LK - for Ableton Live & Midi by Imaginando - AUv3 Clip Launcher Finally Available in AUM!!

tahiche

@Tatobx

that's just how I launch the scenes, it's intuitive for me because I used it with Ableton and it worked like that

How do you mean?. Using the shift+scrolling?.

Tatobx

@tahiche said:
@Tatobx

that's just how I launch the scenes, it's intuitive for me because I used it with Ableton and it worked like that

How do you mean?. Using the shift+scrolling?.

Yes, shift+scrolling then press ">" key to launch the scene

https://youtube.com/watch?v=IWABDpX3Htw&t=394s

sinosoidal

We are beta testing two new features on 1.10.8:

• Double tap composer keyboard key selects all notes of that pitch
• Add track color to track property. Choosing a color sets all clips of that track to the selected color

sinosoidal

@tahiche said:
Hi, I just got a Launchkey mini mk3 to use with LK.
I kept reading about Launchpads and stuff so I though it’d be a nice test, if I don’t like I always have the keys
I know this has been discussed plenty but if someone with a Launchkey could help me out...

• Whats the deal with the colors?. All clips are orange, then I make one green and it turns out red... I know this has been discussed but I don’t know if there’s a “proper” solution.
• How do you trigger scenes in a way that makes sense?. I’m aware it might be a limitation of the Launchkey only having 2 rows and one “launch scene” button... I fond it really unintuitive to scroll up and down using shift to select the scene to play. Maybe mapping an empty pad on each row to scene launch?. I usually play triggering scenes.
  Maybe there’s a video or tutorial somewhere?. Cheers and thanks in advance!.

@tahiche the issue with colors is that Novation controllers family has several modes that you can enable when interacting with them. To have full RGB support enabled you need to be in programmers mode. In this mode, nothing is programmed at all. We use a mode called DAW mode, which keeps some pre programmed stuff, chords and drumpads for instance.

We have two options:

• We either limit the color pallet in LK to match the limited pallete provided by the controllers in DAW mode
• We move to programmers mode and implement the functionalities that are not working in programmers mode. (a hell amount of work specific to this controllers)

Anyway, this will be a decision for later as we are quite busy right now....

tahiche

@sinosoidal said:

@tahiche said:
Hi, I just got a Launchkey mini mk3 to use with LK.
I kept reading about Launchpads and stuff so I though it’d be a nice test, if I don’t like I always have the keys
I know this has been discussed plenty but if someone with a Launchkey could help me out...

• Whats the deal with the colors?. All clips are orange, then I make one green and it turns out red... I know this has been discussed but I don’t know if there’s a “proper” solution.
• How do you trigger scenes in a way that makes sense?. I’m aware it might be a limitation of the Launchkey only having 2 rows and one “launch scene” button... I fond it really unintuitive to scroll up and down using shift to select the scene to play. Maybe mapping an empty pad on each row to scene launch?. I usually play triggering scenes.
  Maybe there’s a video or tutorial somewhere?. Cheers and thanks in advance!.

@tahiche the issue with colors is that Novation controllers family has several modes that you can enable when interacting with them. To have full RGB support enabled you need to be in programmers mode. In this mode, nothing is programmed at all. We use a mode called DAW mode, which keeps some pre programmed stuff, chords and drumpads for instance.

We have two options:

• We either limit the color pallet in LK to match the limited pallete provided by the controllers in DAW mode
• We move to programmers mode and implement the functionalities that are not working in programmers mode. (a hell amount of work specific to this controllers)

Anyway, this will be a decision for later as we are quite busy right now....

Understood!. Thanks! 🙏
I wanted to try the Novation Launch(whatever) way after all the hype. Thought the Launchkey mini was a good compromise, if I didn’t click with it at least I had a keyboard.
I’m having mixed feelings about it. It’s great when it works, like with LK. But the customization is so limited... seems like Novation is leaving all the work for the devs. As a user you’re stuck with one custom mode where you can hardly do anything. Just assign notes to pads. No grouping, no toggles...
why would they have different color negotiation in programmers mode?. At least they could have implemented a function to map a color to the closest available.

rs2000

@sinosoidal said:

@tahiche said:
Hi, I just got a Launchkey mini mk3 to use with LK.
I kept reading about Launchpads and stuff so I though it’d be a nice test, if I don’t like I always have the keys
I know this has been discussed plenty but if someone with a Launchkey could help me out...

