Audiobus: Use your music apps together.

What is Audiobus?Audiobus is an award-winning music app for iPhone and iPad which lets you use your other music apps together. Chain effects on your favourite synth, run the output of apps or Audio Units into an app like GarageBand or Loopy, or select a different audio interface output for each app. Route MIDI between apps — drive a synth from a MIDI sequencer, or add an arpeggiator to your MIDI keyboard — or sync with your external MIDI gear. And control your entire setup from a MIDI controller.

Download on the App Store

Audiobus is the app that makes the rest of your setup better.

Anyone using iOS AUv3s the Mac, seriously?

Now that Moog Model 15 is a full universal app, available on iPhone, iPad, and Mac, I wonder if anyone is using iOS Audio Units on their M1 Macs full time?

I played with them at the beginning, but it was all a bit flaky. That said, I do use Eventide's AUs quite a bit.

Also, anyone sideloading "unauthorized" AUs?

Comments

  • @mistercharlie said:
    Now that Moog Model 15 is a full universal app, available on iPhone, iPad, and Mac, I wonder if anyone is using iOS Audio Units on their M1 Macs full time?

    I played with them at the beginning, but it was all a bit flaky. That said, I do use Eventide's AUs quite a bit.

    Also, anyone sideloading "unauthorized" AUs?

    I 'tried' some of them. But if I'm informed correctly, since Big Sur 11.2 beta2 the sideloading fun is over. Only the 'activated by the developer' apps still work on BS, like Model 15 and Drambo. It was too good to be true.

  • Synthmaster One works great! I use it in GarageBand, Live Lite, and FL Studio.
    miRack is also very good. For use in the above apps, the developer has provided a "legacy" version that works in the above hosts. I think it must have some AUv3 to AU bridging code because the straight-up Catalyst derived versions wouldn't load in these hosts. Apparently the non-legacy AUv3's work in Logic though.

  • @Pierre118 said:

    @mistercharlie said:
    Now that Moog Model 15 is a full universal app, available on iPhone, iPad, and Mac, I wonder if anyone is using iOS Audio Units on their M1 Macs full time?

    I played with them at the beginning, but it was all a bit flaky. That said, I do use Eventide's AUs quite a bit.

    Also, anyone sideloading "unauthorized" AUs?

    I 'tried' some of them. But if I'm informed correctly, since Big Sur 11.2 beta2 the sideloading fun is over. Only the 'activated by the developer' apps still work on BS, like Model 15 and Drambo. It was too good to be true.

    Apparently the sideloading nix is not in 11.2 beta 2 but server side and universal regardless of OS.

  • edited January 21

    The good news is that any apps you’ve already sideloaded should keep working. No updates though.

  • Am I right to think that "sideloading" business is what I was doing with that imazing app?

  • I'm very confused by this. That article is a year old...

    So for a year now, Apple have enabled apps to be Universal by default...i.e. buy it once and it can be used on iPad OS, iOS & Mac OS but there's only one or two developers doing this?

  • 5> @BitterGums said:

    So for a year now, Apple have enabled apps to be Universal by default...i.e. buy it once and it can be used on iPad OS, iOS & Mac OS but there's only one or two developers doing this?

    Yep. That universality was part of the design thinking behind the M1 chip ... what Apple promised and still promise today... . but the Apple business model is once again throttling the brilliant capacity of the technology.

    Seems most developers have chosen to see this as a threat rather than an opportunity... just can't work out how to monetise their ios assets in awildly distorted market. Bigly sad. More imagination required. It's an IAP surely?

  • wimwim
    edited January 21

    @Soundscaper said:
    Seems most developers have chosen to see this as a threat rather than an opportunity... just can't work out how to monetise their ios assets in awildly distorted market. Bigly sad. More imagination required. It's an IAP surely?

    That's too cynical IMO. If you developed an app that either didn't work well or that you weren't sure would work well on MacOS, would you want to put it out there for people to have a poor experience with? If you didn't make enough from your rocking iOS development money-machine to justify purchasing a brand new M1 Mac (Which probably describes 90% of iOS developers), would you skip paying next month's rent to pick one up so you have something to test/debug with? If all your spare time was already taken up trying to keep up with bugs and feature requests for iOS alone, would you put those plans on hold to spend what could be many, many hours to refine your app so that the relatively tiny slice of the music market that today own an M1 Mac could benefit from those hours ... for free? When you've been burned by Apple breaking something or other in your apps in iOS update after iOS update for years, would you be anxious to jump on the train in the first iteration of the technology?

