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Piano Motifs by Fernando Morales

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Comments

  • @McD said:

    @SNystrom said:
    @McD: and an Orchestra Motifs with 10 tracks would be amazing to write film music in hours... not weeks. Just pick your key, your favorite chord progression or design one and hit "Create" iteratively until the right mood goes out.

    Oh man, that is pure genius, Professor! 🤗

    Hope you get a cut of "Film scoring for the rest of us!" 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

    I'm sure Fernando is already thinking of cool features to implement. If they happen to come anywhere near my wish list he's just following the "great minds" theory of art and science.

    I don't believe in asking for a "cut" based on a publicly documented idea. Hitting "Post" just means its free for anyone to consider... ANYONE. If I get an idea worth some real money without any effort other than spouting off I'll probably forget what it was in the morning when the drugs wear off. LSD was invented by accident and NOT by using it, by the way.
    Using it gave way to the most profound visions of nonsense you can imagine. It's the key
    to the non-senses.

    @McD, thanks for all the suggestions and ideas to make Piano Motifs a better and more fun to use app. I think you might like what’s coming in the pipeline 😊:

  • @azul3D_Apps said:

    @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:
    @azul3D_Apps
    Do you know this book? It contains some ideas that would be useful for a melody algorithm:

    https://www.amazon.com/Shaping-Forces-Music-Counterpoint-Orchestral/dp/0486233464

    I would recommend Chapters 5 and 7 especially.

    @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr, thanks for the recommendation. In the world of music there is always new things to learn and experiment with.

    In life as well. In my humble opinion, No one knows everything about anything. One is always learning in all aspects of life.

  • @azul3D_Apps said:

    @McD said:

    @SNystrom said:
    @McD: and an Orchestra Motifs with 10 tracks would be amazing to write film music in hours... not weeks. Just pick your key, your favorite chord progression or design one and hit "Create" iteratively until the right mood goes out.

    Oh man, that is pure genius, Professor! 🤗

    Hope you get a cut of "Film scoring for the rest of us!" 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

    I'm sure Fernando is already thinking of cool features to implement. If they happen to come anywhere near my wish list he's just following the "great minds" theory of art and science.

    I don't believe in asking for a "cut" based on a publicly documented idea. Hitting "Post" just means its free for anyone to consider... ANYONE. If I get an idea worth some real money without any effort other than spouting off I'll probably forget what it was in the morning when the drugs wear off. LSD was invented by accident and NOT by using it, by the way.
    Using it gave way to the most profound visions of nonsense you can imagine. It's the key
    to the non-senses.

    @McD, thanks for all the suggestions and ideas to make Piano Motifs a better and more fun to use app. I think you might like what’s coming in the pipeline 😊:

    Interesting. Lock previous chord progression? If so, 😯

  • @SNystrom said:
    Oh, I know. I was just kidding — while still pointing-out to other forum members the great contributions you have made to not only this app but dozens of others over your many years here.

    You're very kind. Ideas are like assholes. We all have one.

    Execution is king. @brambos, @SevenSystems and other developers who traffic in ideas here have actual proof of the value of ideas by executing and making them into applications.
    Fernando or @azul3D_Apps has already proven he's got instructing ideas... but a few tweaks
    are generally obvious, right? Documenting advice is hardly work. Advice is just a form of baboon antics and an attempt at influence. Sometimes we think it helps but generally it's just noisy display and hard to implement.

  • @azul3D_Apps : whoa, that looks great :)
    Do you need people to test? ^^

  • @azul3D_Apps said:
    @McD, thanks for all the suggestions and ideas to make Piano Motifs a better and more fun to use app. I think you might like what’s coming in the pipeline 😊:

    That will do it... I'm going to start looking for film music gigs. This is where I'm stuck without
    more variations. I need you to crank them babies out for me to pass muster:

    The buttons are 75% Piano Motifs and 25% assigning instruments and cut and paste
    of your MIDI lines. Most of the Piano Motif buttons are: Next, next, next... maybe... save...
    next, next... KEEPER!

    With "Lock Prev" I'll get more lines to add to the orchestration and use the progression
    as a type of loop for the oboe, then the cello then the brass and then strings and then
    swap in a B section maybe changing Major to Minor. Then return to the beginning and
    never have to actually use the pencil much. Writing notes is so... mundane and exhausting.

