Audiobus: Use your music apps together.
What is Audiobus? — Audiobus is an award-winning music app for iPhone and iPad which lets you use your other music apps together. Chain effects on your favourite synth, run the output of apps or Audio Units into an app like GarageBand or Loopy, or select a different audio interface output for each app. Route MIDI between apps — drive a synth from a MIDI sequencer, or add an arpeggiator to your MIDI keyboard — or sync with your external MIDI gear. And control your entire setup from a MIDI controller.
Download on the App StoreAudiobus is the app that makes the rest of your setup better.
It's time for me to start listing to music (more so)
All kinds of music! And so I have just let YouTube randomly run on a laptop and used either my home stereo speakers or studio monitors or iLoud Bluetooth speaker. All of this is fine, but it has some drawbacks. It's not quite as mobile as I'd like given it's limited by my home Wi-Fi range, and it’s not hi-fidelity because YouTube is bandwidth constrained.
I've got lots of higher end headphones (wired and Bluetooth) plus I have an iPhone and some iPads and other laptops etc. so I am not lacking for hardware (outside of a portable headphone amp which might be nice).
What web-based sources do you guys use to listen to and/or watch in order to expand your musical horizons, learn new tunes, or just have fun listening?
Since I am not lacking for hardware, my questions more relate to where you get your music from and the quality of the digital formatting, and not so much your hardware (although that's interesting too). For example do you guys use the invasive and dreaded iTunes, or perhaps Spotify, or Amazon Music, do you pay for it, do you use a number of sources, how do you store it, how do you sort it, how do you assure everything is of the highest fidelity? Do you download or stream it via YouTube, and suffer the limited fidelity?
I am not really interested in listening to unknown artists trying to make it (no matter how good they are). I am most interested in well established artists (dead or alive), many genres inclusive of but not limited to classical, jazz, pop, folk, blues, vocal, funk, surf, avant garde, rock, bluegrass, country, world, pop, etc.
I have no interest at all in listening to dance, trance, rap, hip hop, trip hop, house, acid, drum machines, sequenced patterns, layers of sequenced synths, big bass drum, TR808 sounds, TR707 sounds, TB303 sounds, samples, loops, auto-tuning and pitch correction, copy-paste, overly compressed material with no dynamics, everything perfectly synced at 120 BPM, overly processed material, overly effected material, overly distorted material, etc.
I'm most interested in accomplished professional musicians expertly playing their instruments and/or singing. Real-time or overdubbed, live performance or studio. Most any kind of machine / sequenced / sampled / looped music, no matter how carefully crafted, usually leaves me cold when trying to listen to it for fun or for learning. Not that I am posting to denigrate anyone's preferences when either listening to or learning from music.
Much obliged, The Isolationist Pup
Comments
Check out NPR's Tiny Desk series, they have a pretty diverse group of musicians that come to play and they are usually really good. The Goat Rodeo one is one of my favorite performances so far:
Thanks man, I have watched it from time to time but the fidelity is lacking (YouTube again) the musicianship is variable and the artists are generally unknowns as are the tunes. To each their own mind you, but I’d much rather listen to established artists (dead or alive) and popular tunes such as by John Coltrane or Bach or Carlos Santana or Zappa (for just a very-very few examples) but again if I use YouTube the fidelity is lacking (convenient and fun though it is).
Pretty sure Apple Music is your best bet for sound quality. I’ll goof up the details but I read up on this at one point (there was a time where Spotify sound quality was as top of the food chain I believe). Long story longer - Apple Music now smokes the rest
I’ve got something for you. It’s called Live From Daryl’s House. (Daryl Hall from Hall and Oates) It’s a show, I’m guessing originally on some cable channel (VH1/MTV?) where he invites well known artists from all genres to his place in New York to play music, eat, and have fun.
In this episode, Daryl invites Tommy Shaw of Styx and oh man... I don’t care if you’re a Styx fan or not, this guy shows up with just a Les Paul and a microphone and shows what real musicianship is all about! At 67 years old, that voice!! Wow! He even surprised Daryl Hall when he started singing! Tommy Shaw is truly one of the most underrated artists of our time IMO!
