Audiobus: Use your music apps together.

What is Audiobus?Audiobus is an award-winning music app for iPhone and iPad which lets you use your other music apps together. Chain effects on your favourite synth, run the output of apps or Audio Units into an app like GarageBand or Loopy, or select a different audio interface output for each app. Route MIDI between apps — drive a synth from a MIDI sequencer, or add an arpeggiator to your MIDI keyboard — or sync with your external MIDI gear. And control your entire setup from a MIDI controller.

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Audiobus is the app that makes the rest of your setup better.

OCTACHRON MIDI Drum Sequencer AUv3 by Markus Teufel

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Comments

  • @reinerspass said:
    Hey everybody,

    Thanks for all your overwhelming positive comments, I'm really happy you guys enjoy the app! Also thanks a lot for your feedback regarding bugs and issues, super valuable! I'll address them ASAP, it's weekend soon, so finally some time to give Octachron some love!

    • Issues with some Hosts
      There are definitely some issues with some DAW, BM3 not working properly and issues in NanoStudio 2! I'm terribly sorry about that and will address this issues first!

    • Usability
      I see that some of you had issues finding how to set the parameter lock features, thanks a lot for your valuable input! Also, i'll try to come up with something like a manual or a nice in depth tutorial!

    • Missing Features
      Of course i'm going to improve on the app in the future, thanks for your inspiring feature requests! Again, super valuable for me! There is definitely stuff i'd like to have for my own as well :)

      • Randomiser
      • Midi control for pattern change and mute
      • quantisation
      • probability pattern change
      • universal app
    • Mapping Presets
      If you're missing mapping presets for your favourite drum machines, please let me know what you'd be interested in (@BiancaNeve, @Nicebutfun)!

    Cheers, and thanks again!

    Thanks for the update! Despite the issues, Octa is a really nice app and your efforts are very much appreciated.

    BTW: +1 for a randomiser (velocity and CC's if possible)

  • Hey @recccp, @ElectroHead, sorry for being late to this party. Of course Octachron is supposed to send CC values before the note on event, don't really get why anybody would like to have it the other way round? If that's in any case not happening please let me know, I've just tested it together with midi spy and it seemed fine for first step, last step and steps in between.

    Also thanks about the continuous income of feature requests:

    • Quantized, live note input
    • More ratcheting options (probability, ramping)

    are on the list! :)

    Cheers everybody!

  • @reinerspass said:
    Hey @recccp, @ElectroHead, sorry for being late to this party. Of course Octachron is supposed to send CC values before the note on event, don't really get why anybody would like to have it the other way round? If that's in any case not happening please let me know, I've just tested it together with midi spy and it seemed fine for first step, last step and steps in between.

    Also thanks about the continuous income of feature requests:

    • Quantized, live note input
    • More ratcheting options (probability, ramping)

    are on the list! :)

    Cheers everybody!

    Hey,
    Thanks for confirmation!
    Currently when switching from pattern that has various track lengths to a pattern that has same track length, the playback carries on "running free". Would you please consider an option to re-sync tracks on pattern change.
    Currently if a simple 16 steps pattern follows a polyrhythmic madness you have to stop/start the whole thing to bring it back together.

  • edited May 2019

    see below

  • @ElectroHead said:

    @recccp said:

    @reinerspass said:
    Hey @recccp, @ElectroHead, sorry for being late to this party. Of course Octachron is supposed to send CC values before the note on event, don't really get why anybody would like to have it the other way round?

    Hi @reinerspass, great you're responding to feedback. I haven't purchased, but pretty sure I will when I get time to have a proper go driving hardware. It's looking very promising.

    I'd like to know why Elektron implemented it the other way around!

    As for requests: Triggerless triggers would be sweet (ability to send ccs without triggering note on). Really useful for modulating longer hits.

    I have a couple of other ideas, but I'd be more than happy with that.

    Anybody tested with Octachron with HW drum modules yet?