    Anyway, I'm not going you a cut but I might give yo credit when I pick up my Oscar.
    My nick name for you will be "You know who you are..." Thanks in advance.

  • @McD said:
    That will do it... I'm going to start looking for film music gigs. This is where I'm stuck without
    more variations. I need you to crank them babies out for me to pass muster:

    The buttons are 75% Piano Motifs and 25% assigning instruments and cut and paste
    of your MIDI lines. Most of the Piano Motif buttons are: Next, next, next... maybe... save...
    next, next... KEEPER!

    With "Lock Prev" I'll get more lines to add to the orchestration and use the progression
    as a type of loop for the oboe, then the cello then the brass and then strings and then
    swap in a B section maybe changing Major to Minor. Then return to the beginning and
    never have to actually use the pencil much. Writing notes is so... mundane and exhausting.

    Anyway, I'm not going you a cut but I might give yo credit when I pick up my Oscar.
    My nick name for you will be "You know who you are..." Thanks in advance.

    That is too much fun. Listening to this one I can practically see the hobbit scarfing his second breakfast.

  • I like that lock feature, I’ve definitely been an advocate. Awesome

  • @Poppadocrock said:
    I like that lock feature, I’ve definitely been an advocate. Awesome

    Now we want a variation where we can design a chord progression and generate
    4-8 parts. Orchestral Motifs. I'd pay $1.50/voice without complaint. 16 parts? No problem.
    Everyone would get StaffPad and flood the market with "talent".

    Then we'd beg for mood buttons:
    Fist Fight
    Death of the hero
    Death of the heroine
    "Your first" (tender)
    "Your first" (inebriated)
    "Your First" (call girl)
    Car chase

    $1/mood - sold/packaged in genre packs

  • @McD said:

    @azul3D_Apps said:
    @McD, thanks for all the suggestions and ideas to make Piano Motifs a better and more fun to use app. I think you might like what’s coming in the pipeline 😊:

    That will do it... I'm going to start looking for film music gigs. This is where I'm stuck without
    more variations. I need you to crank them babies out for me to pass muster:

    The buttons are 75% Piano Motifs and 25% assigning instruments and cut and paste
    of your MIDI lines. Most of the Piano Motif buttons are: Next, next, next... maybe... save...
    next, next... KEEPER!

    With "Lock Prev" I'll get more lines to add to the orchestration and use the progression
    as a type of loop for the oboe, then the cello then the brass and then strings and then
    swap in a B section maybe changing Major to Minor. Then return to the beginning and
    never have to actually use the pencil much. Writing notes is so... mundane and exhausting.

    Anyway, I'm not going you a cut but I might give yo credit when I pick up my Oscar.
    My nick name for you will be "You know who you are..." Thanks in advance.

    So very gracious of you 😀

  • @azul3D_Apps said:

    @McD said:
    Anyway, I'm not going to give you a cut but I might give you credit when I pick up my Oscar.
    My nick name for you will be "You know who you are..." Thanks in advance.

    So very gracious of you 😀

    Who is this? Not that it matters. "You know who you are..." Get back to coding please.
    I need the updated tools. The clock's ticking on my plan for compositional fame using IOS
    tools at budget prices. That desktop stuff is great but beyond my budget. I'll probably have to fork out $500 on StaffPad libraries to get all the little touches I need to compete with
    Hans Zimmer and John Williams and their army of arrangers and software assistants.

    Theres a rumor that IOS 14 makes StaffPad slower. I doubt I'll notice since I'm going to just import MIDI and skip the manual labor. What am I, a medieval Monk?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Canticle_for_Leibowitz

  • A new version of Piano Motifs (v2.7) is now available on the App Store.

    This version has the following new features:
    • Added the ability to lock a motif's chord progression (with its key, scale, time signature and accompaniment) so that the next generated motif can use it again.
    • Added programmable accompaniment styles. Seven different accompaniment styles are now available.
    • Removed info button. All motif information and button labels are now displayed by default.
    • Fixed iOS 14 issue where BPM slider was defaulting to minimum value and not the default value of 120 BPM.
    • Optimized MIDI Out MIDI Note Off messages at end of a motif.
    • Added chord progressions.

    Some samples of the type of music Piano Motifs can generate:


    Samples of Piano Motifs played on other synths with effects:

    Enjoy!

