetary qualities of Bitcoin is just a strict good standard.

    The monetary side is not revolutionary at all really

    The fed has pretty enormous power. The system is more likely to collapse from social unrest that hyperinflation

  • NeuMNeuM

    @espiegel123 said:
    @Neum: I am not saying that BTC is definitely a bubble about to burst, but the reasoning you articulate: "know a number people who’ve done very well for themselves (on paper) by buying low and holding. That’s how investments work. Buy low, sell high. Now, compare a person who bought Bitcoin, Ethereum, Litecoin or Filecoin or whatever, with a person who either invested in the stock market or just kept their money in a savings account. Who is doing well today and who is sitting on devaluing assets?"

    Is something that could be said about many bubbles before they collapse -- people having made money thus far does not mean that the rise in value is sustainable and/or that it won't collapse. It doesn't carry analytical weight.

    The reasoning you provide is true of any number of investments that were unsound in the long run. Again, I am not saying that BTC is definitively unsound, just that the reasoning that you have articulated doesn't speak to the lines of reasoning articulated by people who have proposed analysis as to why BTC is not sound in the long-term. I am not weighing on the merits of those arguments -- simplying saying that "so-and-so has done well for themselves the past ten years holding BTC" doesn't speak to long-term viability.

    Bubbles are part of the investment cycle. People tend to chase after rising stocks/cryptos/trends and by the time the general public notices something, the stock/crypto/trend is basically already in bubble territory. Long term investors buy low, hold and ignore the wild gyrations of day-to-day markets.

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @NeuM said:

    @espiegel123 said:
    @Neum: I am not saying that BTC is definitely a bubble about to burst, but the reasoning you articulate: "know a number people who’ve done very well for themselves (on paper) by buying low and holding. That’s how investments work. Buy low, sell high. Now, compare a person who bought Bitcoin, Ethereum, Litecoin or Filecoin or whatever, with a person who either invested in the stock market or just kept their money in a savings account. Who is doing well today and who is sitting on devaluing assets?"

    Is something that could be said about many bubbles before they collapse -- people having made money thus far does not mean that the rise in value is sustainable and/or that it won't collapse. It doesn't carry analytical weight.

    The reasoning you provide is true of any number of investments that were unsound in the long run. Again, I am not saying that BTC is definitively unsound, just that the reasoning that you have articulated doesn't speak to the lines of reasoning articulated by people who have proposed analysis as to why BTC is not sound in the long-term. I am not weighing on the merits of those arguments -- simplying saying that "so-and-so has done well for themselves the past ten years holding BTC" doesn't speak to long-term viability.

    Bubbles are part of the investment cycle. People tend to chase after rising stocks/cryptos/trends and by the time the general public notices something, the stock/crypto/trend is basically already in bubble territory. Long term investors buy low, hold and ignore the wild gyrations of day-to-day markets.

    Sure. By definition, one buys low and sells high. Stating that truism provides no insight as to how to judge the valuation of BitCoin.

  • PZooPZoo

    @espiegel123 said:

    Stating that truism provides no insight as to how to judge the valuation of BitCoin.

    That’s the whole conversation wrapped up nicely. I’m still not seeing a valuation proposition anywhere

  • TarekithTarekith
    edited April 2021

    @ExAsperis99 said:. This primer by John Lanchester in The London Review of Books is fascinating and excellent. Lanchester is the rare literary writer who understands finance. And most important, unlike most in the financial press, he is not at all beholden to money wizards. If he doesn't understand something, he asks questions until he does.

    Thanks! I enjoyed that despite already knowing a decent bit about the topic.

  • johnfromberkeleyjohnfromberkeley

    I just minted my first NFT: https://www.hicetnunc.xyz/objkt/55406

  • NeuMNeuM

    @PZoo said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    Stating that truism provides no insight as to how to judge the valuation of BitCoin.

    That’s the whole conversation wrapped up nicely. I’m still not seeing a valuation proposition anywhere

    You may not see it or be aware of it, but Bitcoin alone has a market cap of more than $1 trillion. It doesn’t matter if you don’t understand it. Others clearly do. :)

  • ashhashh
    edited April 2021

    @NeuM said:

    @PZoo said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    Stating that truism provides no insight as to how to judge the valuation of BitCoin.

