Has iOS immediacy ruined hardware for you?

Telefunky

@OscarSouth the stuff you achieved with your group amazes me time and again

Telefunky

In my case IOS did repair a ruined piece of hardware (Casio CZ1000)
CZ Touch by Coffeeshopped took over for the worn buttons and added realtime control that the original control surface doesn't provide...

OscarSouth

@Telefunky said:
@OscarSouth the stuff you achieved with your group amazes me time and again

Thank you for the kind words!

vitocorleone123

Just got back from Patchworks in Seattle, where I spent more time with the XD module and OB-6 module. I really like the XD - crisp. Reminds me of a Gadget 😀

But the OB-6.... Holy f&$k the sound coming out of that thing is to die for. So is the price tag.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed I'll be able to try out the MFB Synth Pro early Jan as something I'll be happy with that - it's half the price of the OB-6, but twice that of the Korg. Otherwise.... Hmm.

iOS sounds different from PC softsynths sounds different than analog hardware synths. It's all brushes and paints for the palette. Sometimes oil, sometimes acrylic, sometimes watercolor. It's all creative art.

[Deleted User]

@vitocorleone123 said:
Just got back from Patchworks in Seattle, where I spent more time with the XD module and OB-6 module. I really like the XD - crisp. Reminds me of a Gadget 😀

But the OB-6.... Holy f&$k the sound coming out of that thing is to die for. So is the price tag.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed I'll be able to try out the MFB Synth Pro early Jan as something I'll be happy with that is half the price of the OB-6 bit twice that of the Korg. Otherwise.... Hmm.

iOS sounds different from PC softsynths sounds different than analog hardware synths. It's all brushes and paints for the palette. Sometimes oil, sometimes acrylic, sometimes watercolor. It's all creative art.

That ob6 dude, killer.

vitocorleone123

@[Deleted User] said:

@vitocorleone123 said:
Just got back from Patchworks in Seattle, where I spent more time with the XD module and OB-6 module. I really like the XD - crisp. Reminds me of a Gadget 😀

But the OB-6.... Holy f&$k the sound coming out of that thing is to die for. So is the price tag.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed I'll be able to try out the MFB Synth Pro early Jan as something I'll be happy with that is half the price of the OB-6 bit twice that of the Korg. Otherwise.... Hmm.

iOS sounds different from PC softsynths sounds different than analog hardware synths. It's all brushes and paints for the palette. Sometimes oil, sometimes acrylic, sometimes watercolor. It's all creative art.

That ob6 dude, killer.

It sounds great online in good YT videos, but, in person.... I might have to get it and use "it's my one mid-life crisis purchase" as the excuse when I sell one of just a few Amazon stock options I'm holding on to and my wife wonders WTF this new thing on the desk is (even though I'll get rid of the thing on there presently).... not even sure a single option would cover it, so still need to be saving to make up the difference!

This shows something NOT 80s sounding on it

[Deleted User]

@vitocorleone123 said:

@[Deleted User] said:

@vitocorleone123 said:
Just got back from Patchworks in Seattle, where I spent more time with the XD module and OB-6 module. I really like the XD - crisp. Reminds me of a Gadget 😀

But the OB-6.... Holy f&$k the sound coming out of that thing is to die for. So is the price tag.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed I'll be able to try out the MFB Synth Pro early Jan as something I'll be happy with that is half the price of the OB-6 bit twice that of the Korg. Otherwise.... Hmm.

iOS sounds different from PC softsynths sounds different than analog hardware synths. It's all brushes and paints for the palette. Sometimes oil, sometimes acrylic, sometimes watercolor. It's all creative art.

That ob6 dude, killer.

It sounds great online in good YT videos, but, in person.... I might have to get it and use "it's my one mid-life crisis purchase" as the excuse when I sell one of just a few Amazon stock options I'm holding on to and my wife wonders WTF this new thing on the desk is (even though I'll get rid of the thing on there presently).... not even sure a single option would cover it, so still need to be saving to make up the difference!