• Whats the deal with the colors?. All clips are orange, then I make one green and it turns out red... I know this has been discussed but I don’t know if there’s a “proper” solution.
• How do you trigger scenes in a way that makes sense?. I’m aware it might be a limitation of the Launchkey only having 2 rows and one “launch scene” button... I fond it really unintuitive to scroll up and down using shift to select the scene to play. Maybe mapping an empty pad on each row to scene launch?. I usually play triggering scenes.
  Maybe there’s a video or tutorial somewhere?. Cheers and thanks in advance!.

@tahiche the issue with colors is that Novation controllers family has several modes that you can enable when interacting with them. To have full RGB support enabled you need to be in programmers mode. In this mode, nothing is programmed at all. We use a mode called DAW mode, which keeps some pre programmed stuff, chords and drumpads for instance.

We have two options:

• We either limit the color pallet in LK to match the limited pallete provided by the controllers in DAW mode
• We move to programmers mode and implement the functionalities that are not working in programmers mode. (a hell amount of work specific to this controllers)

A sounds like the better option, controller support is hard enough

bleep

I agree. I'm speculating that limiting the pallete will not be a big problem for any users. Having a better match with popular controllers comes with obvious benefits.

Tatobx

@sinosoidal said:
We have two options:

• We either limit the color pallet in LK to match the limited pallete provided by the controllers in DAW mode
• We move to programmers mode and implement the functionalities that are not working in programmers mode. (a hell amount of work specific to this controllers)

Anyway, this will be a decision for later as we are quite busy right now....

Given that for me the question of colors is not a problem, but... according to the new feature in the latest beta, couldn't we make the pad colors match the colors chosen for the track?
We would limit the number of colors and there would be matching between track and pad.

gregsmith

@sinosoidal said:
We are beta testing two new features on 1.10.8:

• Add track color to track property. Choosing a color sets all clips of that track to the selected color

I was hoping you’d do this at some point 🤗

sinosoidal

Version 1.10.8 made available today at App Store:

• Fix Wifi connection to Ableton Live broken with iOS 14.5.X (requires permission from the user to use multicast networking)
• Fix hold on Keyboard, Midi Pads and XY modules
• Slight reduction of track buttons height
• Double tap composer keyboard key selects all notes of that pitch
• Add track color to track property. Choosing a color sets all clips of that track to the selected color.

RajahP

@sinosoidal said:
Version 1.10.8 made available today at App Store:

• Fix Wifi connection to Ableton Live broken with iOS 14.5.X (requires permission from the user to use multicast networking)
• Fix hold on Keyboard, Midi Pads and XY modules
• Slight reduction of track buttons height
• Double tap composer keyboard key selects all notes of that pitch
• Add track color to track property. Choosing a color sets all clips of that track to the selected color.

Thanks... Digging in...

tahiche

Hi!
As discussed in multiple occasions, there’s a void in audio clip launching for a perfect LK/ AUM setup. There’s workarounds like Multitrack auv3 by 4 pockets or using Drambo or some other sampler. It sort of breaks the flow for me so I’m trying to bound LK with Zenbeats. Using Zenbeats to record and launch audio clips while retaining the flexibility of AUM routing and midi. I like Zenbeats for audio clips, very straightforward.
I’m using Zenbeats midi learn to listen to LK and trigger scenes. I sort of got it working...