    That’s the whole conversation wrapped up nicely. I’m still not seeing a valuation proposition anywhere

    You may not see it or be aware of it, but Bitcoin alone has a market cap of more than $1 trillion. It doesn’t matter if you don’t understand it. Others clearly do. :)

    Firstly, let me just say that I have noooooo idea about volatile, short-term investments like BTC. However, I do think that people like you, @PZoo are trying to make BTC's square peg fit into the dusty old round hole of the Rules of Investing. The time to say I told you so has long gone. Fortunes are gained and lost on the stock market every day, someone wins and someone loses. BTC is just doing that, isn't it? What's not to like?

  • nerVenerVe

    There’s a lot of cognitive dissonance within discussions of currency. I see it as a result of socioeconomic conditioning from the military industrial complex. Decentralization is inevitable, the sooner the better…

  • ashhashh

    @nerVe said:
    There’s a lot of cognitive dissonance within discussions of currency. I see it as a result of socioeconomic conditioning from the military industrial complex. Decentralization is inevitable, the sooner the better…

    Interesting. I am familiar with cognitive dissonance, in a personal and wider context... However, I'm not clear about your opinion on social conditioning by the military industrial complex. Would you mind expanding on that?

  • wimwim
    edited April 2021

    @ashh said:

    @NeuM said:

    @PZoo said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    Stating that truism provides no insight as to how to judge the valuation of BitCoin.

    That’s the whole conversation wrapped up nicely. I’m still not seeing a valuation proposition anywhere

    You may not see it or be aware of it, but Bitcoin alone has a market cap of more than $1 trillion. It doesn’t matter if you don’t understand it. Others clearly do. :)

    Firstly, let me just say that I have noooooo idea about volatile, short-term investments like BTC. However, I do think that people like you, @PZoo are trying to make BTC's square peg fit into the dusty old round hole of the Rules of Investing. The time to say I told you so has long gone. Fortunes are gained and lost on the stock market every day, someone wins and someone loses. BTC is just doing that, isn't it? What's not to like?

    There are other another shades to this. For instance, Ethereum blockchain has other uses than just minting coins. Some are here today and some are yet to be realized. Visa, JP Morgan Chase, and some other well-known entity I can't remember just now just recently invested a sizable sum in blockchain technology, saying they have important emerging uses for it. I forget the details, and am too sleepy to look up the post where I linked to the article over in the NFT thread. Then there are related blockchain technology companies that may be good investments.

    In short, for anyone interested in investing, it's a ripe, new area to research and to hunt for opportunities, be they coins, technologies, or related industries. It's challenging to be sure since it is new and unpredictable. But I find it fascinating. I find the passionate evangelism for and against the whole thing fascinating as well. Hard to comprehend why people are so zealous to defend their chosen positions, but fascinating. And entertaining. :p

  • nerVenerVe

    @ashh said:

    @nerVe said:
    There’s a lot of cognitive dissonance within discussions of currency. I see it as a result of socioeconomic conditioning from the military industrial complex. Decentralization is inevitable, the sooner the better…

    Interesting. I am familiar with cognitive dissonance, in a personal and wider context... However, I'm not clear about your opinion on social conditioning by the military industrial complex. Would you mind expanding on that?

    Historically periods of global deflation like we are seeing today, result and resolve through war. Nationalism with all types of propaganda, rhetoric, and political chaos like we have been seeing over and over….It will be different this time, it already is…Financial technologies and open minded regulation is finally emerging as a viable way forward to resolve and reset the wildly irresponsible and wasteful mess that has long arisen.

  • dendydendy
    edited April 2021

    If we speak about so called "carbon footprint" of bitcoin mining, don't forget to throw few words also about US dollar bloody footprint

    https://bitcoinmagazine.com/culture/the-hidden-costs-of-the-petrodollar

    @wim said:
    Sigh. I don't have the energy for a debate on this. I retract my challenge of proof. You'll just turn it back to me. I'll have to retrace my steps researching something I've already satisfied myself about. We'll continue to disagree. Nothing will be accomplished.