  • Octachron has really opened up the Ruismakers for me. I used them very little as I don't get on with X0X style sequencing. But Octachron makes sequencing the Ruismakers really easy and I especially appreciate how all of the Ruismaker parameters are already mapped and ready for modulation inside of Octachron. Great stuff.

  • @gusgranite said:

    @Carnbot said:
    Yeah I like it, hope it gets a row randomiser, otherwise it's pretty well thought through :)

    +1

    And thank you for not making me be the first person who asks for randomization AGAIN! :smiley:

    intelligent randomizer that allows you to save what you like randomize what you want to randomize :)

  • @reinerspass said:
    Hey everybody,

    Thanks for all your overwhelming positive comments, I'm really happy you guys enjoy the app! Also thanks a lot for your feedback regarding bugs and issues, super valuable! I'll address them ASAP, it's weekend soon, so finally some time to give Octachron some love!

    • Issues with some Hosts
      There are definitely some issues with some DAW, BM3 not working properly and issues in NanoStudio 2! I'm terribly sorry about that and will address this issues first!

    • Usability
      I see that some of you had issues finding how to set the parameter lock features, thanks a lot for your valuable input! Also, i'll try to come up with something like a manual or a nice in depth tutorial!

    • Missing Features
      Of course i'm going to improve on the app in the future, thanks for your inspiring feature requests! Again, super valuable for me! There is definitely stuff i'd like to have for my own as well :)

      • Randomiser
      • Midi control for pattern change and mute
      • quantisation
      • probability pattern change
      • universal app
    • Mapping Presets
      If you're missing mapping presets for your favourite drum machines, please let me know what you'd be interested in (@BiancaNeve, @Nicebutfun)!

    Cheers, and thanks again!

    Excellent, thanks. I’m also experiencing issues in AUM. I built a full drum pattern and then added bass, etc. I was happy. I then opened AUM to continue the session and octachron is there still, but every note has disappeared. In addition, when I try to recall the pattern via a preset, octachron crashes completely. Good luck with the fixes - it’s a wonderful app, so I’m happy to wait on you getting the little bugs Squashed.

  • @ecamburn said:
    Octachron has really opened up the Ruismakers for me. I used them very little as I don't get on with X0X style sequencing. But Octachron makes sequencing the Ruismakers really easy and I especially appreciate how all of the Ruismaker parameters are already mapped and ready for modulation inside of Octachron. Great stuff.

    Yes, it made Ruismaker really shine..
    great app..

  • @audio_DT said:

    @reinerspass said:
    Hey everybody,

    Thanks for all your overwhelming positive comments, I'm really happy you guys enjoy the app! Also thanks a lot for your feedback regarding bugs and issues, super valuable! I'll address them ASAP, it's weekend soon, so finally some time to give Octachron some love!

    • Issues with some Hosts
      There are definitely some issues with some DAW, BM3 not working properly and issues in NanoStudio 2! I'm terribly sorry about that and will address this issues first!

    • Usability
      I see that some of you had issues finding how to set the parameter lock features, thanks a lot for your valuable input! Also, i'll try to come up with something like a manual or a nice in depth tutorial!

    • Missing Features
      Of course i'm going to improve on the app in the future, thanks for your inspiring feature requests! Again, super valuable for me! There is definitely stuff i'd like to have for my own as well :)

      • Randomiser
      • Midi control for pattern change and mute
      • quantisation
      • probability pattern change
      • universal app
    • Mapping Presets
      If you're missing mapping presets for your favourite drum machines, please let me know what you'd be interested in (@BiancaNeve, @Nicebutfun)!

    Cheers, and thanks again!

    Excellent, thanks. I’m also experiencing issues in AUM. I built a full drum pattern and then added bass, etc. I was happy. I then opened AUM to continue the session and octachron is there still, but every note has disappeared. In addition, when I try to recall the pattern via a preset, octachron crashes completely. Good luck with the fixes - it’s a wonderful app, so I’m happy to wait on you getting the little bugs Squashed.

    Are you opening it as standalone first? Then opening it as in AUM and trying to continue the session? And if so, are you opening it as AU or IAA in AUM?