Im rooting for you! Where there is a will there is a way 😄

[Deleted User]

@OscarSouth said:

@bato said:

@OscarSouth said:

Hey, that's great information, so in other words, as long as using (looped) pattern clips in "session view" things work great for you?

I don’t sequence anything in BM3 itself, I just use it as an AU/sampler host, audio routing, mixer etc.

Interesting; so what do you use for sequencing?

A Haskell based pattern syntax called TidalCycles. Here’s a clip from that concert:

Good stuff - come and do a gig in Wales!

OscarSouth

@MonzoPro said:

@OscarSouth said:

@bato said:

@OscarSouth said:

Hey, that's great information, so in other words, as long as using (looped) pattern clips in "session view" things work great for you?

I don’t sequence anything in BM3 itself, I just use it as an AU/sampler host, audio routing, mixer etc.

Interesting; so what do you use for sequencing?

A Haskell based pattern syntax called TidalCycles. Here’s a clip from that concert:

Good stuff - come and do a gig in Wales!

What part? I have a few really close friends around North Wales that I’ve not seen in 3-5 years .. I am overdue a trip in that direction!

[Deleted User]

@OscarSouth said:

@MonzoPro said:

@OscarSouth said:

@bato said:

@OscarSouth said:

Hey, that's great information, so in other words, as long as using (looped) pattern clips in "session view" things work great for you?

I don’t sequence anything in BM3 itself, I just use it as an AU/sampler host, audio routing, mixer etc.

Interesting; so what do you use for sequencing?

A Haskell based pattern syntax called TidalCycles. Here’s a clip from that concert:

Good stuff - come and do a gig in Wales!

What part? I have a few really close friends around North Wales that I’ve not seen in 3-5 years .. I am overdue a trip in that direction!

I’m in Mid Wales/borders - some good venues here -

bato

@OscarSouth said:

@bato said:

@OscarSouth said:

Hey, that's great information, so in other words, as long as using (looped) pattern clips in "session view" things work great for you?

I don’t sequence anything in BM3 itself, I just use it as an AU/sampler host, audio routing, mixer etc.

Interesting; so what do you use for sequencing?

A Haskell based pattern syntax called TidalCycles. Here’s a clip from that concert:

Ok, got it.
Thanks for the clip BTW, really enjoyed your musical sensibility. And the whole performance looks very interesting.

Is this distributed anywhere; Spotify or the likes?

RUST( i )K

@DYMS said:
I was thinking recently about how the immediacy of music apps on the iPad has ruined hardware for me in someways.

I feel that I can always get something musical and personally enjoyable out of an iPad using AUM, Rozeta Suite, Fugue, Patterning, some synths, etc. I also feel like I understand how the apps “work” after a day or two of use.

After the busy work day, long commute, and father duties are sorted I often can’t find the energy to coax something out of a digitakt, 0-Coast, MPC Live, Zoia, etc.

Hardware always feels like I need to dedicate so much more time to learning how all the parts come together before I am able to create anything I am happy with. I end up feeling like the money I spent on it wasn’t worth what I am getting out of it. Can’t blame the devices, that is all on me...

However, I look at an iPad or computer screen for about 12 hours a day, and at the end of the day just want get away from these devices. This leads me to always be on the lookout for that hardware box that is going to replace the immediacy of the iPad, and the cycle continues.

How about other users? Do you feel that iOS audio has influenced your approach to hardware. How are you balancing this in your musical life?

Exact opposite.

Don't mean to be "that" guy...the contrarian know it all asshole....but......I feel the exact opposite and ponder that many companies feel the same.

I think one day we will understand the true impact iOS music making on music on a whole as well as hardware purchases.

The actual reciprocal may be true in my humble opinion.

I feel that iOS if it takes any detours regarding connectivity or too many settings or matrix connections they will lose users to hardware.

I got tired of setting up midi and CC, it took more time than getting hardware ready to be honest.

So each has their place and together they make a great combo for me.

I am a hybrid user who uses hardware and iOS .