    C'mon. Nobody is getting rich off of iOS apps as it is. I'm more surprised by those that do choose to opt-in than those that don't.

  • @Soundscaper said:
    5> @BitterGums said:

    So for a year now, Apple have enabled apps to be Universal by default...i.e. buy it once and it can be used on iPad OS, iOS & Mac OS but there's only one or two developers doing this?

    Yep. That universality was part of the design thinking behind the M1 chip ... what Apple promised and still promise today... . but the Apple business model is once again throttling the brilliant capacity of the technology.

    Seems most developers have chosen to see this as a threat rather than an opportunity... just can't work out how to monetise their ios assets in awildly distorted market. Bigly sad. More imagination required. It's an IAP surely?

    There are two different things that are related but not completely the same thing. Apple has had the Mac Catalyst thing in the works for some time now. The ability to run iOS apps on the M1 Macs is new.

    For an app to use Catalyst, the developer has to enable it in Xcode and possibly do some modifications to the app to get it to run on the Mac. Running iOS apps on the M1 Macs doesn't require any involvement of the dev at all.

    Enabling Catalyst also has the benefit of making the iOS app run on Intel based Macs. The biggest difference between the two is that the Catalyst port of the iOS app is actually a full Mac app.

    The thing that surprised me was that when I enabled my AUv3 plugins to work as a Catalyst app it actually worked. The AU is actually seen on the Mac as a Mac AUv3. This isn't the same as running an iOS AUv3 on an M1 Mac as an iOS AU. There are a couple of ways you can tell that it's different. One is that the sandbox is working as a Mac sandboxed app and not with specially mounted sandboxed disk partitions. The more important differences is that the UI bugs that cause the AU crashes are gone.

    One thing that using Catalyst to do the port doesn't enable is the ability to run the AU in process in the host. There are some hosts that won't work with out-of-process plugins. So, the Catalyst plugins won't work in these. I'm kinda surprised to see FL Studio mentioned as a host that can run sandboxed AU's. Is this a confirmed thing? I'm assuming that the port of Moog Model 15 is a Catalyst port so it is sandboxed. Does anyone know if this is the case?

  • @NeonSilicon said:

    @Soundscaper said:
    5> @BitterGums said:

    So for a year now, Apple have enabled apps to be Universal by default...i.e. buy it once and it can be used on iPad OS, iOS & Mac OS but there's only one or two developers doing this?

    Yep. That universality was part of the design thinking behind the M1 chip ... what Apple promised and still promise today... . but the Apple business model is once again throttling the brilliant capacity of the technology.

    Seems most developers have chosen to see this as a threat rather than an opportunity... just can't work out how to monetise their ios assets in awildly distorted market. Bigly sad. More imagination required. It's an IAP surely?

    There are two different things that are related but not completely the same thing. Apple has had the Mac Catalyst thing in the works for some time now. The ability to run iOS apps on the M1 Macs is new.

    For an app to use Catalyst, the developer has to enable it in Xcode and possibly do some modifications to the app to get it to run on the Mac. Running iOS apps on the M1 Macs doesn't require any involvement of the dev at all.

    Enabling Catalyst also has the benefit of making the iOS app run on Intel based Macs. The biggest difference between the two is that the Catalyst port of the iOS app is actually a full Mac app.

    The thing that surprised me was that when I enabled my AUv3 plugins to work as a Catalyst app it actually worked. The AU is actually seen on the Mac as a Mac AUv3. This isn't the same as running an iOS AUv3 on an M1 Mac as an iOS AU. There are a couple of ways you can tell that it's different. One is that the sandbox is working as a Mac sandboxed app and not with specially mounted sandboxed disk partitions. The more important differences is that the UI bugs that cause the AU crashes are gone.

    One thing that using Catalyst to do the port doesn't enable is the ability to run the AU in process in the host. There are some hosts that won't work with out-of-process plugins. So, the Catalyst plugins won't work in these. I'm kinda surprised to see FL Studio mentioned as a host that can run sandboxed AU's. Is this a confirmed thing? I'm assuming that the port of Moog Model 15 is a Catalyst port so it is sandboxed. Does anyone know if this is the case?