I wonder if anyone has used Zenbeats this way with LK and got it working. Here’s some details and some issues:

• I need to have Audiobus open to use it’s midi port. Send LK midi to audiobus midi port and set Zenbeats to listen to audiobus midi. Can’t get it working without audiobus in the middle. Zenbeats won’t listen to AUM or even LK stand-alone, I can’t get app-to-app midi working without Audiobus or some middle routing thing.
• Zenbeats mapping only works with CC data, not notes. And I can’t see how to set values either, seems like “all or nothing” so I set LK to output on channel 16 and send cc0 for Zenbeats scene 1, cc1 for scene 2 and so on.
• The midi learn parameters in ZB are sort of confusing in how they interact with LK. I have to set LK’s clip to not loop, otherwise it toggles ZB play which is not what we want. This also means if you trigger the same scene twice it will toggle the ZB scene and stop it...
• It’s sort of hit and miss and random in the way it syncs to trigger the ZB scene. Sometimes it changes when I expect it to, sometimes it waits for the next loop. You can see this in the video.

Update: maybe a Mozaic script would help... convert LK notes to CC message, it’s a lot easier to draw notes in LK than a different CC per scene/clip.

gregsmith

@tahiche said:
Hi!
As discussed in multiple occasions, there’s a void in audio clip launching for a perfect LK/ AUM setup. There’s workarounds like Multitrack auv3 by 4 pockets or using Drambo or some other sampler. It sort of breaks the flow for me so I’m trying to bound LK with Zenbeats. Using Zenbeats to record and launch audio clips while retaining the flexibility of AUM routing and midi. I like Zenbeats for audio clips, very straightforward.
I’m using Zenbeats midi learn to listen to LK and trigger scenes. I sort of got it working...

I wonder if anyone has used Zenbeats this way with LK and got it working. Here’s some details and some issues:

• I need to have Audiobus open to use it’s midi port. Send LK midi to audiobus midi port and set Zenbeats to listen to audiobus midi. Can’t get it working without audiobus in the middle. Zenbeats won’t listen to AUM or even LK stand-alone, I can’t get app-to-app midi working without Audiobus or some middle routing thing.
• Zenbeats mapping only works with CC data, not notes. And I can’t see how to set values either, seems like “all or nothing” so I set LK to output on channel 16 and send cc0 for Zenbeats scene 1, cc1 for scene 2 and so on.
• The midi learn parameters in ZB are sort of confusing in how they interact with LK. I have to set LK’s clip to not loop, otherwise it toggles ZB play which is not what we want. This also means if you trigger the same scene twice it will toggle the ZB scene and stop it...
• It’s sort of hit and miss and random in the way it syncs to trigger the ZB scene. Sometimes it changes when I expect it to, sometimes it waits for the next loop. You can see this in the video.

Update: maybe a Mozaic script would help... convert LK notes to CC message, it’s a lot easier to draw notes in LK than a different CC per scene/clip.

Good effort. I always liked the way Zenbeats handled audio and if I remember rightly the timestretch was ok. If only it wasn’t such a midi faff!

espiegel123

@tahiche said:
Hi!
As discussed in multiple occasions, there’s a void in audio clip launching for a perfect LK/ AUM setup. There’s workarounds like Multitrack auv3 by 4 pockets or using Drambo or some other sampler. It sort of breaks the flow for me so I’m trying to bound LK with Zenbeats. Using Zenbeats to record and launch audio clips while retaining the flexibility of AUM routing and midi. I like Zenbeats for audio clips, very straightforward.
I’m using Zenbeats midi learn to listen to LK and trigger scenes. I sort of got it working...

I wonder if anyone has used Zenbeats this way with LK and got it working. Here’s some details and some issues:

• I need to have Audiobus open to use it’s midi port. Send LK midi to audiobus midi port and set Zenbeats to listen to audiobus midi. Can’t get it working without audiobus in the middle. Zenbeats won’t listen to AUM or even LK stand-alone, I can’t get app-to-app midi working without Audiobus or some middle routing thing.
• Zenbeats mapping only works with CC data, not notes. And I can’t see how to set values either, seems like “all or nothing” so I set LK to output on channel 16 and send cc0 for Zenbeats scene 1, cc1 for scene 2 and so on.
• The midi learn parameters in ZB are sort of confusing in how they interact with LK. I have to set LK’s clip to not loop, otherwise it toggles ZB play which is not what we want. This also means if you trigger the same scene twice it will toggle the ZB scene and stop it...
• It’s sort of hit and miss and random in the way it syncs to trigger the ZB scene. Sometimes it changes when I expect it to, sometimes it waits for the next loop. You can see this in the video.