Not laptop at all in actual set up.

[Deleted User]

I look at it this way...

Find the right balance and it won’t matter

I have finally found the perfect balance after years of hardware whoring and I can switch between iOS, Ableton, Hardware, Software pretty seamlessly which I can’t believe I have actually realised....

....good times indeed

dendy

.

OscarSouth

@bato said:

@OscarSouth said:

@bato said:

@OscarSouth said:

Hey, that's great information, so in other words, as long as using (looped) pattern clips in "session view" things work great for you?

I don’t sequence anything in BM3 itself, I just use it as an AU/sampler host, audio routing, mixer etc.

Interesting; so what do you use for sequencing?

A Haskell based pattern syntax called TidalCycles. Here’s a clip from that concert:

Ok, got it.
Thanks for the clip BTW, really enjoyed your musical sensibility. And the whole performance looks very interesting.

Is this distributed anywhere; Spotify or the likes?

Thanks very much!
Mostly on YouTube at the moment — we have a solo khomus (Saydyy’s mouth harp instrument) CD which is sold out right now. Will be re-released and published on Spotify at that time. We’re working on producing this live repertoire as studio recordings at the moment (live coding presents a particular set of challenges in the studio). Should get them done by Feb and then will be putting onto Spotify.

u0421793

The good news for this weekend: I’ve had my ARP 2600 apart for the first time in 2.5 years, since I built the replacement 4019 VCA module on veroboard. After a lot of continued testing outboard, I’ve taken the 2600 apart and soldered in the replacement module and it works in the 2600 itself. Works quite well in fact. I built several copies of the 4019 VCA and chose the best one. I also continued replacing the op-amps, as most of the originals had gone bad somehow. Now the output amps are more even and less noisy, it also fixed the voltage processors, and the noise gen (which I’d also estimate is less noisy, but it’s a noise gen).

So, for the first time since I owned this, which is about something like 25 years, maybe a few less than that, it actually all works. For the first time. It’s the one with “Roger Glover” stencilled to the outside casing (and on the 3604P keyboard as well). This is the model with the 4012 VCF, which is similar to the Moog ladder VCF and which became the result of some legal leverage. Sounds really excellent. However, it’s big and old and smelly, and to be honest I want to sell it and get it out of the house.

[Deleted User]

@u0421793 said:
The good news for this weekend: I’ve had my ARP 2600 apart for the first time in 2.5 years, since I built the replacement 4019 VCA module on veroboard. After a lot of continued testing outboard, I’ve taken the 2600 apart and soldered in the replacement module and it works in the 2600 itself. Works quite well in fact. I built several copies of the 4019 VCA and chose the best one. I also continued replacing the op-amps, as most of the originals had gone bad somehow. Now the output amps are more even and less noisy, it also fixed the voltage processors, and the noise gen (which I’d also estimate is less noisy, but it’s a noise gen).

So, for the first time since I owned this, which is about something like 25 years, maybe a few less than that, it actually all works. For the first time. It’s the one with “Roger Glover” stencilled to the outside casing (and on the 3604P keyboard as well). This is the model with the 4012 VCF, which is similar to the Moog ladder VCF and which became the result of some legal leverage. Sounds really excellent. However, it’s big and old and smelly, and to be honest I want to sell it and get it out of the house.

Would be a good idea to sell before the behringer clone comes out next year to get max cash 💰

u0421793

@[Deleted User] said:

@u0421793 said:
The good news for this weekend: I’ve had my ARP 2600 apart for the first time in 2.5 years, since I built the replacement 4019 VCA module on veroboard. After a lot of continued testing outboard, I’ve taken the 2600 apart and soldered in the replacement module and it works in the 2600 itself. Works quite well in fact. I built several copies of the 4019 VCA and chose the best one. I also continued replacing the op-amps, as most of the originals had gone bad somehow. Now the output amps are more even and less noisy, it also fixed the voltage processors, and the noise gen (which I’d also estimate is less noisy, but it’s a noise gen).