I just discovered this a couple days ago myself, by stumbling across an episode on YouTube, and I’m hooked!
You can find the whole episode here, where they do a few other Styx songs including Renegade, Too Much Time on My Hands and more!
https://www.livefromdarylshouse.com/currentep.html?ep_id=99
Apple music.
tidal, high quality. not cheap
I think that Apple Music is still lossy. I don’t know why they don’t stream lossless, particularly since they have their own lossless format that they could use.
Amazon HD is good. Even their regular flac is high quality, but they also have ultra HD for a small percentage of their music.
If you don’t mind the price then Roon Labs is a great option. The trial is fully featured. They aren’t picky about giving you another free trial every once in a while. If you want to stick with Roon then it costs $120 a year, or you can buy it for keeps for $700. They aren’t shy about being expensive. I’ve gone with the year option a few times. I might spring for the $700 soon.
The audio quality is part of the appeal of Roon. The interface is probably the biggest advantage over the other options. It really is pretty on a big screen. It also has beautiful navigation. The integration of Roon and Tidal is impressive.
JRiver doesn’t look anywhere near as slick as Roon Labs, but JRiver is big on audio quality and features and customization. The price is a huge bargain for what you get, and it also handles video. They added a lossless streaming option called CloudPlay that’s a completely different take on music streaming. They have a great forum full of audio experts.
At least half of what I listen to is too obscure to be on Spotify or Apple Music or Amazon. Most of the rare stuff went out of print long ago and will probably never make it to streaming services. I’ve ripped thousands of rare albums onto a Synology raid server for streaming to various rooms and devices.
Ok here’s my take on fidelity and “audiophiles”. When I grew up, I discovered music through devices like my mom’s am/fm clock radio in the kitchen, my dad’s 8-track player, or the console “hi-fi” in the living room. What was the problem then you ask? There WASN’T one! Everything sounded awesome!
In my opinion, real musicians don’t need Hi Def Audio, because we can already hear everything just fine. Hi Def, expensive audio systems are for non musicians and people that don’t have an ear for music. It’s actually not only _ my_ opinion, just Google “Musicians are not audiophiles”.
Hello Intrepolicious,
Yep I have been watching Live From Daryl’s House for some years now, however as to your views that "real musicians don’t need…" I can tell you that I am 65 and have been a working musician for decades (not anymore though) and I very much appreciate higher quality sound reproduction, always have always will. I love the subtle nuance of higher fidelity, I love the lower distortion levels similarly. When I was young I never liked listening to my tube clock radio or tube record player, and in fact my dad had the first electrostatic Quad speakers etc. and I would spend as much time as I could listening to them, instead of all the other crap.
When I played live (mostly as a solo act) I would always buy the best PA gear I could afford, I did and still can tell the difference, although with modern powered speakers even the lower cost systems are pretty good at moderate SPL's.
He is using sampler so it might not fit your requirements. But, Andrew Bird is such an accomplished musician. I had the chance to open in France for him and Lambchop more than 15 years ago. One of my best memories ever.
Yeah, definitely debatable but I tend to agree with you. This applies to all areas in life where drive for perfection kills other aspects like emotion. Of course there’s no reason not to have both but from experience perfection doesn’t actually come from perfection. This is why Nirvana or Dylan made such waves in society and also why so many of us use sound degrading techniques in our music.
Two words
Jacob Collier
I listen to radio. Even with YouTube, Spotify, last.fm and all of the various forms of social media that we have nowadays, I still think that radio is the best place for discovering music that I've not heard before and wouldn't have chosen. Algorithmic selections are exactly as exciting as top 10 lists, and I already have a lot of that awareness and I'm bored. Give me human choices and a friendly DJ who knows their stuff, any day.
Most radio stations all over the world have a live stream that anyone, anywhere can connect to. Independent radio is best. Some countries have decent state-funded stations, and community and student radio can both be refreshing. Various arts organisations support radio, too.
