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MIDI CC controlled MIDI note filter -- exists? (or scripts?) -- <<The answer was Mozaic>>

I'm looking to set up an AU MIDI node (preferably) that'll conditionally block specific MIDI notes on a single channel from passing though, conditional to a specific CC (per note) being on or off.

I'm guessing that it might be a StreamByter/Mozaic task, but I'm curious as to whether anyone could recommend any other quick/easy/cheap solutions.

Cheers,
Oscar

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Comments

  • It sounds a little like filter mode in ScaleBud.

  • @mojozart said:
    It sounds a little like filter mode in ScaleBud.

    Thanks for the response. I had a look through that app's description, but I'm not sure if it'll do what I'm talking about -- there are 12 MIDI notes in question, which span over a chromatic octave (they're for percussive sounds, not pitch information) and require individual mutes on each note number.

    Thanks for having a look though, and ScaleBud also looks like a cool little app from the description!

  • wimwim
    edited February 7

    I'm sure I could modify https://patchstorage.com/simple-scaler/ to do this if you don't find something else.

  • I decided to add this ability to Simple Scaler v2.2. It's disabled by default. See the @Description and @Settings sections for details of how to turn it on and how to set the CC's and channels used.

  • @wim said:
    I decided to add this ability to Simple Scaler v2.2. It's disabled by default. See the @Description and @Settings sections for details of how to turn it on and how to set the CC's and channels used.

    Looks like it’s time to get into Mozaic! Thanks for doing this.

  • @OscarSouth said:

    @wim said:
    I decided to add this ability to Simple Scaler v2.2. It's disabled by default. See the @Description and @Settings sections for details of how to turn it on and how to set the CC's and channels used.

    Looks like it’s time to get into Mozaic! Thanks for doing this.

    No problem. Please don't feel any obligation to use it, or even to try it out. It was a good enhancement and easy to do, so I decided to add it whether or not you ended up trying it.

  • @wim said:

    @OscarSouth said:

    @wim said:
    I decided to add this ability to Simple Scaler v2.2. It's disabled by default. See the @Description and @Settings sections for details of how to turn it on and how to set the CC's and channels used.

    Looks like it’s time to get into Mozaic! Thanks for doing this.

    No problem. Please don't feel any obligation to use it, or even to try it out. It was a good enhancement and easy to do, so I decided to add it whether or not you ended up trying it.

    If your tool does what I need, then there is no other path. The music is my master!

  • If anyone's looking for a simple Drambo version:

    Map the MIDI Mixer mutes to MIDI CC as required. Both toggle and momentary modes are supported.

  • @rs2000 Good idea to use the mutes to selectively pass each note. But shouldn't the MIDI Note Filters all be connected to the source (blue), rather than daisy-chained? Also, it's important to point out that there's no MIDI to CV in this, it's just straight MIDI.

  • @uncledave said:
    @rs2000 Good idea to use the mutes to selectively pass each note. But shouldn't the MIDI Note Filters all be connected to the source (blue), rather than daisy-chained? Also, it's important to point out that there's no MIDI to CV in this, it's just straight MIDI.

    Find the error. 100 points for you 👏🏼🏆🍻

  • edited February 8

    @wim said:
    I'm sure I could modify https://patchstorage.com/simple-scaler/ to do this if you don't find something else.

    Does this script work across multiple midi channels? So, it can scale across any notes coming midi channels before passing them to the same original channel?

  • @auxmux said:

    @wim said:
    I'm sure I could modify https://patchstorage.com/simple-scaler/ to do this if you don't find something else.

    Does this script work across multiple midi channels? So, it can scale across any notes coming midi channels before passing them to the same original channel?

    Yes, you have the choice whether to pass the channel through, or to merge all channels into another channel of choice.

  • Hey @OscarSouth - there's one important caveat about that script. It has no stuck note detection. So, if a note is still playing when you mute it, the note-off will be blocked, resulting in a stuck note.

    If that's a problem, you might want to wait a bit. I plan to add stuck-note prevention today or tomorrow.

  • @wim said:

    @auxmux said:

    @wim said:
    I'm sure I could modify https://patchstorage.com/simple-scaler/ to do this if you don't find something else.

    Does this script work across multiple midi channels? So, it can scale across any notes coming midi channels before passing them to the same original channel?

    Yes, you have the choice whether to pass the channel through, or to merge all channels into another channel of choice.

    Awesome, thanks! This will be handy.

  • @wim said:
    Hey @OscarSouth - there's one important caveat about that script. It has no stuck note detection. So, if a note is still playing when you mute it, the note-off will be blocked, resulting in a stuck note.

