How to get that good ol' Delta Blues sound ?

Hi,

Ok for those of you who would suggest me to get old vintage equipment, well, it could be nice but no thanks.

Since last year iOS musicians got really spoiled with apps for LoFi effects, tape emulators etc... I am especially thinking about Klevgrand apps like DAW cassette, DAW LP, or even REAMP. Also thinking about those vintage delay emulation like Kai Aras amazing RE-1. K7D seems also really good, just bought the app but didn't have the time to experiment.

Anyway, as a long time guitar player, crazy about open tunings and fingerpicking technique, you can imagine the love I got for all those amazing guitar players from the 30s. I am currently working hard on Blind Blake's right hand technique. Gosh! I don't think he was human 😃

I have tried to recreate the sound of these old recordings using a combination of a few apps I mentioned above. So far it goes like this in AUM:
FAC Maxima ->
Fabfilter proQ2 (cut both high and low frequencies) ->
RE-1 (delay time to zero, 100% wet and add only Wow, flutter, saturation and hiss ) ->
DAW cassette ->
DAW LP ->
Another FAC Maxima to maximize this seriously damaged sound.

You can listen to the result here:
Listen to Mayday by JanKun #np on #SoundCloud

The guitar part itself is played in open D tuning. I quickly put it together after listening to Sylvester Weaver's "Guitar Rag" and Mississippi John Hurt's "Payday"

Not talking about the playing itself, what do you guys think about the effect itself? Did some of you already experiment this kind of things on iOS ? Any suggestions ?

EDIT 1

I am adding here a second experiment I did, this time using my National Resophonic (the first track was played on a nylon string guitar)

Listen to The Birth Of Little Blake Johnson by JanKun #np on #SoundCloud

EDIT 2

For those interested, here is my revised AUM preset:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1mfns0iqwdt25po/78rpm emulation.aumproj?dl=0

(you will need FAC Maxima, FabFilter pro Q2, Numerical Audio RE-1, Klevgrand REAMP, Klevgrand DAW vinyl (optional DDMF NoLimits on the master track). I think the result is much more convincing, please judge by yourself:

Listen to Mayday v2 by JanKun on #SoundCloud

Listen to The Birth Of Little Blake Johnson v2 by JanKun on #SoundCloud

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Comments

  • That's some good 'ole Mississippi Delta sounds, there!

  • That sounds pretty authentic to me @JanKun . Great playing too!
    Even Eric Clapton said he struggled with re-creating Robert Johnson’s style so kudos to you for studying and re-creating these early blues pioneers!

  • wimwim
    edited May 10

    Yes, nice job on the tone and the playing. I enjoyed that.

    I think a “Vinalyzer” effect with some pops and clicks would be a good addition.

    I like DAW Cassette for hiss, wobble, and degradation myself, but I’m lazy.

  • @wim said:
    Yes, nice job on the tone and the playing. I enjoyed that.

    I think a “Vinalyzer” effect with some pops and clicks would be a good addition.

    You could adust the DAW LP settings to include a few more scratches and pops.

    Sounds great to me - nice job!

  • It would be fun to hear that with the cleanest sound you can get just for reference.
    Every just 5 seconds for reference would be great to show what the live guitar being played
    sounds like.

  • There are some FX in FAC Bandit that might make it good for this Lo-Fi Tonequest.
    And FAC could use the demo of a use case for more sales.

  • Totaly convinced me! Love it!

  • Excellent job! I agree that you could use some more scratches and pops and some high frequency hiss if you wanted to go whole hog.

  • Yes, well played - but what's the essence of destroying a sound with such a ridiculous amount of technology ? It Doesn't get more 'authentic' that way... unless you want to talk someone into buying an original, rediscovered record, which would be fraud. ;)

    Just record like those guys and gals did. Use 'simple' microphones in similiar acoustic spaces and accept the challenging 'that one take has to fit' approach.
    It will transport the spirit of the tracks much better, but not cripple them artificially.
    Remark: those simple mics from the past are often quite affordable today (some research may apply), some have amazing character.

  • edited May 11

    @analog_matt said:
    That's some good 'ole Mississippi Delta sounds, there!