So, for the first time since I owned this, which is about something like 25 years, maybe a few less than that, it actually all works. For the first time. It’s the one with “Roger Glover” stencilled to the outside casing (and on the 3604P keyboard as well). This is the model with the 4012 VCF, which is similar to the Moog ladder VCF and which became the result of some legal leverage. Sounds really excellent. However, it’s big and old and smelly, and to be honest I want to sell it and get it out of the house.

Would be a good idea to sell before the behringer clone comes out next year to get max cash 💰

The thought had occurred, yes.

AndyPlankton

@CracklePot said:

@AndyPlankton said:
Absolutely not. I find my hardware more immediate than the iPad, when I switch on I know exactly what I'm going to use and pretty much how I'm going to use it.

Too many apps, or not enough hardware?

Hardware does limit you to the few options you own, and that does help being productive.
But choices and options aren’t bad, just not helping stay focused.

I always know what guitar FX pedals I will use, since I only own a handful.
But ToneStack is easy to get lost in, while getting nothing done production-wise.

I see your point here.
I may have too many things to play with, so I spend most of my time playing/exploring rather than working/producing.
But it is a hell of a good time.

I think it is the constantly changing workflow and available options on iOS, even trying to stick to particular apps to reduce the rate of change doesn't seem to help.

Also with hardware and limited 'save slots' it means I save a lot less dross, and therefore have far less clutter when sifting for the next thing to do
On iOS I have far too many unfinished projects (as you may well be aware ) And most get swamped with other things and forgotten for longer than they should.

[Deleted User]

@AndyPlankton said:

@CracklePot said:

@AndyPlankton said:
Absolutely not. I find my hardware more immediate than the iPad, when I switch on I know exactly what I'm going to use and pretty much how I'm going to use it.

Too many apps, or not enough hardware?

Hardware does limit you to the few options you own, and that does help being productive.
But choices and options aren’t bad, just not helping stay focused.

I always know what guitar FX pedals I will use, since I only own a handful.
But ToneStack is easy to get lost in, while getting nothing done production-wise.

I see your point here.
I may have too many things to play with, so I spend most of my time playing/exploring rather than working/producing.
But it is a hell of a good time.

I think it is the constantly changing workflow and available options on iOS, even trying to stick to particular apps to reduce the rate of change doesn't seem to help.

Also with hardware and limited 'save slots' it means I save a lot less dross, and therefore have far less clutter when sifting for the next thing to do
On iOS I have far too many unfinished projects (as you may well be aware ) And most get swamped with other things and forgotten for longer than they should.

Maybe shifting the goal could help. If you set a deadline and some constraints related to content you want to make then the tool will not be a limitation and new proposals will fit or be rejected without any pain.

jm2c

DatGood

Has iOS immediacy ruined hardware for you?
Short answer; No. Actually did the total opposite for me.

Disclaimer, I'm not a musician/engineer etc. I'm a photographer.

iOS moved me away from the desktop except for mixing/mastering (Ableton and Reason). The experience was liberating for portability, exciting because there were now more tactile interfaces (touch screen). I bought more controllers to augment the experience of actual hardware for live playing and improv (keys, 16 pads, encoders and faders). Buying Arturia, Korg and Moog emulations got me even more interested in actual hardware, how they work, nuances in function and sound design. I only just got my first hardware synth (mono) a month ago and researching a poly/4-voice-para next. In the end I'd like 2 or 3 boxes and that's it. I'm not a gear head.

Yes, the immediacy is great and apps are cheaper, but for me, iOS requires maintenance; you have to upgrade your app (that may or may not break something you love cough cough BM3) or upgrade iOS (that may also break something) or upgrade the iPad. Also, for me, the abundance of options on iOS keeps me from actually finishing or even starting a project.

Admittedly, in the end I'd never leave iOS, specifically due to the abundance of midi sequencers, FX modules and routing options (cable management on a small desk drives me NUTZZZZZ!!!)