    If that's a problem, you might want to wait a bit. I plan to add stuck-note prevention today or tomorrow.

    Just working on getting this set up now. Quick question -- is the stuck note thing something I still need to watch out for? I don't know if it'll matter as it's a drum machine triggering one shots, you never now -- something sneaky might happen.

  • @OscarSouth said:

    @wim said:
    Hey @OscarSouth - there's one important caveat about that script. It has no stuck note detection. So, if a note is still playing when you mute it, the note-off will be blocked, resulting in a stuck note.

    If that's a problem, you might want to wait a bit. I plan to add stuck-note prevention today or tomorrow.

    Just working on getting this set up now. Quick question -- is the stuck note thing something I still need to watch out for? I don't know if it'll matter as it's a drum machine triggering one shots, you never now -- something sneaky might happen.

    Probably won't be a problem, but I'll get the stuck note stuff put in there today just in case. I got pulled aside for some family issues this last week, but can sit down to some coding today. Shouldn't be a big job. Then you shouldn't have to worry.

  • @wim said:

    @OscarSouth said:

    @wim said:
    Hey @OscarSouth - there's one important caveat about that script. It has no stuck note detection. So, if a note is still playing when you mute it, the note-off will be blocked, resulting in a stuck note.

    If that's a problem, you might want to wait a bit. I plan to add stuck-note prevention today or tomorrow.

    Just working on getting this set up now. Quick question -- is the stuck note thing something I still need to watch out for? I don't know if it'll matter as it's a drum machine triggering one shots, you never now -- something sneaky might happen.

    Probably won't be a problem, but I'll get the stuck note stuff put in there today just in case. I got pulled aside for some family issues this last week, but can sit down to some coding today. Shouldn't be a big job. Then you shouldn't have to worry.

    Awesome, cheers! I'm getting to grips with it now. There's a lot of things I've wanted to do with MIDI that and not had the tool under my fingers to make that happen -- time to bring out those ideas!

  • Does exactly what I need! The CC filtering is a really cool functionality and gets a lot of additional mileage out of drum machine preset patterns. I'm using it to block notes from a drum machine from reaching Koala Sampler. Thanks!

  • Oh @wim, the note off thing is definitely doing something sneaky as pads in Koala are getting stuck down.

  • @OscarSouth said:
    Oh @wim, the note off thing is definitely doing something sneaky as pads in Koala are getting stuck down.

    .. or actually, I'm not sure if this isn't something different. It's working perfectly in terms of performing (which is what counts) but if you look at Koala, the pads are toggling down when one hit come in and then untoggling after the next. This is even when the CC mutes aren't being touched (goes away if Mozaic is muted) so there's some weird behaviour change of the MIDI notes being passed through going on. Hopefully this is useful info for you!

  • wimwim
    edited February 16

    @OscarSouth said:

    @OscarSouth said:
    Oh @wim, the note off thing is definitely doing something sneaky as pads in Koala are getting stuck down.

    .. or actually, I'm not sure if this isn't something different. It's working perfectly in terms of performing (which is what counts) but if you look at Koala, the pads are toggling down when one hit come in and then untoggling after the next. This is even when the CC mutes aren't being touched (goes away if Mozaic is muted) so there's some weird behaviour change of the MIDI notes being passed through going on. Hopefully this is useful info for you!

    The script doesn't modify note behavior at all. It only filters notes. But, it does sound as though the note filter is being changed between the note-on and the note-off. As noted earlier, if you play a note-on, then turn on the filter, the note-off will never be received.

    I can modify the script to prevent this in most cases, but it would be better if the solution was found up-stream. i.e. wait until after the note-off is sent to toggle the note filter. It's never good to trust software to overcome bad midi behavior.

    Of course, this is all supposition without seeing before script and after script midi cc logs and with no way to test. But, this script has had a lot of use, and if it was buggy, I'm pretty sure I'd know by now. (I've said that before and found I was wrong though, of course. :D )

    Anyway, off to check it out now. Got a few balls in the air today, so it might be a bit.

  • @wim said:

    @OscarSouth said:

    @OscarSouth said:
    Oh @wim, the note off thing is definitely doing something sneaky as pads in Koala are getting stuck down.

    .. or actually, I'm not sure if this isn't something different. It's working perfectly in terms of performing (which is what counts) but if you look at Koala, the pads are toggling down when one hit come in and then untoggling after the next. This is even when the CC mutes aren't being touched (goes away if Mozaic is muted) so there's some weird behaviour change of the MIDI notes being passed through going on. Hopefully this is useful info for you!