Update: maybe a Mozaic script would help... convert LK notes to CC message, it’s a lot easier to draw notes in LK than a different CC per scene/clip.

Would Koala offer the audio clips functionality you need with less overhead than Zenbeats?

tahiche

@espiegel123 said:

Would Koala offer the audio clips functionality you need with less overhead than Zenbeats?

Koala won’t work because it doesn’t support multiple outputs and you wouldn’t be able to add effects per track. Drambo does. But still, a sampler is not ideal for longer recordings.

soundtemple

@sinosoidal
Slight reduction of track buttons height <-- thankyou! Makes a world of difference to me. It's the little things.

One small thing I noticed and its only cosmetic. The automation the value indicator in the top left goes negative and above 128 when you drag above or below the automation window.

One thing I would find handy (for pitch bend) is double-tap a node to reset to the middle line (0) - It's not too hard to get it on zero ie there is a big sweet spot but would be a nice to have.

sinosoidal

@soundtemple said:
@sinosoidal
Slight reduction of track buttons height <-- thankyou! Makes a world of difference to me. It's the little things.

One small thing I noticed and its only cosmetic. The automation the value indicator in the top left goes negative and above 128 when you drag above or below the automation window.

Thanks for reporting. Will be fixed!

One thing I would find handy (for pitch bend) is double-tap a node to reset to the middle line (0) - It's not too hard to get it on zero ie there is a big sweet spot but would be a nice to have.

I believe we have added node snap to zero if shift is press. Can you try it?

soundtemple

@sinosoidal thanks. Shift functionality seems to be the same. Shift-tap a node seems to delete node

... and one last thing there is triplet record quantisation but is it possible to set a triplet grid?

sinosoidal

@soundtemple said:
@sinosoidal thanks. Shift functionality seems to be the same. Shift-tap a node seems to delete node

If you move the node next to zero if shift is pressed, it won't snap?

... and one last thing there is triplet record quantisation but is it possible to set a triplet grid?

One of our goals is add support to different time signatures, if that is what you mean. Later this year for sure.

soundtemple

@sinosoidal Seems to be the same to me (shift or no shift) but there is a big sweet spot around the zero area so it is easy enough to get 0 on the pitch bend. Perfectly fine.

Triplet grid changes the divisions on the piano roll to fit 3 notes in the space of 3 (thats my understanding). CMD-3 in Ableton toggles it.

sinosoidal

@soundtemple said:
@sinosoidal Seems to be the same to me (shift or no shift) but there is a big sweet spot around the zero area so it is easy enough to get 0 on the pitch bend. Perfectly fine.

Triplet grid changes the divisions on the piano roll to fit 3 notes in the space of 3 (thats my understanding). CMD-3 in Ableton toggles it.

Oh, I see. We don't have support for this yet. Added to backlog.

krassmann

Hi, I try to sync LK and Cubasis. I used LK standalone and turned sync to Midi clock on. I set Midi In to Cubasis 3 and ensured Cubasis generates Midi clock. LK started to receive the Midi clock and adjusted the tempo. So far so good.

LK did not react to start/stop of Cubasis. Both apps were totally not on the beat. Looks like they were not synced on a bar. Totally unusable.

I tried to throw AudioBus into mix. The experience was better. AB being the Midi clock slave and LK loaded as AU in AB and host sync on. Basically works but there is a significant delay which is changing during playback - impossible to compensate. Also not usable.

Any ideas?

sinosoidal

@krassmann said:
Hi, I try to sync LK and Cubasis. I used LK standalone and turned sync to Midi clock on. I set Midi In to Cubasis 3 and ensured Cubasis generates Midi clock. LK started to receive the Midi clock and adjusted the tempo. So far so good.

LK did not react to start/stop of Cubasis. Both apps were totally not on the beat. Looks like they were not synced on a bar. Totally unusable.