    Thank you @analog_matt ! I never had the chance to thank you in person for all the amazing apps you brought us. Now is the good (ol) time (blues) 😉! Can't wait for your next creation!

  • @Telefunky said:
    but what's the essence of destroying a sound with such a ridiculous amount of technology ?

    Most of us here use IOS craft "cubic zirconia": it's hard to tell it's a fake unless you use a jeweler's loop to check the 3 C's.

    You sir traffic in genuine recordings without faux ingredients.

    Just different agendas really.

    What if a film producer asked for music like a Victrola 78 RPM recording. This would be the way to do it cheaply.

  • Sounding good but try it one more time after eating an excessive amount of okra. :+1:

  • @McD said:

    @Telefunky said:
    but what's the essence of destroying a sound with such a ridiculous amount of technology ?

    Most of us here use IOS craft "cubic zirconia": it's hard to tell it's a fake unless you use a jeweler's loop to check the 3 C's.

    yeah, I might stick with those heavy duty zircon encrusted tweezers instead o:)

  • edited May 11

    @AlterEgo_UK said:
    That sounds pretty authentic to me @JanKun . Great playing too!
    Even Eric Clapton said he struggled with re-creating Robert Johnson’s style so kudos to you for studying and re-creating these early blues pioneers!

    Thank you! I don't believe it is that difficult to play in the style. Just like anything else, it is a matter of patience and practice. First one has to build a strong right hand technique, specially thumb Independence for thumb alternate picking. That is what takes the longest. I am still in this phase and have a long way to go... One then needs to experiment with a lot of different open tunings. Luckily I have been into open tunings from the beginning. I remember the first thing I did when I received my first guitar was to change the tuning because I did not like the sound of the standard one...

    I am sure Eric Clapton went through all of this long ago, I think what he was really saying is that it is difficult (I believe impossible) to write a song in the real spirit of that era. Please no more 12 bars blues starting with "woke up this morning..." or "the day I was born...".

    What I did in terms of sounds is just some kind of pastiche, or sounds artifacts recreation. But I don't think it has anything to do with the real essence of primitive blues, no matter how much sincerity I put in the playing itself.

  • edited May 11

    @Daveypoo said:

    @wim said:
    Yes, nice job on the tone and the playing. I enjoyed that.

    I think a “Vinalyzer” effect with some pops and clicks would be a good addition.

    You could adust the DAW LP settings to include a few more scratches and pops.

    Sounds great to me - nice job!

    Thanks @wim @Daveypoo @espiegel123 . Originally there was a lot more hiss and pops and clicks, but I decided to remove some to protect your beautiful ears !

    @Daveypoo, I am considering working on the "Italian Anthem Blues" only for you! 😉

  • @JanKun That’s the good stuff right there, well done.

  • Wow, not that I love this kind of tone, but it sounds nearly authentic. Like mentioned above it needs some more crackle and pops but it is so close it’s amazing. Excellent job on this, and if you’re playing great playing too. I’m a finger picker too, though I’m not very good at guitar. It’s a bit of a strange balance, but since I taught myself I focused more on my rhythm being a drummer/keyboard player and neglected the fretting hand.

  • @AudioGus said:
    Totaly convinced me! Love it!

    Thanks a lot !

  • @Telefunky said:
    Yes, well played - but what's the essence of destroying a sound with such a ridiculous amount of technology ? It Doesn't get more 'authentic' that way... unless you want to talk someone into buying an original, rediscovered record, which would be fraud. ;)

    Just record like those guys and gals did. Use 'simple' microphones in similiar acoustic spaces and accept the challenging 'that one take has to fit' approach.
    It will transport the spirit of the tracks much better, but not cripple them artificially.
    Remark: those simple mics from the past are often quite affordable today (some research may apply), some have amazing character.

    Actually, my goal was to see if I could emulate this type of sounds so I recorded this idea in one take, didn't bother much about the playing. I am considering recording a short acoustic riff and treat it this way to use as a dynamic element in some electronic project.

