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MPE on iOS

pls list here, to have em on one place:

a) MPE keyb emulators/simulators
on iOS
b) apps that support MPE

thank you!

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Comments

  • Velocity Keyboard is the best keyboard emulator.

    Continua is the most MPE friendly synth

  • Velocity Keyboard or KB-1?!

  • We should probably add a section somewhere for which hosts support playing and recording MPE

  • @NoiseFloored said:
    We should probably add a section somewhere for which hosts support playing and recording MPE

    +1 and editing of MPE data.

  • @waka_x said:
    Velocity Keyboard or KB-1?!

    Velocity Keyboard is from the @Blue_Mangoo folks and KB-1 is Kai Arias. Both are great IMHO with
    a lot of feature overlaps but look for the edge cases where one is the right tool.

    I've been making some AUM projects with multiple keyboards/PAD sets up at runtime/recording.

  • In case haven’t seen the polyexpression list, with usability notes:

    https://community.polyexpression.com/t/ios-apps-supporting-mpe-wiki/82

  • edited April 26

    Also really, the list needs to show clearly how well mpe is implemented in each 'mpe' synth, because it is not always done well. Does it have both aftertouch and slide? For example. Does it have these baked into presets or do you need to tweak all the existing presets yourself?

    About velocity keyboard vs kb-1, depends on usage as mentioned earlier, but my preference would be Velocity keyboard if you want to play onscreen in the way most similar to how you would play on an mpe instrument.

  • In that sense, a table would actually be more useful than a list, if anyone could be bothered to make it

  • Yes, but it is also not a quality list, because some, many, of these don’t implement mpe very well

  • edited April 27

    EDIT: my bad, I've posted this on the wrong thread, sorry. Moving it here: https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/36558/recommendations-for-entry-level-mpe-controller#latest

    @Gavinski the table you are proposing is for iOS only synths? Which fields should it include?

  • Well, don't have time now to think that through in detail, but would include things like:

    Having inbuilt mpe presets that have both slide and aftertouch
    Includes easy ability to assign slide and aftertouch (eg. Ppg infinite this was a complete pain in the arse to do)
    Allows up to +/-48 pitchbend (eg. Ppg infinite didnt implement this properly so pitch glides didn't work as they should, though it took me a very long time to get them to admit that)
    Is polyphonic (I like Shockwave a lot, but Roger Linn argued at length in forum posts that it is not truly mpe because of this)
    Etc etc I'm sure there must be more but these would be the main things

    I discussed this with Chris Randall before. He argues that the preset designers can decide whether or not to add aftertouch and slide to a patch or not. This is true, but when I am buying an mpe synth, I definitely prefer one where the presets are already as expressive as possible. If anyone goes from an experience of using something like Cypher 2 or Equator on desktop to using the average ios mpe synth, straight out of the box it is usually a disappointing experience.

  • The new update of Shoom is definitely a good one. Not quite every mpe patch there has both slide and aftertouch assigned, but about 90 percent do, and it sounds wonderful

  • edited April 26

    @Gavinski said:
    Well, don't have time now to think that through in detail, but would include things like:

    Having inbuilt mpe presets that have both slide and aftertouch
    Includes easy ability to assign slide and aftertouch (eg. Ppg infinite this was a complete pain in the arse to do)
    Allows up to +/-48 pitchbend (eg. Ppg infinite didnt implement this properly so pitch glides didn't work as they should, though it took me a very long time to get them to admit that)
    Is polyphonic (I like Shockwave a lot, but Roger Linn argued at length in forum posts that it is not truly mpe because of this)
    Etc etc I'm sure there must be more but these would be the main things

    I discussed this with Chris Randall before. He argues that the preset designers can decide whether or not to add aftertouch and slide to a patch or not. This is true, but when I am buying an mpe synth, I definitely prefer one where the presets are already as expressive as possible. If anyone goes from an experience of using something like Cypher 2 or Equator on desktop to using the average ios mpe synth, straight out of the box it is usually a disappointing experience.

    Kind of makes me want to cry how hard it is for people to understand that. Magellan 2 should be bitch slapped for having a non mpe mod wheel. If an app says its mpe but its not actually mpe, I don't hesitate: it's an instant refund. Waste my time, I'll waste yours

  • Yeah, it’s annoying as hell how poorly these things are usually done. I love mpe but I would have saved a lot of time and money if I hadn’t fallen down that rabbit hole, hopefully things will improve.

  • edited April 26

    But also release velocity is missing in most tools. I was surprised to find it inside the Obsidian synth in NS2.
    I think the term MPE is too often used when just polyphonic X, Y movements are meant.
    But f.... MPE midi 2.0 is on the way ;)

  • Yes, add release to the list. I almost forgot about that one because it is so rarely implemented haha. Which ios mpe synths can u think of that use it? This, again, is done wvry well on Equator, Cypher 2 and Strobe 2.

