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AU's or apps with sample mangling similar to elektron

Hello. I put off buying a digitakt or octatrack for an iPad pro that I can use for more general functionality as far as being able to work when I am not in the studio. I'm new to this. Plan on using beatmaker 3, but am wondering if there are any ways to really mangle samples like you can with elektron products in a way that I can incorporate into beatmaker. I understand P locks are out, as I wont have the sequencer from the elektron, but would at least like the sample mangling capabilities. Any suggestions?

Thanks for any and all help, and I hope I am asking in the right place. I'm very much starting from ground zero here as far as ios goes. My only experience with iPads were the ipad 2 when it came out. I know nothing about what apps are good, other than beatmaker and a few synths I'd like to use like synthmaster, obxd, and any moog ones if they are available in AU format.

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  • To my knowledge, you can try to mimic the sample mangling with the use of CC’s.. using many of the samplers or synths in the Ipad..

    In the end every step sequencer that supports sending several CC’s at the same time ..

    If you get the same deep results? That depends on the Soundsource..

    The workflow however will be quite different, but the results should be sattisfying

  • edited August 2019

    what exact sample mangling features are on elektron, which are so unique ? just curious ..

    plus p-locks - from what i read it's basically automation :) Or i'm not understanding it corretly ? In any daw you can tweak param to some value and then tweak it back and recordit basically like automation .. Or is p-locks something other ?

  • @dstepatl
    Groove Rider has a lot of what you're asking for:
    It does have P-locks in the way that you can set most sound parameter values for each step individually and have abrupt or smooth changes between them, slice audio to pads, P-lock sample start and end for each step and a freely assignable modulation source. This goes a long way towards elektron-alike features.
    Add 4-voice polyphony for each part and freedom of using your own samples and synth wavetables plus up to 256 audio slices and one of the best MIDI clock implementations in iOS apps and there's little to complain.

  • edited August 2019

    @dendy said:
    Or is p-locks something other ?

    P-Locks are 'per step value locks' and the set value will not affect the steps after it...
    Most apps that implement per step automation retain the value for the following steps (GR-16 does this as an example)

    So lets take the simple example that your default filter cutoff is set to 127.
    On one step you 'p-lock' the cutoff to 64 and when the step has played thru cutoff value returns to 127.

    For performances the step with the 'locked' value will always be 64 while you can perform the filter value and it will affect all other steps which do not have any locks.

    Sure p-lock style effects can be done using automation but imagine you want to ramp up a value from 0-127 and every 4th step needs a 'locked' value. Then the editing becomes tedious when you want to change the ramped values without affecting the locks...

  • The main point of getting an Elektron machine is probably because of the UI. It's very fast to mod and mangle your samples and patterns on the fly. You might be able to copy the results in an app, or by combining several apps, but the lack of immediacy means you probably won't.

    The exception to this is Egoist, which is just excellent. It has little to do with the Elektron way, though.

  • edited August 2019

    @dstepatl You can do P-locks with Octachron's sequencer if you map one of the midi cc slots to a parameter. You get 8 slots per track. There are 8 tracks for sequencing. So that's 64 slots available for P-lock sequencing.

    So you could sequence your drums using Octachron and use midi cc in combination with the effects mentioned above.

    I'll do a video soon for this on my Instagram account: aux.mux I have 2 videos there of how I'm using Octachron and AudioLayer to make own version of the Digitakt / iOS modular drum machine.

    One example:

  • Woodstepper can do quite a bit of mangle

  • agreed grooverider has some fun sample manipulating features. i’ve been digging back into that app lately and realizing just how powerful it can be

  • Thanks everyone. I'm going to look into all of these. Should arrive tomorrow, and gotta get it all set up first and then get started. I've seen lists of aus by some are incomplete/not updated and some include so many it's hard to determine the good ones to look into. I appreciate all of your help.

  • @auxmux said:
    @dstepatl You can do P-locks with Octachron's sequencer if you map one of the midi cc slots to a parameter. You get 8 slots per track. There are 8 tracks for sequencing. So that's 64 slots available for P-lock sequencing.

