Do you think iDevices are better without peripherals?

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  • Doesn't everyone hate the dongles?

  • @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:
    Doesn't everyone hate the dongles?

    I'd prefer not to use them. :)

    Do you connect devices like MIDI keyboards, audio interfaces, control surfaces etc. to your iPad/iPhone or prefer to treat it as a self contained device?

  • I definitely prefer to treat it like a self-contained device. The whole appeal of using iOS devices to make music for me is the portability aspect, so the simpler I can keep it the better. Nothing wrong with breaking out the Qunexus or something with it once in awhile, but I definitely gravitate towards apps that really have well done GUIs with only the touchscreen in mind.

    If I'm going to need a different type of hands on control, say knobs or fader, or even real keys, it's always easier for me to just do that in the studio. So there's just not a need for me to add more to the iPad or iPhone than I need.

  • What @Tarekith said ! Same for me...

  • edited May 9

    Great! Thanks.

    I don't particularly have a preference but I do value the simplicity and portability of just the iPad or iPhone.

    I enjoy switching between apps in Audiobus with a controller but OTOH it can be more effective to work with less apps to begin with.

  • I like the pencil

  • edited May 9

    The most important thing is being untethered, so my golden rule is no cables
    (Except for headphones.. and when charging :p )

    This means the following are permitted:

    • Bluetooth midi (eg Korg microAir, Nanokey studio)
    • Apple pencil

    ...although most of the time I sling just the iPad in my bag and make music away from home (trains, cafés, lunch break etc..)

  • Definitely both!
    That's the advantage of it. If it was just a portable device without being able to connect midi controllers and audio interfaces it would lose much of its capability as a creative too.
    It's also why it's such a good studio tool, that you can combine with other tools. As the ipad gets more capable this should grow too. :)

    The great thing about is using it portably and then hooking it up to a studio to go a bit deeper afterwards.

  • If I couldn't attach my audio/midi interface and a bunch of controllers I wouldn't have bought my ipad in the first place.

  • @supadom said:
    If I couldn't attach my audio/midi interface and a bunch of controllers I wouldn't have bought my ipad in the first place.

    This.

  • Speaking as a peripheral myself... No.

  • @Carnbot said:
    Definitely both!
    That's the advantage of it. If it was just a portable device without being able to connect midi controllers and audio interfaces it would lose much of its capability as a creative too.
    It's also why it's such a good studio tool, that you can combine with other tools. As the ipad gets more capable this should grow too. :)

    The great thing about is using it portably and then hooking it up to a studio to go a bit deeper afterwards.

    Signed!

    For just fiddling around the iPad standalone is ok for me.
    For serious work I prefer to connect a nice controller. Keys, Pads, Knobs and Sliders gives me better haptics and better control over the whole thing. That’s why I love my Korg NanoKey Studio and other mobile devices as well.

    An Audio Interface is also very useful to bring a separate stereo signal into the iPad...

  • As an improviser I am used to having my piano skills at my command. I just made my first real serious non hardware track using the Noise MPE keyboard and SpaceCraft. The SpaceCraft part was easier because it did not utilize a keyboard. The MPE keyboard was more difficult because I kept wanting to use it like a hardware keyboard. Also the smaller size scale was discouraging. I imagine, with practice, I could improve. I see folks, like Doug in his soundtestroom videos, are quite adept,

  • @LinearLineman said:
    As an improviser I am used to having my piano skills at my command. I just made my first real serious non hardware track using the Noise MPE keyboard and SpaceCraft. The SpaceCraft part was easier because it did not utilize a keyboard. The MPE keyboard was more difficult because I kept wanting to use it like a hardware keyboard. Also the smaller size scale was discouraging. I imagine, with practice, I could improve. I see folks, like Doug in his soundtestroom videos, are quite adept,

    I'm trying to bring myself to do the same. I find it very hard to take myself seriously playing apps as I've spent my life writing music at the piano. Now I would like to try and do something exclusively with these devices that doesn't feel like I'm just toying around.

  • I prefer standalone but I actually like using hardware synths with my iPad. The workflow is faster even with having templates in Ableton. So for that you do need a dongle for the audio interface. But I like to use Bluetooth adapters for a bit more flexibility either for interfacing with synths or external controllers.

  • edited May 9

    @Carnbot said:
    Definitely both!
    That's the advantage of it. If it was just a portable device without being able to connect midi controllers and audio interfaces it would lose much of its capability as a creative too.
    It's also why it's such a good studio tool, that you can combine with other tools. As the ipad gets more capable this should grow too. :)

    The great thing about is using it portably and then hooking it up to a studio to go a bit deeper afterwards.

    In the both camp.