  • @Blue_Mangoo Velocity keyboard has not been stable for me the last few months and seems to creates stuck notes all the time. This was my favorite and I have recently started using KB - one, which I had

  • @Gavinski said:
    Well, don't have time now to think that through in detail, but would include things like:

    Having inbuilt mpe presets that have both slide and aftertouch
    Includes easy ability to assign slide and aftertouch (eg. Ppg infinite this was a complete pain in the arse to do)
    Allows up to +/-48 pitchbend (eg. Ppg infinite didnt implement this properly so pitch glides didn't work as they should, though it took me a very long time to get them to admit that)
    Is polyphonic (I like Shockwave a lot, but Roger Linn argued at length in forum posts that it is not truly mpe because of this)
    Etc etc I'm sure there must be more but these would be the main things

    I discussed this with Chris Randall before. He argues that the preset designers can decide whether or not to add aftertouch and slide to a patch or not. This is true, but when I am buying an mpe synth, I definitely prefer one where the presets are already as expressive as possible. If anyone goes from an experience of using something like Cypher 2 or Equator on desktop to using the average ios mpe synth, straight out of the box it is usually a disappointing experience.

    Sorry I can't keep on with you guys, too many conversations at once...

    Maybe it doesn't need to be so systematic? Maybe just sharing what your experiences are with such and such instrument, how well or bad it plays with your controller, and so on?

    In any case there are a few things I hadn't observed and which you people have pointed to. @sclurbs indignation is very enlightening, thanks for your observations.

    I have personally almost given up "the" MPE synth on iOS. AudioDamage is really close in my opinion but not quite there in my opinion and for my personal taste. Looking forward Phosphor (3?), see what brings.

    What I'm waiting is that somebody one day decides to do something with the Linnstrument in mind (just like Equator/Cypher... is for designed for Roli). One thing is MPE, other is how well you implement it, but then again, every controller is different.

  • @waka_x said:
    pls list here, to have em on one place:

    a) MPE keyb emulators/simulators
    on iOS

    KB-1 and Velocity Keyboard are the only ones for category a?

  • ThumbJam has been doing it for years before there was even MPE.... channel per touch for output, and responding to independent per-channel pitch-bend and pressure/CCs for input. It also follows MPE extras such as the main channel overall adjustment when MPE Mode is enabled for input. These settings are all global, not per-preset. It doesn't do anything for release velocity.

  • Hopefully on-topic question:

    I have a KMI QuNexus keyboard that I own because it sends CV signals to my synths (and also translates MIDI to CV). Is anyone using one with MPE synths on iOS? It looks like it's capable of MPE but I'm not 100% if it just walks close to the definition and falls short

  • KMI KBP4 is the product that they advertise as MPE:

    https://www.keithmcmillen.com/products/k-board-pro-4/

    But I don't see it mentioned for QuNexus:

    https://support.keithmcmillen.com/hc/en-us/sections/200608239-QuNexus-FAQ

  • No, that's what I discovered too, but there are videos on their YouTube channel with the QuNexus controling Animoog and using pressure sensitivity to control filters etc

  • From their FAQ: https://support.keithmcmillen.com/hc/en-us/articles/204303889--What-are-the-differences-between-QuNexus-and-K-Board-

    It seems that it has:
    Separate pressure data per key
    Separate tilt data per key
    Channel-Per-Note (Channel Rotation)

    Whether it qualifies as MPE, I can't tell.

    @bichuelo said:

    @waka_x said:
    pls list here, to have em on one place:

    a) MPE keyb emulators/simulators
    on iOS

    KB-1 and Velocity Keyboard are the only ones for category a?

    Ribbons by Olympia Noise has also MIDI MPE out.
    Animoog has a MIDI out IAP and I think Model 15 has it included (ie, not IAP)
    Limited to 6 pads but Mononoke also sends MPE out.

    I have never tested these (I prefer MPE Midi in rather than out) 😉

  • @sonosaurus said:
    ThumbJam has been doing it for years before there was even MPE.... channel per touch for output, and responding to independent per-channel pitch-bend and pressure/CCs for input. It also follows MPE extras such as the main channel overall adjustment when MPE Mode is enabled for input. These settings are all global, not per-preset. It doesn't do anything for release velocity.

    I remember purchasing Thumbjam just because of this, after watching a video of Gert Bevin playing it with the Linnstrument. Really expressive instrument, settings are a bit difficult for the uninitiated but I have enjoyed it a lot over the years. You should make a synthesiser one day (no samples) exploiting those expression settings.

  • @despego said:
    From their FAQ: https://support.keithmcmillen.com/hc/en-us/articles/204303889--What-are-the-differences-between-QuNexus-and-K-Board-

    It seems that it has:
    Separate pressure data per key
    Separate tilt data per key
    Channel-Per-Note (Channel Rotation)

    Whether it qualifies as MPE, I can't tell.

    Yes, that's the crux of the issue I guess. Is it E sufficiently to be MPE. Where does the line in the sand exist?

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