    Welcome in desert of my reality, experiencing this for years :lol:

  • PZooPZoo

    @NeuM said:

    You may not see it or be aware of it, but Bitcoin alone has a market cap of more than $1 trillion. It doesn’t matter if you don’t understand it. Others clearly do. :)

    @ashh said:

    I do think that people like you, @PZoo are trying to make BTC's square peg fit into the dusty old round hole of the Rules of Investing. The time to say I told you so has long gone. Fortunes are gained and lost on the stock market every day, someone wins and someone loses. BTC is just doing that, isn't it? What's not to like?

    I haven’t read this entire thread, so apologies if I missed it from before my original post, but I still haven’t seen anyone try to actually rebut the substantive argument that anyone who bought a decent amount of Bitcoin in the past, before this run up, should now sell, at least a healthy chunk of it, because looking from today into the future, the claimed values of Bitcoin all seem to be failing miserably.

  • richardyotrichardyot

    Coinbase fined $6.5 million by the CFTC for wash-trading and false reporting, you can read the settlement here, section C3 is particularly good, on some days the wash-trading accounted for 99% of all trading volume:

    https://t.co/u4pKNdKw58?amp=1

  • ExAsperis99ExAsperis99

    @Tarekith said:

    @ExAsperis99 said:. This primer by John Lanchester in The London Review of Books is fascinating and excellent. Lanchester is the rare literary writer who understands finance. And most important, unlike most in the financial press, he is not at all beholden to money wizards. If he doesn't understand something, he asks questions until he does.

    Thanks! I enjoyed that despite already knowing a decent bit about the topic.

    Glad you liked it. He's a great writer; would love to read more like this.

  • ashhashh

    @wim said:

    @ashh said:

    @NeuM said:

    @PZoo said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    Stating that truism provides no insight as to how to judge the valuation of BitCoin.

    That’s the whole conversation wrapped up nicely. I’m still not seeing a valuation proposition anywhere

    You may not see it or be aware of it, but Bitcoin alone has a market cap of more than $1 trillion. It doesn’t matter if you don’t understand it. Others clearly do. :)

    Firstly, let me just say that I have noooooo idea about volatile, short-term investments like BTC. However, I do think that people like you, @PZoo are trying to make BTC's square peg fit into the dusty old round hole of the Rules of Investing. The time to say I told you so has long gone. Fortunes are gained and lost on the stock market every day, someone wins and someone loses. BTC is just doing that, isn't it? What's not to like?

    There are other another shades to this. For instance, Ethereum blockchain has other uses than just minting coins. Some are here today and some are yet to be realized. Visa, JP Morgan Chase, and some other well-known entity I can't remember just now just recently invested a sizable sum in blockchain technology, saying they have important emerging uses for it. I forget the details, and am too sleepy to look up the post where I linked to the article over in the NFT thread. Then there are related blockchain technology companies that may be good investments.

    In short, for anyone interested in investing, it's a ripe, new area to research and to hunt for opportunities, be they coins, technologies, or related industries. It's challenging to be sure since it is new and unpredictable. But I find it fascinating. I find the passionate evangelism for and against the whole thing fascinating as well. Hard to comprehend why people are so zealous to defend their chosen positions, but fascinating. And entertaining. :p

    Yes, blockchain looks a bit like it could turn a lot of stuff inside out. That's my highly articulate position on that. All I know is that any investment that I touch turns out to be as valuable as a winter timeshare in Bognor Regis.

    I often wonder if people who have put a lot of time and effort into understanding the markets are so annoyed by BTC because it has thrown them in with people just having a punt who know next to nothing and yet have made a fortune in 5 minutes whereas they have followed all the rules and not made quite as much from their immense knowledge and experience.

  • ExAsperis99ExAsperis99
    edited April 2021

    @ashh said:

    @wim said:

    @ashh said:

    @NeuM said:

    @PZoo said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    Stating that truism provides no insight as to how to judge the valuation of BitCoin.