    But now you are mentioning this, I have got bunch of short similar ideas sleeping on the SD card of my zoom H4n. So you might hear about Little John Williamson lost recordings sooner than you think ! 😉

  • wake 'em up :+1

  • @Telefunky said:
    Yes, well played - but what's the essence of destroying a sound with such a ridiculous amount of technology ? It Doesn't get more 'authentic' that way... unless you want to talk someone into buying an original, rediscovered record, which would be fraud. ;)

    Just record like those guys and gals did. Use 'simple' microphones in similiar acoustic spaces and accept the challenging 'that one take has to fit' approach.
    It will transport the spirit of the tracks much better, but not cripple them artificially.
    Remark: those simple mics from the past are often quite affordable today (some research may apply), some have amazing character.

    Recording through a mixer, to tape, then pressing to vinyl, then transferring files to iPad? Vs just using some plugins that sound great in their own right and capture the same kind of feeling? I know which option i’d go for most days ;)

    it’s like saying why use a tape delay sim, and not a real tape delay?....or a vintage synth vst vs the real thing.....basically cost, convenience, flexibility etc...

    This recording sounds great, nice job :) I use similar chain on synths. Might have to buy Maxima :/

  • @JanKun said:

    @AlterEgo_UK said:
    That sounds pretty authentic to me @JanKun . Great playing too!
    Even Eric Clapton said he struggled with re-creating Robert Johnson’s style so kudos to you for studying and re-creating these early blues pioneers!

    Thank you! I don't believe it is that difficult to play in the style. Just like anything else, it is a matter of patience and practice. First one has to build a strong right hand technique, specially thumb Independence for thumb alternate picking. That is what takes the longest. I am still in this phase and have a long way to go... One then needs to experiment with a lot of different open tunings. Luckily I have been into open tunings from the beginning. I remember the first thing I did when I received my first guitar was to change the tuning because I did not like the sound of the standard one...

    I am sure Eric Clapton went through all of this long ago, I think what he was really saying is that it is difficult (I believe impossible) to write a song in the real spirit of that era. Please no more 12 bars blues starting with "woke up this morning..." or "the day I was born...".

    What I did in terms of sounds is just some kind of pastiche, or sounds artifacts recreation. But I don't think it has anything to do with the real essence of primitive blues, no matter how much sincerity I put in the playing itself.

    That was brilliant. I remember Eric Clapton also saying that he found it impossible to actually get to some of the notes that Robert Johnson played on his original recording.

    Please play/experiment more.

  • @McD said:
    There are some FX in FAC Bandit that might make it good for this Lo-Fi Tonequest.
    And FAC could use the demo of a use case for more sales.

    FAC bandit is definitely on my radar, I am a real sucker for AU effects, but I have been buying too much apps lately. I'll have to wait until the next sales. Unless a promocode magically appeared in my mailbox 😉

  • @syrupcore said:
    Sounding good but try it one more time after eating an excessive amount of okra. :+1:

    Definitely would like to do that. The acoustic of the WC might add some magic to it...😁
    The only problem is that here in Japan, the WC are so small that I couldn't fit in with my guitar...

  • @Ripper7620 said:
    @JanKun That’s the good stuff right there, well done.

    Thanks a lot !

  • @EyeOhEss said:

    @Telefunky said:
    Yes, well played - but what's the essence of destroying a sound with such a ridiculous amount of technology ? It Doesn't get more 'authentic' that way... unless you want to talk someone into buying an original, rediscovered record, which would be fraud. ;)

    Just record like those guys and gals did. Use 'simple' microphones in similiar acoustic spaces and accept the challenging 'that one take has to fit' approach.
    It will transport the spirit of the tracks much better, but not cripple them artificially.
    Remark: those simple mics from the past are often quite affordable today (some research may apply), some have amazing character.

    Recording through a mixer, to tape, then pressing to vinyl, then transferring files to iPad? Vs just using some plugins that sound great in their own right and capture the same kind of feeling? I know which option i’d go for most days ;)

    it’s like saying why use a tape delay sim, and not a real tape delay?....or a vintage synth vst vs the real thing.....basically cost, convenience, flexibility etc...

    This recording sounds great, nice job :) I use similar chain on synths. Might have to buy Maxima :/

    Do yourself a favor and buy FAC Maxima, this thing is pure magic!

