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Problems with clipping in AUM

This seems to happen nearly every time I record now - I get a great jam session going in AUM, mindful to watch the levels in the AUM meter, keeping them well below clipping threshold.

Yet when I play back the recording in AudioShare, despite the volume being low, the sound is clipped - so tips of the waveform is clipped off, and the whole thing distorted. No idea why this is happening - sounds fine during recording, levels good, yet I end up with a totally unusable recording.

Getting on my nerves this now, any insights appreciated.

Comments

  • Maybe the problem is in AudioShare? I’ve noticed recently that occasionally after ‘normalising’ the waveform it is off the screen despite being well within it prior to this. I’ve not noticed any problems with AUM

  • wimwim
    edited May 20

    What is bit depth set to in AUM? Maybe try setting it to 24 bits, then going to AudioShare > Record > Settings and making sure that's 24 bit as well.

    Or some combination thereof.

    I'm thinking maybe if AUM is at 24 bit or higher and AudioShare is at 16, clipping could occur. 24 bit has higher headroom.

  • edited May 20

    @robosardine said:
    Maybe the problem is in AudioShare? I’ve noticed recently that occasionally after ‘normalising’ the waveform it is off the screen despite being well within it prior to this. I’ve not noticed any problems with AUM

    Thanks for the reply - the file was saved as normal in Audioshare and sounded awful. I then normalised it which just made it louder, and still awful.

    @wim said:
    What is bit depth set to in AUM? Maybe try setting it to 24 bits, then going to AudioShare > Record > Settings and making sure that's 24 bit as well.

    Or some combination thereof.

    I'm thinking maybe if AUM is at 24 bit or higher and AudioShare is at 16, clipping could occur. 24 bit has higher headroom.

    Ah, that's interesting, they were both set to 16 bit so I'll try 24. Thanks Wim.

    Used to be ok though - and the weird thing is, I had a second go at recording the jam using an identical setup (just reloaded the session and hit play/record), and this time the recording came out absolutely fine. I hadn't changed anything, but that time it didn't mess up the recording.

    I'll try the 24 bit option maybe that'll be more stable, I'm starting to think my iPad is showing serious signs of ageing though.

  • Hmmm...well, if normalizing made your signal louder then it probably isn't "real" clipping. A signal which was recorded too loud and has clipping as a result thereof should usually not be getting louder when normalized as it is already "too loud" or at the maximum loudness. This would suggest that the problem occurs somewhere further back in the signal chain.

  • @Jonny8 said:
    Hmmm...well, if normalizing made your signal louder then it probably isn't "real" clipping. A signal which was recorded too loud and has clipping as a result thereof should usually not be getting louder when normalized as it is already "too loud" or at the maximum loudness. This would suggest that the problem occurs somewhere further back in the signal chain.

    Yeah that's what I thought. The audio wave was pretty short, and so quiet, but the peaks chopped off.

  • AUMs Limiter FX would be useful :)
    Unless it’s external recording where you must leave at least a 12db headroom to be safe

  • edited May 20

    @Korakios said:
    AUMs Limiter FX would be useful :)
    Unless it’s external recording where you must leave at least a 12db headroom to be safe

    Thanks I'll try that - I'm using all internal apps anyway.

    Just weird it didn't do it the second time with an identical setup...

  • I often notice normalised, non clipping audio clips in AUM. A pre trim would solve that.

  • @MonzoPro said:

    @Jonny8 said:
    Hmmm...well, if normalizing made your signal louder then it probably isn't "real" clipping. A signal which was recorded too loud and has clipping as a result thereof should usually not be getting louder when normalized as it is already "too loud" or at the maximum loudness. This would suggest that the problem occurs somewhere further back in the signal chain.

    Yeah that's what I thought. The audio wave was pretty short, and so quiet, but the peaks chopped off.

    Perhaps it is a plugin causing the distortion. Does this happen with some plugins more than others?

    I don't think there is some general AUM/AudioShare distortion issue...if there is I have never run into it. I'd look at the audio chain to see if there is a plugin or combination of plugins...or an audio interface common to the distorted files.

  • @topaz said:
    I often notice normalised, non clipping audio clips in AUM. A pre trim would solve that.

    I’m just recording the app output itself...dunno...