    That’s the whole conversation wrapped up nicely. I’m still not seeing a valuation proposition anywhere

    You may not see it or be aware of it, but Bitcoin alone has a market cap of more than $1 trillion. It doesn’t matter if you don’t understand it. Others clearly do. :)

    Firstly, let me just say that I have noooooo idea about volatile, short-term investments like BTC. However, I do think that people like you, @PZoo are trying to make BTC's square peg fit into the dusty old round hole of the Rules of Investing. The time to say I told you so has long gone. Fortunes are gained and lost on the stock market every day, someone wins and someone loses. BTC is just doing that, isn't it? What's not to like?

    There are other another shades to this. For instance, Ethereum blockchain has other uses than just minting coins. Some are here today and some are yet to be realized. Visa, JP Morgan Chase, and some other well-known entity I can't remember just now just recently invested a sizable sum in blockchain technology, saying they have important emerging uses for it. I forget the details, and am too sleepy to look up the post where I linked to the article over in the NFT thread. Then there are related blockchain technology companies that may be good investments.

    In short, for anyone interested in investing, it's a ripe, new area to research and to hunt for opportunities, be they coins, technologies, or related industries. It's challenging to be sure since it is new and unpredictable. But I find it fascinating. I find the passionate evangelism for and against the whole thing fascinating as well. Hard to comprehend why people are so zealous to defend their chosen positions, but fascinating. And entertaining. :p

    I often wonder if people who have put a lot of time and effort into understanding the markets are so annoyed by BTC because it has thrown them in with people just having a punt who know next to nothing and yet have made a fortune in 5 minutes whereas they have followed all the rules and not made quite as much from their immense knowledge and experience.

    There's some definite truth to this. Like remember when the Reddit dudes all got together and destroyed the hedge funders who were shorting Gamestop? And everybody said they didn't understand finance, that's not the way they game is played? But they didn't care about the RULES, and they went on to save Gamestop, and put an end to shortselling vulturism forever and saved capitalism and all got super-rich in the process?

  • PZooPZoo

    @ashh said:

    I often wonder if people who have put a lot of time and effort into understanding the markets are so annoyed by BTC because it has thrown them in with people just having a punt who know next to nothing and yet have made a fortune in 5 minutes whereas they have followed all the rules and not made quite as much from their immense knowledge and experience.

    In my experience, that would be a VERY wrong assumption. People in the "real trader / banking world" trade Bitcoin too - and put a lot of time into trying to understanding all markets, including Bitcoin, and their inter-relationships. The difference is that we have sufficient historical context, over decades of booms and busts, and lessons learned, across all the latest investment crazes and ponzi schemes to view bitcoin as "just a trade", not a cult of allegiance, and the risk exposure as a real exposure to be managed.

    Assuming you still have bitcoin, if you want to stay in, good for you, and good luck to you! I'm trying to do a bit of a public service here on a forum that I think is actually one of the nicer pockets of the internet, and may include some musicians for whom this may the first time having significant wealth ... but I'm certainly not trying to tell anyone what to do. If you have massive unrealized gains in bitcoin and your wealth is concentrated in bitcoin, I'm just trying to get you to think objectively about whether that is the right thing for you to CONTINUE to do.

    As mentioned above, I think the basic argument for STAYING in Bitcoin is that it's where you want to be when hyperinflation inevitable demolishes fiat currency, so getting out now is a mistake. But, as I explained above (and could go for pages about), I think that is not only NOT inevitable, but I think it's highly, highly unlikely. That's just my opinion ... albeit one developed from studying the inner workings of financial system structure from the inside and living through 2008 on the front lines. Thinking you know more than others because you know less than them is, frankly, the definition of childishness.

    I'm here to debate my substantive points and learn from all of you, but I promise I will stop making this point over and over again :) Good luck!

  • NeuMNeuM

    @ExAsperis99 said:

    @ashh said:

    @wim said:

    @ashh said:

    @NeuM said:

    @PZoo said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    Stating that truism provides no insight as to how to judge the valuation of BitCoin.