    So you could sequence your drums using Octachron and use midi cc in combination with the effects mentioned above.

    I'll do a video soon for this on my Instagram account: aux.mux I have 2 videos there of how I'm using Octachron and AudioLayer to make own version of the Digitakt / iOS modular drum machine.

    One example:

    This video looks intriguing. Going to try to figure some of this out.

  • edited August 2019

    @dstepatl
    Look into Elastic Drums, it has a lot of what you’re looking for, really quite deep, brilliant and modern, along with a very immediate hands on feeling

  • @dstepatl said:

    @auxmux said:
    @dstepatl You can do P-locks with Octachron's sequencer if you map one of the midi cc slots to a parameter. You get 8 slots per track. There are 8 tracks for sequencing. So that's 64 slots available for P-lock sequencing.

    So you could sequence your drums using Octachron and use midi cc in combination with the effects mentioned above.

    I'll do a video soon for this on my Instagram account: aux.mux I have 2 videos there of how I'm using Octachron and AudioLayer to make own version of the Digitakt / iOS modular drum machine.

    One example:

    This video looks intriguing. Going to try to figure some of this out.

    If you're interested in a template, let me know. Happy to share.

  • Another vote for GR16; in addition to p-locks it has conditional triggers modeled very closely after Elektron. It's about as close as you get to the Digitakt on iOS, and everything else is a distant second.

  • @auxmux said:
    If you're interested in a template, let me know. Happy to share.

    If I had more time at the moment I’d try to whip that up, An AUM template would be interesting to poke around at.

  • Thanks, gonna have a look tonight ;)

  • @dendy said:
    what exact sample mangling features are on elektron, which are so unique ? just curious ..

    The only Elektron product I have is Octatrack Mk1. Before I bought it, I read a discussion between two gentlemen who got together for a friendly Ableton Live (version 7? 8? This was in the early 2010s) vs. Octatrack battle. Octatrack guy acknowledged that any feature that his device had, could also be found in Live. However, he was able to patch up a particular combination of live audio looping tracks, FX loaded in both FX slots, LFO assignments, etc. in a fraction of the time the Live guy was able to do it, because of the Octatrack's physical knobs, buttons, and fader.

    By the time Live guy caught up to Octatrack guy, Octatrack guy had already moved on to another sound mangling idea.

    Typical tradeoff between software and hardware - near unlimited potential in software vs. fast workflow thanks to pre-mapped physical controls. Octatrack does have a weakness though in the sample slice/chop department - takes more steps than it should to get slices set up, no MIDI control of slices - though I've heard of hacks enabled by buying the Retrokits RK-002 Smart MIDI cable, cannot slice by transient detection, etc.

    I learned a lot about operating my Octatrack from the above Octatrack guy. I like to use LFOs to modulate sample start, sample retrig, etc. on Flex tracks. FX are also fun to modulate. I'm sure most, if not all of this, can be done in some iOS app or another. OTOH, it takes just a few seconds reassign LFO mappings if I want to modulate something else, or change Scene settings for use with the fader, or change inter-track audio routing, etc.

  • It’s not exactly what you’re looking for but you really should try this if you’re looking for a really awesome sequence sample mangling
    Sequential for iPad by Artemiy Pavlov

  • @MonkeyDrummer said:
    It’s not exactly what you’re looking for but you really should try this if you’re looking for a really awesome sequence sample mangling
    Sequential for iPad by Artemiy Pavlov

    +1.

    It is an old app but you can really mess samples up with this one. Or you can adjust the settings and go gentle. And you can use "ramdomise" as well.

  • So, not reading through the whole thread but after I read about what Drambo may or may not do prompted me to go back to hardware. Specifically a Digitakt and then it really blossomed from there. Elektron is something special in the workflow department and not quite (just yet) something you can replace by software, of any kind. That said... gr16 probably comes the closest to that “fun” workflow that Elektron gives.

  • Just to confuse things further, both the OP-1 and OP-Z can mangle samples.

    The OP-Z has p-locks, and a sequencer with many randomization options.

    The OP-1's drum sampler can go wild with LFOs and sequencing. Plus, you can connect the two together ;)

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