  • Congrats on a great release @reinerspass!

    @recccp said:
    Great seq, thanks very much!
    Some feature requests for your consideration :)
    -re-sync tracks option, or auto-sync on pattern change
    -shift + bottom line (vel, cc, etc) to adjust values for all steps together

    Thanks again!

    Would like to see these too! Good time as-is though.

  • Since you’re taking requests for mappings would love a preset for Vatanator.

    This thing is awesome.

  • @ElectroHead said:

    As for requests: Triggerless triggers would be sweet (ability to send ccs without triggering note on). Really useful for modulating longer hits.

    Please!!!

  • edited May 2019

    @audio_DT

    Excellent, thanks. I’m also experiencing issues in AUM. I built a full drum pattern and then added bass, etc. I was happy. I then opened AUM to continue the session and octachron is there still, but every note has disappeared. In addition, when I try to recall the pattern via a preset, octachron crashes completely. Good luck with the fixes - it’s a wonderful app, so I’m happy to wait on you getting the little bugs Squashed.

    Sorry for that, hope to fix these preset problems really soon!

    @ElectroHead

    As for requests: Triggerless triggers would be sweet (ability to send ccs without triggering note on). Really useful for modulating longer hits.

    Its on my list! :)

    Anybody tested with Octachron with HW drum modules yet?

    Ive used Octachron in AUM to trigger my MFB Tanzmaus and works like a charm :) Also did change its various parameters via CC was really a lot of fun, Ive started making a little jam video, I might upload that soon if youre interested :)

    Cheers, Markus

  • @gusgranite said:

    @audio_DT said:

    @reinerspass said:
    Hey everybody,

    Thanks for all your overwhelming positive comments, I'm really happy you guys enjoy the app! Also thanks a lot for your feedback regarding bugs and issues, super valuable! I'll address them ASAP, it's weekend soon, so finally some time to give Octachron some love!

    • Issues with some Hosts
      There are definitely some issues with some DAW, BM3 not working properly and issues in NanoStudio 2! I'm terribly sorry about that and will address this issues first!

    • Usability
      I see that some of you had issues finding how to set the parameter lock features, thanks a lot for your valuable input! Also, i'll try to come up with something like a manual or a nice in depth tutorial!

    • Missing Features
      Of course i'm going to improve on the app in the future, thanks for your inspiring feature requests! Again, super valuable for me! There is definitely stuff i'd like to have for my own as well :)

      • Randomiser
      • Midi control for pattern change and mute
      • quantisation
      • probability pattern change
      • universal app
    • Mapping Presets
      If you're missing mapping presets for your favourite drum machines, please let me know what you'd be interested in (@BiancaNeve, @Nicebutfun)!

    Cheers, and thanks again!

    Excellent, thanks. I’m also experiencing issues in AUM. I built a full drum pattern and then added bass, etc. I was happy. I then opened AUM to continue the session and octachron is there still, but every note has disappeared. In addition, when I try to recall the pattern via a preset, octachron crashes completely. Good luck with the fixes - it’s a wonderful app, so I’m happy to wait on you getting the little bugs Squashed.

    Are you opening it as standalone first? Then opening it as in AUM and trying to continue the session? And if so, are you opening it as AU or IAA in AUM?

    Hi. Not sure what you mean - do I have to open it in standalone first, every time I use it? I've never known an AUV3 that requires that. I'm just using it as AUV3 in AUM, and for some reason it is, at present, unreliable. I think it's a brilliant app, though, and this stuff will be sorted eventually.

  • @reinerspass said:
    @audio_DT

    Excellent, thanks. I’m also experiencing issues in AUM. I built a full drum pattern and then added bass, etc. I was happy. I then opened AUM to continue the session and octachron is there still, but every note has disappeared. In addition, when I try to recall the pattern via a preset, octachron crashes completely. Good luck with the fixes - it’s a wonderful app, so I’m happy to wait on you getting the little bugs Squashed.

    Sorry for that, hope to fix these preset problems really soon!