OP will likely be put off by the technicalities. 128kbps is the most common bit rate for online radio streaming, although some stations offer 256 (320 if you're really lucky). Still, I can accept it. If I hear something I really like, I'll want to track it down in some form or other - maybe an LP from Discogs, or a CD from Amazon Marketplace (still buy 'em sometimes), or just 'good enough' files (Bandcamp for new bands). FLAC seems like a lot of trouble, so I've been sticking to 320 or VBR mp3s for digital.
Here's a classical station to get you started, why not. There's a whole world right there. All around. It's just not being aggressively marketed to us.
Ah yes, internet radio:
FIP
Radiolla
You’re a rare breed then, which is fine, and it’s admirable. It sounds like your father was an audiophile type and that was passed down. Most musicians (again, google will back me up here) care more about their actual musical performance, their individual instrument sound, and their live sound with or without a band and/or with or without a PA. The reproduced sound in studio recordings used to be the producers job where only they worried about what the music would sound like across all of the millions of “clock radios” in kitchens around the globe.
Of course I know things have changed in the most recent of decades, where everyone is a producer now, especially US all being here on the AB forums, obviously, I think it goes without saying that we all want our musical compositions to have the best sound possible, and being a musician (I’m 51 btw, and while I’ve never been a “working musician”, I have been playing, composing and recording music for 35ish years on an amateur level.), while also being the producer give us the great responsibility of making sure the sound quality of our own music and final production is the best that it can be, while also ensuring that it will reach the widest audience, and be accessible on the widest range of playback systems (aka all the millions of “clock radios”).
It just happened to me the other day, I whipped out my iPhone to let a buddy of mine hear this piece I’d been working on and immediately had to start making excuses; “oh, well, there is actually a bass line there! You just can’t hear it through this crappy iPhone speaker, but it’s there! I promise!, you should listen with headphones, or go listen in your car”.
Anyway, I don’t mean to derail your thread. I think it’s healthy discussion IMHO. I hope you find the new music music from established artists you’re looking for.
Yeah, I suppose if one has plenty of money to blow on high end audio playback equipment, then more power to them. If I had a bunch of money to spend though, I’d rather spend it on instruments and music making gear.
I think only if I won the lottery, would I ever dream of spending big money on playback equip. like those fancy tube preamps that sell for upwards of $10k.
Wow! Amazing performance!
Glad you like it. There are plenty of amazing videos of his performance on YouTube, but this is one is the very very best. I wish I had been in the audience on that night.
I have mixed opinions about the whole audiophile thing. The Roon Labs business model is a good example of my mixed attitudes. If you watch the YouTube videos about Roon you will pretty much only see the audio freaks blathering on about their insanely expensive gear. Audiophiles can be pretentious.
On the other hand I’ve been a musician all of my life so I don’t agree that audio systems don’t matter to musicians. I can hear a lot more details in lossless music than I can hear in lossy music. As an example, in one song I love there is a break in the vocals. The singer strikes a match and puffs a cigarette. I can hear the match flare, and the inhale, and the exhale on high end audio. It’s not there on lossy music on low end speakers. There are just slight indeterminable noises that don't mean anything.
I love to hear the breaths of singers and finger sounds on strings. I love piano overtones. Acoustic music in particular sounds more detailed through expensive audio. High end audio can sound insanely better, especially at high volume. Any musician who doesn’t appreciate the details of first-rate fidelity is missing out on pure joy. Seriously. It can be ecstatic.
Audiophiles can be weird though. As an example, I get really tired of the cable issue. Some people brag about how many thousands of dollars they spent on them. With analogue audio the two biggies for me are the cartridge and speakers. From my experience, a set of $20,000 speakers isn’t ten times better than a set of $2000 speakers, but the $2000 speakers still blow away any set $200 speakers. There are some great $200 speakers though. I have some cheap speakers that I use and love.
For the record I also love trashy bands played through anything. It’s not like I’m snobby about needing any level of fidelity. A great song on iPad speakers is still a great song. The best summary of my attitude toward music and audio is that the audio equipment and musical instruments in my house are worth a whole lot more than my house is worth.