    FL Studio can’t run Model 15. I don’t know if it’s due to sandboxing though. I assumed it was because FL Studio and Ableton Live can’t run AUv3’s, only AU’s. The miRack developer released a bridged “legacy” version that can load in Live and FL Studio, where the AUv3 versions can’t.

  • @wim said:

    @NeonSilicon said:

    @Soundscaper said:
    5> @BitterGums said:

    So for a year now, Apple have enabled apps to be Universal by default...i.e. buy it once and it can be used on iPad OS, iOS & Mac OS but there's only one or two developers doing this?

    Yep. That universality was part of the design thinking behind the M1 chip ... what Apple promised and still promise today... . but the Apple business model is once again throttling the brilliant capacity of the technology.

    Seems most developers have chosen to see this as a threat rather than an opportunity... just can't work out how to monetise their ios assets in awildly distorted market. Bigly sad. More imagination required. It's an IAP surely?

    There are two different things that are related but not completely the same thing. Apple has had the Mac Catalyst thing in the works for some time now. The ability to run iOS apps on the M1 Macs is new.

    For an app to use Catalyst, the developer has to enable it in Xcode and possibly do some modifications to the app to get it to run on the Mac. Running iOS apps on the M1 Macs doesn't require any involvement of the dev at all.

    Enabling Catalyst also has the benefit of making the iOS app run on Intel based Macs. The biggest difference between the two is that the Catalyst port of the iOS app is actually a full Mac app.

    The thing that surprised me was that when I enabled my AUv3 plugins to work as a Catalyst app it actually worked. The AU is actually seen on the Mac as a Mac AUv3. This isn't the same as running an iOS AUv3 on an M1 Mac as an iOS AU. There are a couple of ways you can tell that it's different. One is that the sandbox is working as a Mac sandboxed app and not with specially mounted sandboxed disk partitions. The more important differences is that the UI bugs that cause the AU crashes are gone.

    One thing that using Catalyst to do the port doesn't enable is the ability to run the AU in process in the host. There are some hosts that won't work with out-of-process plugins. So, the Catalyst plugins won't work in these. I'm kinda surprised to see FL Studio mentioned as a host that can run sandboxed AU's. Is this a confirmed thing? I'm assuming that the port of Moog Model 15 is a Catalyst port so it is sandboxed. Does anyone know if this is the case?

    FL Studio can’t run Model 15. I don’t know if it’s due to sandboxing though. I assumed it was because FL Studio and Ableton Live can’t run AUv3’s, only AU’s. The miRack developer released a bridged “legacy” version that can load in Live and FL Studio, where the AUv3 versions can’t.

    I see. That makes more sense to me. I was expecting them to be in the group of hosts that hadn't updated to enable AUv3. I'm sensing a bit of a bumpy ride while this all shakes out --- again. I've got to say though, from a programmer point-of-view, Apple's done a really good job with Catalyst. It's much better than I expected before I tried it.

  • @Soundscaper said:

    Am I right to think that "sideloading" business is what I was doing with that imazing app?

    Yes.

  • @wim said:

    C'mon. Nobody is getting rich off of iOS apps as it is. I'm more surprised by those that do choose to opt-in than those that don't.

    I suspect that getting universal ios apps into the laptops of a different market segment - a market where punters pay a serious premium for apps - would do something to address the big fish small pond problem for ios developers Wim ... might even be able to buy a decent M1 themselves.

    Too timid by half you lot ... if your gear works on iOS it'll work on an M1... it just works as Apple says.

    IOS developers are doing the most innovative and imaginative work in sound and music today ... they deserve a wider, more lucrative, audience.

  • @Soundscaper said:

    @wim said:

    C'mon. Nobody is getting rich off of iOS apps as it is. I'm more surprised by those that do choose to opt-in than those that don't.

    I suspect that getting universal ios apps into the laptops of a different market segment - a market where punters pay a serious premium for apps - would do something to address the big fish small pond problem for ios developers Wim ... might even be able to buy a decent M1 themselves.

    I think you seriously misunderstand the relative markets. The formula is actually the opposite.

    Too timid by half you lot ... if your gear works on iOS it'll work on an M1... it just works as Apple says.

    False. Maybe some day, but there are serious issues at this stage.

    IOS developers are doing the most innovative and imaginative work in sound and music today ... they deserve a wider, more lucrative, audience.

    Can't argue there. But I don't think this does much to help that along ... yet.