  • @DMan said:
    Wow, not that I love this kind of tone, but it sounds nearly authentic. Like mentioned above it needs some more crackle and pops but it is so close it’s amazing. Excellent job on this, and if you’re playing great playing too. I’m a finger picker too, though I’m not very good at guitar. It’s a bit of a strange balance, but since I taught myself I focused more on my rhythm being a drummer/keyboard player and neglected the fretting hand.

    Thank you ! Fingerpicking sounds good in standard tunings too, but IMHO, fingerpicking sounds best in open tunings. You end up with simple chords shape for the fretting hand giving you more CPU brain resources to focus on the picking patterns. Check on YouTube some videos of Son House or Skip James.

  • @Jomodu said:

    @JanKun said:

    @AlterEgo_UK said:
    That sounds pretty authentic to me @JanKun . Great playing too!
    Even Eric Clapton said he struggled with re-creating Robert Johnson’s style so kudos to you for studying and re-creating these early blues pioneers!

    Thank you! I don't believe it is that difficult to play in the style. Just like anything else, it is a matter of patience and practice. First one has to build a strong right hand technique, specially thumb Independence for thumb alternate picking. That is what takes the longest. I am still in this phase and have a long way to go... One then needs to experiment with a lot of different open tunings. Luckily I have been into open tunings from the beginning. I remember the first thing I did when I received my first guitar was to change the tuning because I did not like the sound of the standard one...

    I am sure Eric Clapton went through all of this long ago, I think what he was really saying is that it is difficult (I believe impossible) to write a song in the real spirit of that era. Please no more 12 bars blues starting with "woke up this morning..." or "the day I was born...".

    What I did in terms of sounds is just some kind of pastiche, or sounds artifacts recreation. But I don't think it has anything to do with the real essence of primitive blues, no matter how much sincerity I put in the playing itself.

    That was brilliant. I remember Eric Clapton also saying that he found it impossible to actually get to some of the notes that Robert Johnson played on his original recording.

    Please play/experiment more.

    Thank you for the encouragement ! Blues is not my main focus, just something I regularly work on to keep my right hand in shape.

    The pact with the devil was bullshit. I believe Robert Johnson was an alien sent on Earth to enlighten Mankind 😉. I assume he had amazingly long and big fingers, though I might be wrong...

  • @EyeOhEss said:
    ... Recording through a mixer, to tape, then pressing to vinyl, then transferring files to iPad? Vs just using some plugins that sound great in their own right and capture the same kind of feeling? I know which option i’d go for most days ;)

    it’s like saying why use a tape delay sim, and not a real tape delay?....or a vintage synth vst vs the real thing.....basically cost, convenience, flexibility etc...

    LoL - what kind if feeling ? The player just hears his guitar in the room ;)
    I never wrote about turning to hardware, just mentioned 'old mics' because they may provide something that's not covered well in most current (dynamic) mics, let alone the omni-present cheapo condensors.
    Recording isn't publishing. The sound captured here is what a listener would have experienced back then - fine, if you're after a flashback in time, which @JanKun was after.
    But it removes a significant part of the performance imho.

  • @Telefunky said:

    @EyeOhEss said:
    ... Recording through a mixer, to tape, then pressing to vinyl, then transferring files to iPad? Vs just using some plugins that sound great in their own right and capture the same kind of feeling? I know which option i’d go for most days ;)

    it’s like saying why use a tape delay sim, and not a real tape delay?....or a vintage synth vst vs the real thing.....basically cost, convenience, flexibility etc...

    LoL - what kind if feeling ? The player just hears his guitar in the room ;)
    I never wrote about turning to hardware, just mentioned 'old mics' because they may provide something that's not covered well in most current (dynamic) mics, let alone the omni-present cheapo condensors.
    Recording isn't publishing. The sound captured here is what a listener would have experienced back then - fine, if you're after a flashback in time, which @JanKun was after.
    But it removes a significant part of the performance imho.

    I have to agree with you! I wish I could hear the recordings those amazing musicians would have made with today's recording technology. I believe lots of details of their performance and emotions got lost because of the technological limitations of their time.

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