So iOS definitely got me into hardware and not the other way around.

u0421793

@u0421793 said:

@[Deleted User] said:

@u0421793 said:
The good news for this weekend: I’ve had my ARP 2600 apart for the first time in 2.5 years, since I built the replacement 4019 VCA module on veroboard. After a lot of continued testing outboard, I’ve taken the 2600 apart and soldered in the replacement module and it works in the 2600 itself. Works quite well in fact. I built several copies of the 4019 VCA and chose the best one. I also continued replacing the op-amps, as most of the originals had gone bad somehow. Now the output amps are more even and less noisy, it also fixed the voltage processors, and the noise gen (which I’d also estimate is less noisy, but it’s a noise gen).

So, for the first time since I owned this, which is about something like 25 years, maybe a few less than that, it actually all works. For the first time. It’s the one with “Roger Glover” stencilled to the outside casing (and on the 3604P keyboard as well). This is the model with the 4012 VCF, which is similar to the Moog ladder VCF and which became the result of some legal leverage. Sounds really excellent. However, it’s big and old and smelly, and to be honest I want to sell it and get it out of the house.

Would be a good idea to sell before the behringer clone comes out next year to get max cash 💰

The thought had occurred, yes.

Actually, and not wishing to hijack the thread so I’ll keep it brief, but…

Let’s say hypothetically I had some kind of old but desirable three-VCO synth, which used to be owned by a famous rock musician, and I wanted to sell it, but I stated explicitly that I wanted to sell it for, let’s say, 1 Bitcoin (or starting at 1btc if there’s competing offers). What would people here think? Would you buy a synth in bitcoin (not necessarily 1 whole btc, it’d be whatever the particular synth you’re after is worth in bitcoin). Should you? Could you? Is it something you’ve ever thought of?

crony

@u0421793

Nothing’s really simple with you, right ? 🤣
Why can’t you get regular Gbp or Euros and why would you need bitcoins for ?

Put it on eBay, take the money, run.
You’re welcome 👽

And no I don’t think a bitcoin will rise again above 21K $

[Deleted User]

@u0421793 said:

@u0421793 said:

@[Deleted User] said:

@u0421793 said:
The good news for this weekend: I’ve had my ARP 2600 apart for the first time in 2.5 years, since I built the replacement 4019 VCA module on veroboard. After a lot of continued testing outboard, I’ve taken the 2600 apart and soldered in the replacement module and it works in the 2600 itself. Works quite well in fact. I built several copies of the 4019 VCA and chose the best one. I also continued replacing the op-amps, as most of the originals had gone bad somehow. Now the output amps are more even and less noisy, it also fixed the voltage processors, and the noise gen (which I’d also estimate is less noisy, but it’s a noise gen).

So, for the first time since I owned this, which is about something like 25 years, maybe a few less than that, it actually all works. For the first time. It’s the one with “Roger Glover” stencilled to the outside casing (and on the 3604P keyboard as well). This is the model with the 4012 VCF, which is similar to the Moog ladder VCF and which became the result of some legal leverage. Sounds really excellent. However, it’s big and old and smelly, and to be honest I want to sell it and get it out of the house.

Would be a good idea to sell before the behringer clone comes out next year to get max cash 💰

The thought had occurred, yes.

Actually, and not wishing to hijack the thread so I’ll keep it brief, but…

Let’s say hypothetically I had some kind of old but desirable three-VCO synth, which used to be owned by a famous rock musician, and I wanted to sell it, but I stated explicitly that I wanted to sell it for, let’s say, 1 Bitcoin (or starting at 1btc if there’s competing offers). What would people here think? Would you buy a synth in bitcoin (not necessarily 1 whole btc, it’d be whatever the particular synth you’re after is worth in bitcoin). Should you? Could you? Is it something you’ve ever thought of?

I would imagine you average 50 pluser who might be interested in your synth would be scared 😱 witless of a bitcoin.