    But I started into iPad music completely in the peripherals camp. After a long time of guitar/bass/drums music, jumping into electronica with a clean slate, I looked around at audio or midi loopers that had song sequencing + live control and the available hardware units that met the minimum specs for what I was hunting, e.g. Elektron stuff, do less than the much cheaper iPad.

    I ultimately need very responsive velocity sensitive keys and pads and more synth power than an iPad has to do what I do..

    BUT...I've come to love how much I can do with the iPad alone. Building sounds for later use with all my peripherals. e.g. on the subway this morning, I was mixing mic noise in with some Synthscaper to make samples for Tardigrain. Strikes me that is another example too of how the iPad can do things that most hardware units would have trouble doing....the long evolving pad I get from making a longer glitchy pad plus found sound in Tardigrain.

  • Definitely prefer using hardware with my iPad and loving how we can map our midi controllers to our apps. I appreciate that I can create with my iPad alone when I’m on the go, but having pads and keyboards and a way to record guitars and vocals makes it a serious option when I don’t want to use my MacBook.

  • I too am in the self contained / portability camp. It still amazes me how much you can do all just within one portable screen! I still have my little home studio with desktop and hardware synths, but the iPad is almost like an escape from all that “work” 😉 It’s just so instant and immediate!

    (Exception carved out for occasional use of the Roli Seaboard...that’s something special right there 😎)

  • edited May 9

    I am mostly on the go / couch with no peripherals. I do love wiring up three iPads to desktop and hardware but alas those rested weekend windows are very very small and it is not easy to take the work in progress with me during the week. Maybe when NS2 audio tracks are a thing I will be more inclined to take the weekends fruits on the commute.

  • I spent a long time trying to use my iPad with things plugged into it to create the perfect environment for live performance looping / creation of audio and midi loops. I’ve come to realise that really I just need to use Ableton Live for this.

    So I’m mostly using my iPad standalone now. Either for fun jams or for knocking down ideas in Gadget which I can fire over to the mac to work on later.

  • edited May 9

    I prefer doing everything in the iPad. Being able to twist/push a knob/fader is better than using a touch screen, but looking at the synth I’m actually tweaking is better. Plus, with the exception of the Behringer X-touch and Kontakt Komplete keyboards, there still aren’t any MIDI controllers that show what each knob/fader is assigned to and that’s a major sticking point for me, hence the reason I always buy a MIDI keyboard and subsequently return it the following week ☹️

    That plus the portability is nice. Also, using Xequence with the Apple Pencil feels like I’m LITERALLY doing songwriting 😀

  • Everywhere but the studio and live performances, the iPad is standalone. In the studio, it's hooked up to a Zoom u22 so I can control hardware with iPad sequencers and vica versa. It also gives me audio directly into my patch bay and access to my MIDI keyboard.

  • @ricksteruk said:
    I spent a long time trying to use my iPad with things plugged into it to create the perfect environment for live performance looping / creation of audio and midi loops. I’ve come to realise that really I just need to use Ableton Live for this.

    So I’m mostly using my iPad standalone now. Either for fun jams or for knocking down ideas in Gadget which I can fire over to the mac to work on later.

    I can use Blocs for that but then I figured that iPhone is also a thing. When GTL come to iPhone... iPad will be superflous in my workflow.
    So it will be iPhone standalone, iPhone plus attachments and mac mini for home. Even Ableton is superflous for gigs in my workflow ATM... but I will need footpedal and midi din...

  • I just write with my iPad and apple headphones from start to finish. I use my PC for its own projects but everything in iOS is like @Tarekith said...all in the device.

    @LinearLineman you better keep at the Noise MPE keyboard. You are way to talented to not keep at it. Practice makes perfect and I’m sure it will all just click for you soon enough.

  • edited May 9

    @TheDubbyLabby said:

    @ricksteruk said:
    I spent a long time trying to use my iPad with things plugged into it to create the perfect environment for live performance looping / creation of audio and midi loops. I’ve come to realise that really I just need to use Ableton Live for this.

    So I’m mostly using my iPad standalone now. Either for fun jams or for knocking down ideas in Gadget which I can fire over to the mac to work on later.

    I can use Blocs for that but then I figured that iPhone is also a thing. When GTL come to iPhone... iPad will be superflous in my workflow.
    So it will be iPhone standalone, iPhone plus attachments and mac mini for home. Even Ableton is superflous for gigs in my workflow ATM... but I will need footpedal and midi din...

    Yes - actually I do sometimes plug devices into my iPad for GTL. I’m not at the stage to do performances with this technology yet - but the new project with my wife hopefully will have some gigs this year and might involve a bit of live scene triggering. Not sure if I should take Ableton out to gigs or just bounce down the scenes into audio and trigger them from Group The Loop on iPad or iPhone.