    That’s the whole conversation wrapped up nicely. I’m still not seeing a valuation proposition anywhere

    You may not see it or be aware of it, but Bitcoin alone has a market cap of more than $1 trillion. It doesn’t matter if you don’t understand it. Others clearly do. :)

    Firstly, let me just say that I have noooooo idea about volatile, short-term investments like BTC. However, I do think that people like you, @PZoo are trying to make BTC's square peg fit into the dusty old round hole of the Rules of Investing. The time to say I told you so has long gone. Fortunes are gained and lost on the stock market every day, someone wins and someone loses. BTC is just doing that, isn't it? What's not to like?

    There are other another shades to this. For instance, Ethereum blockchain has other uses than just minting coins. Some are here today and some are yet to be realized. Visa, JP Morgan Chase, and some other well-known entity I can't remember just now just recently invested a sizable sum in blockchain technology, saying they have important emerging uses for it. I forget the details, and am too sleepy to look up the post where I linked to the article over in the NFT thread. Then there are related blockchain technology companies that may be good investments.

    In short, for anyone interested in investing, it's a ripe, new area to research and to hunt for opportunities, be they coins, technologies, or related industries. It's challenging to be sure since it is new and unpredictable. But I find it fascinating. I find the passionate evangelism for and against the whole thing fascinating as well. Hard to comprehend why people are so zealous to defend their chosen positions, but fascinating. And entertaining. :p

    I often wonder if people who have put a lot of time and effort into understanding the markets are so annoyed by BTC because it has thrown them in with people just having a punt who know next to nothing and yet have made a fortune in 5 minutes whereas they have followed all the rules and not made quite as much from their immense knowledge and experience.

    There's some definite truth to this. Like remember when the Reddit dudes all got together and destroyed the hedge funders who were shorting Gamestop? And everybody said they didn't understand finance, that's not the way they game is played? But they didn't care about the RULES, and they went on and save Gamestop, and put an end to shortselling vulturism forever and saved capitalism and all got super-rich in the process?

    Sarcasm?

  • NeuMNeuM

    @richardyot said:
    Coinbase fined $6.5 million by the CFTC for wash-trading and false reporting, you can read the settlement here, section C3 is particularly good, on some days the wash-trading accounted for 99% of all trading volume:

    https://t.co/u4pKNdKw58?amp=1

    Again, you seem to be conflating a crypto exchange allegedly failing to properly report something with the viability (or lack thereof) of crypto in general? If so, it’s a deeply flawed argument.

  • ashhashh

    @nerVe said:

    @ashh said:

    @nerVe said:
    There’s a lot of cognitive dissonance within discussions of currency. I see it as a result of socioeconomic conditioning from the military industrial complex. Decentralization is inevitable, the sooner the better…

    Interesting. I am familiar with cognitive dissonance, in a personal and wider context... However, I'm not clear about your opinion on social conditioning by the military industrial complex. Would you mind expanding on that?

    Historically periods of global deflation like we are seeing today, result and resolve through war. Nationalism with all types of propaganda, rhetoric, and political chaos like we have been seeing over and over….It will be different this time, it already is…Financial technologies and open minded regulation is finally emerging as a viable way forward to resolve and reset the wildly irresponsible and wasteful mess that has long arisen.

    Isn't cyber-war taking over? That we are already in conflict with numerous countries via the web?

  • NeuMNeuM

    @nerVe said:

    @ashh said:

    @nerVe said:
    There’s a lot of cognitive dissonance within discussions of currency. I see it as a result of socioeconomic conditioning from the military industrial complex. Decentralization is inevitable, the sooner the better…

    Interesting. I am familiar with cognitive dissonance, in a personal and wider context... However, I'm not clear about your opinion on social conditioning by the military industrial complex. Would you mind expanding on that?

    Historically periods of global deflation like we are seeing today, result and resolve through war. Nationalism with all types of propaganda, rhetoric, and political chaos like we have been seeing over and over….It will be different this time, it already is…Financial technologies and open minded regulation is finally emerging as a viable way forward to resolve and reset the wildly irresponsible and wasteful mess that has long arisen.

    You may already know this, but the anonymous creator(s) of Bitcoin (Satoshi Nakamoto) appears to be a Libertarian and he (or they) cited the financial collapse and the bailouts of “too big to fail” financial institutions as the inciting event for the creation of a new kind of peer-to-peer money with no central banking or printing authority.

This discussion has been closed.