    @ElectroHead

    As for requests: Triggerless triggers would be sweet (ability to send ccs without triggering note on). Really useful for modulating longer hits.

    Its on my list! :)

    Anybody tested with Octachron with HW drum modules yet?

    Ive used Octachron in AUM to trigger my MFB Tanzmaus and works like a charm :) Also did change its various parameters via CC was really a lot of fun, Ive started making a little jam video, I might upload that soon if youre interested :)

    Cheers, Markus

    Markus, you're the man! I have a Tanzmaus and think it sounds excellent for it's price. There were many complaints about its sequencer, but what with P locks, including sample swapping, and length per track, there's a lot of power in a small package. I actually enjoy programming it standalone in bed or on the sofa. The TM sequencer also slaves tightly. OTOH, the swing settings are limited, and velocity is limited to four levels on its seq (if I remember right). With the TM in midi module mode and sequencing it from the OT, ccs after note on was not optimal. Also, cramming 8 drum parts into 3 or 4 midi tracks is a pain to navigate, and using all 8 midi tracks on the OT = nothing left for other gear.

    I've also got back into building drum modules in my Nord G2 engine (I think it excels at all sorts of percussion), but G2's sequencers don't slave brilliantly to external clock and loose sync totally on program change. They're very versatile, but quite a bit of work and tweaking is required (for me at least) - patching midi delay modules for offset per track, fine tuning their times etc. And then I have the engine so no visual feedback once unplugged from the editor.

    I've also hung on to a Korg Er 1 which has fixed pattern length of 12 or 16 steps.

    For me Patterning has proved really useful for me thanks to midi export. The pattern rotation is really innovative. But no cc sequencing (dunno about 2?), and overview of all patterns running.

    In short Octachron is potentially a super remedy for all the above! I will purchase, but have a project to finish before delving in. If it slaves well to midi clock from Octatrack (via iConnectivity), this could open many possibilities for live rig.

    Great you plan trigerless trigs!

    Midi export of patterns like with Patterning would be super useful for me, but the main thing is for it to slave tight to midi clock - recording midi into my offline Linkless DAW from Ochron slaved would be straight forward.

    I'd really like to see/hear you driving the TM with the Ochron. I'm sure many MFB drum machine owners would be very interested in this app. And they've just announced a small module (not eurorack) which NEEDS a sequencer. So my guess is there's a big market for the Ochron with many HW drum machine owners. A couple of well put together videos posted large and wide should get a lot of sales I reckon. All the best

  • @audio_DT said:

    @gusgranite said:

    @audio_DT said:

    @reinerspass said:
    Hey everybody,

    Thanks for all your overwhelming positive comments, I'm really happy you guys enjoy the app! Also thanks a lot for your feedback regarding bugs and issues, super valuable! I'll address them ASAP, it's weekend soon, so finally some time to give Octachron some love!

    • Issues with some Hosts
      There are definitely some issues with some DAW, BM3 not working properly and issues in NanoStudio 2! I'm terribly sorry about that and will address this issues first!

    • Usability
      I see that some of you had issues finding how to set the parameter lock features, thanks a lot for your valuable input! Also, i'll try to come up with something like a manual or a nice in depth tutorial!

    • Missing Features
      Of course i'm going to improve on the app in the future, thanks for your inspiring feature requests! Again, super valuable for me! There is definitely stuff i'd like to have for my own as well :)

      • Randomiser
      • Midi control for pattern change and mute
      • quantisation
      • probability pattern change
      • universal app
    • Mapping Presets
      If you're missing mapping presets for your favourite drum machines, please let me know what you'd be interested in (@BiancaNeve, @Nicebutfun)!

    Cheers, and thanks again!

    Excellent, thanks. I’m also experiencing issues in AUM. I built a full drum pattern and then added bass, etc. I was happy. I then opened AUM to continue the session and octachron is there still, but every note has disappeared. In addition, when I try to recall the pattern via a preset, octachron crashes completely. Good luck with the fixes - it’s a wonderful app, so I’m happy to wait on you getting the little bugs Squashed.