Really though, this thread is about someone who doesn't like the sound of compressed music on YouTube, so I was just trying to steer him toward some of the higher end streaming options.
Oh I love to hear all those things too. I mean, who doesn’t? I just don’t think we need to spend 10 grand to get there. I’ve been a musician all my life as well, (at least for 35 of my 51 years on this planet) I think if a sound, a breath, match, or a fart was intended to be heard, it’s done in production. I mean sure, you’re not going to hear everything coming from a 1” speaker on your mom’s old clock radio (or an iPhone speaker), especially at low volumes, but a great producer, or a great production I should say, caters to the widest range of listening devices.
I do realize that there’s artist/producers that produce albums specifically aimed at audiophiles and super high end systems, but I can almost guarantee with near 100% certainty that none have ever made any Billboard charts (maybe if there’s a “top 40 audiophile album” category)
We are, of course, only working within the 20Hz to 20KHz range of human hearing right, albeit some of us older folks do start having hearing loss at some point in our lives. (Especially if we’ve been to too many loud concerts!)
Don’t get me wrong, I like having nice things too! I mean, it’s why some people choose a Cadillac or Mercedes Benz over a Honda Civic. Some like a really nice, fancier way of getting from A to B!
And Again, it’s not just my opinion on how most musicians are not audiophiles. It’s been debated all over the internet for years. There’s some rare birds like Jimmy Page for example (and some of you here evidently) who claims to indulge in high end audio. I think a lot of musicians are already “tuned into” their live sound and already know what their music sounds like, because they ARE the music. If said musician wants to hear high end audio, he plugs in his guitar and calls his bandmates up for a jam session.
Here’s a couple links on the subject if anyone’s interested.
https://www.cnet.com/news/why-do-musicians-have-lousy-hi-fis/
https://www.reddit.com/r/audiophile/comments/cx6lsl/musicians_and_audiophiles_being_in_the_room/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Any detail about this?
This is about music that get's streamed, not about buying and downloading music, right?
And for buying music, was not Apple music signed in some way and you cannot use it elsewhere?
Roon + Qobuz Hi Fi tier = job done.
Well-encoded lossy music is practically impossible to ABX from lossless codecs. And even if you can tell them apart the differences are going to be really subtle: a tiny hint of ringing on a hihat or some (very minor) phase issues in a stereo recording. Not the kind of thing you would notice when actually enjoying music (as opposed to concentrating fully on listening for artefacts).
If you can hear a singer taking a breath on the lossless version, that breath will also be equally audible on the high-bitrate lossy version too. There are have been thousands of double-blind tests performed on expert listeners to prove this.
Just to add to the above: the most important element in the chain is always the transducer: there is absolutely going to be a huge difference between a good speaker or headphone and a bad one. Speakers and headphones matter a lot, but the difference between a high-bitrate lossy codec such as AAC vs a lossless file is infinitely more subtle, to the point of being practically irrelevant.
Needs some limiter on the shirt...
i was going to answer " where you get your music from"
but then I saw
"I am not really interested in listening to unknown artists"
So I'll just say i get some of it from music posted here.
Amazon music HD is excellent, I switched to it from Spotify. Family plan costs the same for each, and the difference in sound quality is not subtle. Even though I had Spotify on 320kbps, the difference is striking, especially on the albums which are ultra HD.
I tried Tidal on an inexpensive trial, but I didn’t like it as much because the pricing was a lot higher than Amazon and the whole marketing of tidal was confusing to me.
As my ears have gotten more tuned to what is missing in compressed files, I can’t stand them anymore. Izotope has a function in insight that allows you to hear different compression schemes, and it allows you to listen to only what is taken away by the compression- that’s where all of the depth and ambience lives.
I’m not an audiophile, the differences can be heard on my Apple earbuds, my Yamaha monitors, and my Sony and Amy headphones, none of which are “audiophile” gear.
With or without a sampler this dude is special.
If you all have not you should listen to some of his studio albums.
I agree. The differences can be heard. They are clear. I would describe them as adding a width to the music. Everything seems to have more of its own space.