I tried to throw AudioBus into mix. The experience was better. AB being the Midi clock slave and LK loaded as AU in AB and host sync on. Basically works but there is a significant delay which is changing during playback - impossible to compensate. Also not usable.

Any ideas?

Are you loading LK as an audio unit extension into Cubasis?

krassmann

@sinosoidal said:

@krassmann said:
Hi, I try to sync LK and Cubasis. I used LK standalone and turned sync to Midi clock on. I set Midi In to Cubasis 3 and ensured Cubasis generates Midi clock. LK started to receive the Midi clock and adjusted the tempo. So far so good.

LK did not react to start/stop of Cubasis. Both apps were totally not on the beat. Looks like they were not synced on a bar. Totally unusable.

I tried to throw AudioBus into mix. The experience was better. AB being the Midi clock slave and LK loaded as AU in AB and host sync on. Basically works but there is a significant delay which is changing during playback - impossible to compensate. Also not usable.

Any ideas?

Are you loading LK as an audio unit extension into Cubasis?

I tried that as well but it’s also not usable. The problem is that the Midi out of Cubasis tracks can not output the events with their original Midi channel. So the Midi events that LK generates are then all of the same Midi channel and that is the channel that is set at the Midi out routing of the track. This makes it impossible to send the right notes to the instruments. If you set the Midi output to “All” then all notes generated by LK are sent on all 16 channels. I tried to work around with Midi Bus but it’s all not working.

That’s why I try to sync a standalone LK but that’s probably also not really working well. Midi clock on the iPad internally never really worked well for me. For hardware is okay, though. If Cubasis would just implement Ableton link or add a flexible Midi routing like AUM….

soundtemple

@krassmann Without knowing exactly what you are trying to achieve, It sounds to me like you are trying to solve the same problem that many of us are looking to solve here and that is DAW like features with AUM flexible routing. If so, then in my experience i can say that routing midi outside of one environment is a path to frustration and misery. It might seem likes it's theoretically possible but in reality (in my experience) it doesn't work, at least not reliably.

My conclusion, is compromise by keeping everything in one domain and work from there in finding the (compromised) solution that works best for you. ie: Adding DAW like features to AUM with things like LK or dealing with sub-standard routing inside Cubasis3. With recent advances to midi devices like LK, Atom and Helium I'm on the AUM side. Not being a Cubasis3 user I cant argue for advantages of using it. Why Cubasis3 and why not LK with AUM?

krassmann

@soundtemple, I actually do like the workflow in Cubasis 3. Since the sidechaining and better Midi routing in 3.3. I started my last project with Cubasis and the experience is great. I moved my whole sample library into the Cubasis directory and now using audio files became a breeze. Easy browsing and previewing the samples and loops. Just dragging samples on an audio track to try things out. Easy loading of samples into mini sampler directly out of the preview browser. It's just nice. The only I'm missing is the smooth transition from jamming with song sections to a linear arrangement. Moreover I just plugin my nanoKontrol 2 Midi mixer and it just works - no Midi learning session. When I re-arrange track order it is automatically reflected on the controller. All these things are very painful in the LK + AUM setup. So, I'm back being a linear guy.

baccharis

Is there any way to save LK Controller mapping assignments as presets in the stand-alone? Matrix seems to save everything but have not been able to save a Controller preset.

sinosoidal

@baccharis said:
Is there any way to save LK Controller mapping assignments as presets in the stand-alone?

Sorry, but no.

Matrix seems to save everything but have not been able to save a Controller preset.

If you are using the standalone, the controller settings will be saved automatic on a bank basis

If you are using the AUv3, it should be saved with your state.

sinosoidal

We have made available a new beta version of LK (1.10.9 - Build 241) with the following changes:

• Add undo/redo support to automations editor
• Fix clip color when importing
• Fix notes being wrongly create at the end of clip while recording with quantization
• Fix APC 25 clip launching bug

baccharis

@sinosoidal thanks for the info! Really enjoying using Controller with Drambo...both as AUv3 or stand-alone