    The script doesn't modify note behavior at all. It only filters notes. But, it does sound as though the note filter is being changed between the note-on and the note-off. As noted earlier, if you play a note-on, then turn on the filter, the note-off will never be received.

    I can modify the script to prevent this in most cases, but it would be better if the solution was found up-stream. i.e. wait until after the note-off is sent to toggle the note filter. It's never good to trust software to overcome bad midi behavior.

    Of course, this is all supposition without seeing before script and after script midi cc logs and with no way to test. But, this script has had a lot of use, and if it was buggy, I'm pretty sure I'd know by now. (I've said that before and found I was wrong though, of course. :D )

    Anyway, off to check it out now. Got a few balls in the air today, so it might be a bit.

    No worries! It plays back fine for me anyway, since I'm using triggers and one shots.

    I'll explore more and post up some MIDI note logs here. I don't think it's connected to the CC toggle interaction though, because I can leave the toggles completely alone and the behaviour will continue, but if I mute Mozaic it'll go back to normal. Will reboot my system and reload everything then explore a bit more.

  • _ki_ki
    edited February 16

    When muting Mozaic in AUM by sliding the icon to the left, AUM will send out NoteOff for all active notes send out by that Mozaic instance. I know this from a technical discussion with the AUM author.
    BTW this is also the case when disabling a connection in AUMs midi matrix or unticking a midi input in the popup of AUv3s - all AUM midi connections internally store a list of active notes/channels to be able to generate that note-off list to prevent hanging notes when ‚muting‘ / unconnecting midi sources.

    So it‘s likely there is a hanging note-off when applying the CC mute switch while a note is sustained, as @wim already mentioned. The script would need to track all note-on/offs for all channels and on muting, send out note-offs for sustained notes on the muted channels.

  • @_ki said:
    When muting Mozaic in AUM by sliding the icon to the left, AUM will send out NoteOff for all active notes send out by that Mozaic instance. I know this from a technical discussion with the AUM author.
    BTW this is also the case when disabling a connection in AUMs midi matrix or unticking a midi input in the popup of AUv3s - all AUM midi connections internally store a list of active notes/channels to be able to generate that note-off list to prevent hanging notes when ‚muting‘ / unconnecting midi sources.

    So it‘s likely there is a hanging note-off when applying the CC mute switch while a note is sustained, as @wim already mentioned. The script would need to track all note-on/offs for all channels and on muting, send out note-offs for sustained notes on the muted channels.

    My intuition says it isn’t this as it behaves like this if I don’t touch the CCs at all. Didn’t go back and have a closer look yet though. I’m using AudioBus.

  • _ki_ki
    edited February 16

    Ok - the mute/unconnect info was for AUM. I just checked the behavior of muting an midi generator like Mozaic in Audiobus:

    When pressing the mute button for a midi source AUv3 on the audio page of AudioBus, no further note-on‘s of the midi source AUv3 will be transmitted - but all note-offs are still delivered.

  • Well, anyway, that script really should have stuck note prevention. Still pulled off on other things for a couple of ours, but later I can add it. That might make the troubleshooting easier.

  • @wim said:
    Well, anyway, that script really should have stuck note prevention. Still pulled off on other things for a couple of ours, but later I can add it. That might make the troubleshooting easier.

    Seems like this weird note on/off behaviour is not related to the CC mapping — I tested with CC filters off and the behaviour persisted. It stops immediately when Mozaic is bypassed. Here’s a video to demonstrate:

  • What would be really helpful is if you could send a midi spy or other capture before and after the mozaic script. All I can do without replicating your exact setup is to see if what comes out is correct based on what goes in. If so, the it's a Koala or other setup issue. If not, the bug should be easy enough to find.

  • @wim said:
    What would be really helpful is if you could send a midi spy or other capture before and after the mozaic script. All I can do without replicating your exact setup is to see if what comes out is correct based on what goes in. If so, the it's a Koala or other setup issue. If not, the bug should be easy enough to find.

    I’ll do that tomorrow. Slipped my mind tonight as it was a bit late already.

  • wimwim
    edited February 17

    @OscarSouth said:

    @wim said:
    What would be really helpful is if you could send a midi spy or other capture before and after the mozaic script. All I can do without replicating your exact setup is to see if what comes out is correct based on what goes in. If so, the it's a Koala or other setup issue. If not, the bug should be easy enough to find.

    I’ll do that tomorrow. Slipped my mind tonight as it was a bit late already.

    Maybe don't bother spending too much time on it. I need to add the stuck note stuff anyway.

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