  • @ricksteruk said:

    @TheDubbyLabby said:

    @ricksteruk said:
    I spent a long time trying to use my iPad with things plugged into it to create the perfect environment for live performance looping / creation of audio and midi loops. I’ve come to realise that really I just need to use Ableton Live for this.

    So I’m mostly using my iPad standalone now. Either for fun jams or for knocking down ideas in Gadget which I can fire over to the mac to work on later.

    I can use Blocs for that but then I figured that iPhone is also a thing. When GTL come to iPhone... iPad will be superflous in my workflow.
    So it will be iPhone standalone, iPhone plus attachments and mac mini for home. Even Ableton is superflous for gigs in my workflow ATM... but I will need footpedal and midi din...

    Yes - actually I do sometimes plug devices into my iPad for GTL. I’m not at the stage to do performances with this technology yet - but the new project with my wife hopefully will have some gigs this year and might involve a bit of live scene triggering. Not sure if I should take Ableton out to gigs or just bounce down the scenes into audio and trigger them from Group The Loop on iPad or iPhone.

    For me that decision is clear... less risk go first. Just wait until GTL goes iPhone (if you can of course) and get ready all your songs for that meanwhile. If you need something else from Ableton...
    ... let's say slicing? Blocs/ReSlice on AB3/AUM session.
    ... let's say more loops from session view? Launchpad, BM3, Modstep... on AB3/AUM session.
    ... let's say... what?

    if you need ALL then go Ableton but if you can simplify your setup and music isn't worst from the crowd POV then my advice is go for it.

    If I can do backtracks and looping with a single iPhone 5s I'm not going to risk my late2012 for few options which usually nobody cares and these don't make me enjoy more neither.

    In fact I'm enjoying a lot Digitech trio+ and new TC Perform VK so I have similar setup for less than my iPad mini/iTrack dock cost... I'm keeping options but maybe someone is going to leave the space...

    Today I'm happy due I recovered my damaged NAS (with some exported Blocs projects) :smiley: and I need to think one more time what strategy pursuit but I feel too much tools for too less work and revenue.

  • Thanks for all the answers so far.

    I agree with the sentiment that it's probably better to use Ableton for live performance with loops & clips. It's a little too risky and clunky to try and achieve the same thing with iOS. However for improv I believe iOS offers something that Ableton cannot.

  • @Multicellular said:

    @Carnbot said:
    Definitely both!
    That's the advantage of it. If it was just a portable device without being able to connect midi controllers and audio interfaces it would lose much of its capability as a creative too.
    It's also why it's such a good studio tool, that you can combine with other tools. As the ipad gets more capable this should grow too. :)

    The great thing about is using it portably and then hooking it up to a studio to go a bit deeper afterwards.

    In the both camp.

    But I started into iPad music completely in the peripherals camp. After a long time of guitar/bass/drums music, jumping into electronica with a clean slate, I looked around at audio or midi loopers that had song sequencing + live control and the available hardware units that met the minimum specs for what I was hunting, e.g. Elektron stuff, do less than the much cheaper iPad.

    I ultimately need very responsive velocity sensitive keys and pads and more synth power than an iPad has to do what I do..

    BUT...I've come to love how much I can do with the iPad alone. Building sounds for later use with all my peripherals. e.g. on the subway this morning, I was mixing mic noise in with some Synthscaper to make samples for Tardigrain. Strikes me that is another example too of how the iPad can do things that most hardware units would have trouble doing....the long evolving pad I get from making a longer glitchy pad plus found sound in Tardigrain.

    I do the same thing. I was at first trying to make tracks on the go and getting a little peeved but then switching to making sounds, sequences & drum patterns for later use really made it a lot more enjoyable. The expectations are gone and it's just sweet exploration.

  • @BroCoast said:
    Thanks for all the answers so far.

    I agree with the sentiment that it's probably better to use Ableton for live performance with loops & clips. It's a little too risky and clunky to try and achieve the same thing with iOS. However for improv I believe iOS offers something that Ableton cannot.

    It depends on the kind of performance. For just launch some audio loops GTL (or loopyHD) could do the job even better than Ableton but if you need more than that then complexity builds up.

    For me risk is calculated taking revenue (money) divided by cost of gear involved, not result from performance side. I set a minimum performance level and make it a must not an option, like a constant in this hypothetic formula. That's why I simplify setups instead carry more powerful machines into gigs.

    The main rule is how good music became in the end? but that's my take due I came (and go) from repertory based gigs (from Hip Hop to covers for cruises and hotels) so the crowd satisfaction is top priority.

    I should draw this. Thanks @BroCoast for this healthy discussion <3

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