  • It's a really good update Fernando, vid will hopefully be coming in the next few days!

  • Really great update! Piano Motifs keeps getting better!

    More details later but one random request popped into my mind based on your song titles Fernando, please give PM the option to auto generate a song title for each motif like Gadget does so I don’t have 10 songs named with the same date on them. Thanks again!

  • Is scale masking a possibility? Say, give me an F Lydian melody but with no Ds or Gs. Or user-defined scales would be even better.

    Polytonality would also be cool. Say, give me a melody in Ab melodic minor over a chord progression in C minor.

  • Thank you @azul3D_Apps for all the updates!

  • Awesome update @azul3D_Apps not only is the locking feature awesome, but getting to choose the accompaniment (Chord, arp, Bass, etc...) is really cool. Congrats on another great update to a great app.

  • @Poppadocrock said:
    Awesome update @azul3D_Apps not only is the locking feature awesome, but getting to choose the accompaniment (Chord, arp, Bass, etc...) is really cool. Congrats on another great update to a great app.

    Is it possible to get several different accompaniments for the same composition? For example, PM generates a chord progression and melody that I want to keep--could I get several different accompaniments for that?

  • @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:
    Is it possible to get several different accompaniments for the same composition? For example, PM generates a chord progression and melody that I want to keep--could I get several different accompaniments for that?

    I asked for that in the beta process and @azul3D_Apps explained that the way the application is currently written that would not be possible in this update. I huge re-write would be required. He has not committed to such a re-factoring of the application to do that.

    It's possible he'll make a new application that supports multiple parts, allows more control over the chord progression and gives the "composer" more choices. I suspect that Piano Motifs as intended has run it's course and such a massive re-write will open the doors to
    a new product vision.

    This is all complete speculation and I look forward to more of these great enhancements to
    generate music with a strong theoretical basis so we can quickly generate film music.
    But controlling the chord progression would also open the options for other genres that
    avoid traditional chord progressions in favor of more shock and awe. Like alternating the
    chord roots in tritons or purely random intervals that destroy any sense of a key center that makes music sound like the traditional European composers that are the general template for movie music (hello John Williams... how's Gustaf Holst doing these days?).

    In the mean time I'll be saving batches of MIDI loops from this version for import into
    StaffPad, Cubasis and Xequence 2 to cut and paste useful segments and make more complex arrangements from these source materials and then add my own melodic ideas
    to the final mix. This is "push button" inspiration in the same vein as Riffer, Fugue Machine,
    Rozeta Tools and other productivity aids to avoid the manual labor of outlining music with
    some sort of logic structure. Good times... there are many desktop apps for these approaches but this one brings a new low cost tool into the mix for IOS music makers.

  • edited September 2020

    @McD said:

    This is all complete speculation and I look forward to more of these great enhancements to
    generate music with a strong theoretical basis so we can quickly generate film music.
    But controlling the chord progression would also open the options for other genres that
    avoid traditional chord progressions in favor of more shock and awe. Like alternating the
    chord roots in tritons or purely random intervals that destroy any sense of a key center that makes music sound like the traditional European composers that are the general template for movie music (hello John Williams... how's Gustaf Holst doing these days?).

    I'd buy a 12-tone serial version of Piano Motifs. Even better--can we get user-defined tone row length? Of course we'll also need inversion, retrograde, transposition, diminution and augmentation.

  • @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:

    I'd buy a 12-tone serial version of Piano Motifs. Even better--can we get user-defined tone row length? Of course we'll also need inversion, retrograde, transposition, diminution and augmentation.

    Probably more profitable would be a tintinnabuli app though. And pretty easy to program....

  • @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:
    I'd buy a 12-tone serial version of Piano Motifs. Even better--can we get user-defined tone row length? Of course we'll also need inversion, retrograde, transposition, diminution and augmentation.

    If @azul3D_Apps isn't taking notes I'm sure there are other MIDI capable programmers that could be incented to follow this thread and get to work: @coniferprod some to mind. He can deliver a user interface and has a good handle on MIDI from his SynthJacker app. Unfortunately SynthJacker was made somewhat irrelevant when AudioLayer added the auto-sampler feature in an update. I have really open SynthJacker since. He's a very responsive developer so he might consider this BUT knowledge of music theory will be important to me
    but purely random tools that provide basic inversion, retrograde, transposition, diminution and augmentation do pretty well too. Anything that creates loops and has a random button seems to sell. But when something fakes actual traditional musical practices I get excited.