    @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @Jonny8 said:
    Hmmm...well, if normalizing made your signal louder then it probably isn't "real" clipping. A signal which was recorded too loud and has clipping as a result thereof should usually not be getting louder when normalized as it is already "too loud" or at the maximum loudness. This would suggest that the problem occurs somewhere further back in the signal chain.

    Yeah that's what I thought. The audio wave was pretty short, and so quiet, but the peaks chopped off.

    Perhaps it is a plugin causing the distortion. Does this happen with some plugins more than others?

    I don't think there is some general AUM/AudioShare distortion issue...if there is I have never run into it. I'd look at the audio chain to see if there is a plugin or combination of plugins...or an audio interface common to the distorted files.

    The only difference in the two sessions was a slight dialling down of Discord4, thinking about it. I’ll have to do a few tests - see if that one is causing the clipping. I use it all the time though, and it’s usually ok.

    It’s a puzzle!

  • @MonzoPro said:

    @topaz said:
    I often notice normalised, non clipping audio clips in AUM. A pre trim would solve that.

    I’m just recording the app output itself...dunno...

    @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @Jonny8 said:
    Hmmm...well, if normalizing made your signal louder then it probably isn't "real" clipping. A signal which was recorded too loud and has clipping as a result thereof should usually not be getting louder when normalized as it is already "too loud" or at the maximum loudness. This would suggest that the problem occurs somewhere further back in the signal chain.

    Yeah that's what I thought. The audio wave was pretty short, and so quiet, but the peaks chopped off.

    Perhaps it is a plugin causing the distortion. Does this happen with some plugins more than others?

    I don't think there is some general AUM/AudioShare distortion issue...if there is I have never run into it. I'd look at the audio chain to see if there is a plugin or combination of plugins...or an audio interface common to the distorted files.

    The only difference in the two sessions was a slight dialling down of Discord4, thinking about it. I’ll have to do a few tests - see if that one is causing the clipping. I use it all the time though, and it’s usually ok.

    It’s a puzzle!

    If you are recording the main output chain and there is distortion/clipping and the audio is not actually near max volume, it means that something in the signal chain itself was distorting. I have a few plugin chains that are prone to distortion when passing the audio between them (in this case because each of the plugins does a high-mids boost). Even though the final output of the chain is well below the max volume. That is because the signal gets a little hot between the plug ins. I sometimes have to go in and dial down the output from one plugin to the next.

    I suspect you have a little sleuthing to do with the particular effect/instrument chains that generate the issue.

  • @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @topaz said:
    I often notice normalised, non clipping audio clips in AUM. A pre trim would solve that.

    I’m just recording the app output itself...dunno...

    @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @Jonny8 said:
    Hmmm...well, if normalizing made your signal louder then it probably isn't "real" clipping. A signal which was recorded too loud and has clipping as a result thereof should usually not be getting louder when normalized as it is already "too loud" or at the maximum loudness. This would suggest that the problem occurs somewhere further back in the signal chain.

    Yeah that's what I thought. The audio wave was pretty short, and so quiet, but the peaks chopped off.

    Perhaps it is a plugin causing the distortion. Does this happen with some plugins more than others?

    I don't think there is some general AUM/AudioShare distortion issue...if there is I have never run into it. I'd look at the audio chain to see if there is a plugin or combination of plugins...or an audio interface common to the distorted files.

    The only difference in the two sessions was a slight dialling down of Discord4, thinking about it. I’ll have to do a few tests - see if that one is causing the clipping. I use it all the time though, and it’s usually ok.

    It’s a puzzle!

    If you are recording the main output chain and there is distortion/clipping and the audio is not actually near max volume, it means that something in the signal chain itself was distorting. I have a few plugin chains that are prone to distortion when passing the audio between them (in this case because each of the plugins does a high-mids boost). Even though the final output of the chain is well below the max volume. That is because the signal gets a little hot between the plug ins. I sometimes have to go in and dial down the output from one plugin to the next.

    I suspect you have a little sleuthing to do with the particular effect/instrument chains that generate the issue.

    Wouldn’t you hear it while you’re recording though? That’s the other thing, it sounds clear as a bell when I’m playing.

    I’ll try and do some testing tonight.