Tarekith

@vitocorleone123 said:
Just got back from Patchworks in Seattle, where I spent more time with the XD module and OB-6 module. I really like the XD - crisp. Reminds me of a Gadget 😀

But the OB-6.... Holy f&$k the sound coming out of that thing is to die for. So is the price tag.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed I'll be able to try out the MFB Synth Pro early Jan as something I'll be happy with that - it's half the price of the OB-6, but twice that of the Korg. Otherwise.... Hmm.

iOS sounds different from PC softsynths sounds different than analog hardware synths. It's all brushes and paints for the palette. Sometimes oil, sometimes acrylic, sometimes watercolor. It's all creative art.

I live right near there, let me know next time you go and maybe we can meet up. And yes, the OB-6 is amazing.

iOS apps are almost always a very utilitarian thing for me, I just can't get sucked into them as much as hardware. I think the biggest thing for me is just that there's still this subtle disconnect between physical motion and getting it to register accurately on a touchscreen that pulls me out of it.

To this day in almost every app I use, if I tweak a parameter and then take my finger off the touchscreen the parameter value still changes a bit when I "pull off". This drives me crazy, and is one reason I tend to just broadly sketch ideas on iOS (great for that) and then fine tune once I get into the studio.

Maybe the end result is the same to other people, but the process for me is a lot more predictable and controlled. I actually find it kind of funny the thread is titled "the iOS immediacy..." as it's totally the opposite in my mind compared to hardware.

[Deleted User]

@Tarekith said:

@vitocorleone123 said:
Just got back from Patchworks in Seattle, where I spent more time with the XD module and OB-6 module. I really like the XD - crisp. Reminds me of a Gadget 😀

But the OB-6.... Holy f&$k the sound coming out of that thing is to die for. So is the price tag.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed I'll be able to try out the MFB Synth Pro early Jan as something I'll be happy with that - it's half the price of the OB-6, but twice that of the Korg. Otherwise.... Hmm.

iOS sounds different from PC softsynths sounds different than analog hardware synths. It's all brushes and paints for the palette. Sometimes oil, sometimes acrylic, sometimes watercolor. It's all creative art.

I live right near there, let me know next time you go and maybe we can meet up. And yes, the OB-6 is amazing.

iOS apps are almost always a very utilitarian thing for me, I just can't get sucked into them as much as hardware. I think the biggest thing for me is just that there's still this subtle disconnect between physical motion and getting it to register accurately on a touchscreen that pulls me out of it.

To this day in almost every app I use, if I tweak a parameter and then take my finger off the touchscreen the parameter value still changes a bit when I "pull off". This drives me crazy, and is one reason I tend to just broadly sketch ideas on iOS (great for that) and then fine tune once I get into the studio.

Maybe the end result is the same to other people, but the process for me is a lot more predictable and controlled. I actually find it kind of funny the thread is titled "the iOS immediacy..." as it's totally the opposite in my mind compared to hardware.

Only only ios app that nailed the parameter jog is eventide. I hope other apps follow suit.

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

LinearLineman

@horsetrainer echos my own thoughts about keyboards. As a jazz player I want an action that is something piano like, but the piano action is limiting for synths and organs especially. I’ve been struggling with trying to find the right keyboard, but realized just today that is impossible. So now I am thinking maybe a Roland FP10 for the 88 note hammer action feel and possibly a smaller Maudio for a second synth board with pitch and mod wheels. About $700 for the two. Hmmm.

[Deleted User]

@LinearLineman said:
@horsetrainer echos my own thoughts about keyboards. As a jazz player I want an action that is something piano like, but the piano action is limiting for synths and organs especially. I’ve been struggling with trying to find the right keyboard, but realized just today that is impossible. So now I am thinking maybe a Roland FP10 for the 88 note hammer action feel and possibly a smaller Maudio for a second synth board with pitch and mod wheels. About $700 for the two. Hmmm.

@LinearLineman also the Casio Privia PX-S1000 looks pretty good although another 100 bucks, do you have an audio device since you sold the kawai?

LinearLineman

@[Deleted User], I tried the new Casio. The keys were too textured and the action too bouncy for me. I like the fp10 action better. No, no keyboard yet but coming closer.