    • Riffer works for me
    • Session Band allows generating your own chord progression, tempo and produces studio musician quality demo tracks for song/writing in most genres
    • iRealPro generate "Real Book" band arrangements in MIDI form
    • iBassist is the center of a Band in the Box approach with customer chord progressions and a dozens drummers playing in all genres. The accompaniment is still somewhat weak but Perforator and FilterStep can improve that
    • One Man Band provides the auto-accompaniment that lounge acts keyboard players love
    • and of course the "pre-recorded loop" approach is still very strong along with 4 bar beat making/groove box apps

    But I'd love to see @azul3D_Apps break away into multiple parts using the same theories that make Paino Motifs so useful for my desire to auto-generate film music with real orchestra sounds. Nothing prevents these parts from driving synths and I might give that
    some effort at some point but for now I'm going to make demo's of instant orchestras without writing a single note. Just import MIDI into apps and cut and paste to produce longer works. 32 bars of C major followed by a B section in F major back to "A" then a C section in F minor... etc. That should keep me busy on the couch watching TV for news of the death of democracy.

  • @McD said:
    but purely random tools that provide basic inversion, retrograde, transposition, diminution and >augmentation do pretty well too.

    I would really like an app that could take a midi file and say, halve the clock, or invert the melody. Transposition is easy with Scaler.

  • @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:

    @McD said:
    but purely random tools that provide basic inversion, retrograde, transposition, diminution and >augmentation do pretty well too.

    I would really like an app that could take a midi file and say, halve the clock, or invert the melody. Transposition is easy with Scaler.

    Playback with one MIDI player at 1/2 BPM and recording into another at normal BPM should be a workflow approach to 1/2 clock.

    Inversion of melody is trivial in Mozaic. Just declare or set the midpoint and invert intervals
    above to below and below to above and either use strict intervals or force into a scale. As you suggest Scaler helps with transposition, scaling forcing and multiple instances can generate parallel chord or intervals like parallel 6th's which always sound like good voice leading.

    The serious musical theorist can go crazy with Mozaic and make tools quite similar to those being requested and share them for free. There are many that already exist. I'm surprised no one have made videos showing them in action. I even donated to one videographer to
    try it but Mozaic is just too complicated for many to fight through to mastery. The GUI's are just too limiting and it becomes a RTFM exercise if there is one and total guess work if not.
    Reading the code is not an option even for a good programmer. It's too event driven to see
    cause and effect. But for experimenters there are really cool randomizers, generators, chordulators, etc.

  • Also Atom lets you change speed of midi playing. It even goes backwards.

  • Gosh, this is awesome. Simply fantastic for generating variations on a theme. Love it!

  • I agree, great great update, thanks for all your efforts!

  • @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr, great compilation of ideas. Some might be possible in Piano Motifs, some might not. The app is in constant evolution fed by user input and new ideas to improve usability and variability. As @McD explained, several accompaniments for the same progression and melody aren't possible with the current code base. As I have mentioned in the past, you can clearly see that this app's evolution is naturally leading towards user defined chord progressions. An evolution that most likely will happen in incremental steps.

    @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:

    @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:

    I'd buy a 12-tone serial version of Piano Motifs. Even better--can we get user-defined tone row length? Of course we'll also need inversion, retrograde, transposition, diminution and augmentation.

    Probably more profitable would be a tintinnabuli app though. And pretty easy to program....

    :) I haven't really gotten into 20th century music theory. I struggle listening to Schönberg (except for his orchestration of Brahm's Piano Quartet).

  • @Gavinski said:
    It's a really good update Fernando, vid will hopefully be coming in the next few days!

    Thanks Gavin, looking forward to the video.

  • @yowza said:
    Really great update! Piano Motifs keeps getting better!

    More details later but one random request popped into my mind based on your song titles Fernando, please give PM the option to auto generate a song title for each motif like Gadget does so I don’t have 10 songs named with the same date on them. Thanks again!

    @yowza, great to see you are finding 10 songs a day worth saving from Piano Motifs :D ! You could always use the save with bpm, key and scale option, of course, only if those parameters are different. Might take a look at what can be done for song names without bloating the code.

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