  • @MonzoPro said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @topaz said:
    I often notice normalised, non clipping audio clips in AUM. A pre trim would solve that.

    I’m just recording the app output itself...dunno...

    @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @Jonny8 said:
    Hmmm...well, if normalizing made your signal louder then it probably isn't "real" clipping. A signal which was recorded too loud and has clipping as a result thereof should usually not be getting louder when normalized as it is already "too loud" or at the maximum loudness. This would suggest that the problem occurs somewhere further back in the signal chain.

    Yeah that's what I thought. The audio wave was pretty short, and so quiet, but the peaks chopped off.

    Perhaps it is a plugin causing the distortion. Does this happen with some plugins more than others?

    I don't think there is some general AUM/AudioShare distortion issue...if there is I have never run into it. I'd look at the audio chain to see if there is a plugin or combination of plugins...or an audio interface common to the distorted files.

    The only difference in the two sessions was a slight dialling down of Discord4, thinking about it. I’ll have to do a few tests - see if that one is causing the clipping. I use it all the time though, and it’s usually ok.

    It’s a puzzle!

    If you are recording the main output chain and there is distortion/clipping and the audio is not actually near max volume, it means that something in the signal chain itself was distorting. I have a few plugin chains that are prone to distortion when passing the audio between them (in this case because each of the plugins does a high-mids boost). Even though the final output of the chain is well below the max volume. That is because the signal gets a little hot between the plug ins. I sometimes have to go in and dial down the output from one plugin to the next.

    I suspect you have a little sleuthing to do with the particular effect/instrument chains that generate the issue.

    Wouldn’t you hear it while you’re recording though? That’s the other thing, it sounds clear as a bell when I’m playing.

    I’ll try and do some testing tonight.

    If it really sounded clear as a bell then yes, it should still sound clear as a bell. So, if that is really the case, there is something going on. I guess the question is whether it was distorted and you didn't notice because in realtime we are sometimes focused on performance and don't hear details we hear on play back.

  • @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @topaz said:
    I often notice normalised, non clipping audio clips in AUM. A pre trim would solve that.

    I’m just recording the app output itself...dunno...

    @espiegel123 said:

    @MonzoPro said:

    @Jonny8 said:
    Hmmm...well, if normalizing made your signal louder then it probably isn't "real" clipping. A signal which was recorded too loud and has clipping as a result thereof should usually not be getting louder when normalized as it is already "too loud" or at the maximum loudness. This would suggest that the problem occurs somewhere further back in the signal chain.

    Yeah that's what I thought. The audio wave was pretty short, and so quiet, but the peaks chopped off.

    Perhaps it is a plugin causing the distortion. Does this happen with some plugins more than others?

    I don't think there is some general AUM/AudioShare distortion issue...if there is I have never run into it. I'd look at the audio chain to see if there is a plugin or combination of plugins...or an audio interface common to the distorted files.

    The only difference in the two sessions was a slight dialling down of Discord4, thinking about it. I’ll have to do a few tests - see if that one is causing the clipping. I use it all the time though, and it’s usually ok.

    It’s a puzzle!

    If you are recording the main output chain and there is distortion/clipping and the audio is not actually near max volume, it means that something in the signal chain itself was distorting. I have a few plugin chains that are prone to distortion when passing the audio between them (in this case because each of the plugins does a high-mids boost). Even though the final output of the chain is well below the max volume. That is because the signal gets a little hot between the plug ins. I sometimes have to go in and dial down the output from one plugin to the next.

    I suspect you have a little sleuthing to do with the particular effect/instrument chains that generate the issue.

    Wouldn’t you hear it while you’re recording though? That’s the other thing, it sounds clear as a bell when I’m playing.

    I’ll try and do some testing tonight.

    If it really sounded clear as a bell then yes, it should still sound clear as a bell. So, if that is really the case, there is something going on. I guess the question is whether it was distorted and you didn't notice because in realtime we are sometimes focused on performance and don't hear details we hear on play back.

    Didn’t sound that bad when recording, I’d definitely have noticed.

    Think I’ve narrowed it down to Discord4 though. Tried a few tests without it and it was fine, even on 16bit. Don’t think it was the apps fault in general, but the way I’d set it up. Guess I need to tread carefully with it next time.

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