    But, those are just my opinions. I won't debate ya' further on it. B) ✌🏼

  • edited January 22

    Thanks for the info all. i'm glad to hear first hand that Catalyst works. For the most part at least.

    @NeonSilicon Non coder here. What do you mean by 'the ability to run the AU in process in the host.' ?

    I understand the reluctancy for devs to jump on this. Or i used to more so...But after reading more about it it seems like making your app or AUv3 available to the Mac market opens up sales considerably. Perhaps it's the whole M1 shift that has delayed things though.. and the ability to properly test things out first.

    @wim IDK. I looked up some financial information on Intua at one point ...when they had been radio silent for way too long, right after Mattheu left and Vincent came aboard...and.. a lot more $$ had changed hands than I ever would have guessed. That said, BM3 is constantly in the top 10 paid apps in the App Store. So sort of an outlier.

  • @BitterGums said:
    Thanks for the info all. i'm glad to hear first hand that Catalyst works. For the most part at least.

    @NeonSilicon Non coder here. What do you mean by 'the ability to run the AU in process in the host.' ?

    I understand the reluctancy for devs to jump on this. Or i used to more so...But after reading more about it it seems like making your app or AUv3 available to the Mac market opens up sales considerably. Perhaps it's the whole M1 shift that has delayed things though.. and the ability to properly test things out first.

    @wim IDK. I looked up some financial information on Intua at one point ...when they had been radio silent for way too long, right after Mattheu left and Vincent came aboard...and.. a lot more $$ had changed hands than I ever would have guessed. That said, BM3 is constantly in the top 10 paid apps in the App Store. So sort of an outlier.

    Running in-process basically means that you are running the plugin in the same application space as the host. The host loads the plugin as a shared library and the code execution is in the host application space on the CPU. In a sandboxed AUv3, the plugin is running as a separate application (process really -- but application is close enough). If you look at the Activity Monitor app in macOS, each out-of-process AuV3 will show up as its own process. An in-process AU won't show up because its processing is occurring in the host process space.

    There are upsides and downsides to this. The biggest upside is from a security perspective. The host can be granted file and other system access that the plugin doesn't need and you (the user) don't have to trust me (the AU dev) not to dig through your files because Logic needs to. It also means that a crashing AU shouldn't bring down the host. Somewhat strangely, Logic doesn't seem to pay attention to this and still makes you restart everything if a sandboxed AU crashes. The big downside is that as the host/system calls each AU to process the frame of audio data, it has to do a context switch. It has to unload the host or current plugin from the CPU and cache and load the setup for the new plugin. This causes a really small amount of additional latency, in the 10 to 40 microsecond range. But, when you have to do thousands of these to process 48kHz data across a bunch of plugins, it adds up. My guess is that at some point, all AUv3's on macOS will be required to be sandboxed just like they are on iOS. The benefits out-weigh the downside.

    The dynamics of macOS versus iOS for app developers is complex. Trying to figure out what is the right approach as a dev just makes me want to go and make guitar pedals again.

  • Sideloading is back (for how long?)! Also, while I've not tested them all, most of the 4Pockets apps load up and work in Hosting AU. Quite a few IAA apps work as well. If you have Loopback, you can also use the AUv3's in Standalone with a virtual device.

  • @Soundscaper said:
    Too timid by half you lot ... if your gear works on iOS it'll work on an M1... it just works as Apple says.

    🤣

    Try it and get back to us.

  • @NeonSilicon said:

    [ Running in-process basically means that you are running the plugin in the same application space as the host. The host ...]

    Holy smokes. Thank you. I really appreciate the explanation. Not sure how..but that all made complete sense. Never read a more succinct couple of paragraphs. And.. you ended up answering the only question i had while reading. . how it was done in iOS. sandboxed

  • Good Morning, thanks for the information. Cant run moog model 15 on iOS 11. Sad but at least ALL my other DAW work and never crashes. I have a terrible time with Mac updates, I think some have same problem. Also, The cable dragging modular aspect with a mouse doesn't appeal like how mi rack dies in my heart without the touchscreen....

  • I would....if developers could make them work. So far now Model 15 and miRack are the only one working but that might be that they already are officially optimised for Mac.
    So far no of the iOS AUv3 runs fine on my M1.
    Like I already said, I know they are not optimised for Mac but I still wished developers would simply opt-out or make it work.

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