    Are you opening it as standalone first? Then opening it as in AUM and trying to continue the session? And if so, are you opening it as AU or IAA in AUM?

    Hi. Not sure what you mean - do I have to open it in standalone first, every time I use it? I've never known an AUV3 that requires that. I'm just using it as AUV3 in AUM, and for some reason it is, at present, unreliable. I think it's a brilliant app, though, and this stuff will be sorted eventually.

    Hi @audio_DT - no, you’re doing it right 😉
    It was because you said that you create the drum patterns in Ochtochron ‘and then opened AUM to continue the session’
    I misunderstood and was going to recommend that you keep Ochtachron as an AU inside AUM instead 🙂

    To report a crash to Kymatika in AUM you can hit the menu, About, then Contact (the mail envelope) and that will log a support email to the developer @j_liljedahl

    Good luck!

  • @gusgranite said:

    @audio_DT said:

    @gusgranite said:

    @audio_DT said:

    @reinerspass said:
    Hey everybody,

    Thanks for all your overwhelming positive comments, I'm really happy you guys enjoy the app! Also thanks a lot for your feedback regarding bugs and issues, super valuable! I'll address them ASAP, it's weekend soon, so finally some time to give Octachron some love!

    • Issues with some Hosts
      There are definitely some issues with some DAW, BM3 not working properly and issues in NanoStudio 2! I'm terribly sorry about that and will address this issues first!

    • Usability
      I see that some of you had issues finding how to set the parameter lock features, thanks a lot for your valuable input! Also, i'll try to come up with something like a manual or a nice in depth tutorial!

    • Missing Features
      Of course i'm going to improve on the app in the future, thanks for your inspiring feature requests! Again, super valuable for me! There is definitely stuff i'd like to have for my own as well :)

      • Randomiser
      • Midi control for pattern change and mute
      • quantisation
      • probability pattern change
      • universal app
    • Mapping Presets
      If you're missing mapping presets for your favourite drum machines, please let me know what you'd be interested in (@BiancaNeve, @Nicebutfun)!

    Cheers, and thanks again!

    Excellent, thanks. I’m also experiencing issues in AUM. I built a full drum pattern and then added bass, etc. I was happy. I then opened AUM to continue the session and octachron is there still, but every note has disappeared. In addition, when I try to recall the pattern via a preset, octachron crashes completely. Good luck with the fixes - it’s a wonderful app, so I’m happy to wait on you getting the little bugs Squashed.

    Are you opening it as standalone first? Then opening it as in AUM and trying to continue the session? And if so, are you opening it as AU or IAA in AUM?

    Hi. Not sure what you mean - do I have to open it in standalone first, every time I use it? I've never known an AUV3 that requires that. I'm just using it as AUV3 in AUM, and for some reason it is, at present, unreliable. I think it's a brilliant app, though, and this stuff will be sorted eventually.

    Hi @audio_DT - no, you’re doing it right 😉
    It was because you said that you create the drum patterns in Ochtochron ‘and then opened AUM to continue the session’
    I misunderstood and was going to recommend that you keep Ochtachron as an AU inside AUM instead 🙂

    To report a crash to Kymatika in AUM you can hit the menu, About, then Contact (the mail envelope) and that will log a support email to the developer @j_liljedahl

    Good luck!

    Thanks. I’ll just wait - I’m sure it’ll get sorted, and I have other stuff I can do to keep me occupied for the moment - like trying to work out how to use my phone as a Bluetooth controller for synths in AUM. I heard it was possible, but no joy just yet.

  • edited May 2019

    Is there any more videos out there?
    I’d be interested to see some examples of things like basic note entry (can you swipe? :* ) and how the interface/playheads works with polyrhythmic patterns.
    (It looks great though from the feature list and what I can see so far <3 )

  • edited May 2019

    @iamspoon
    Doug (thesoundtestroom) just finished a great livestream about Octachron...

  • @audio_DT

    To use another device with AUM, you just need to open AUM on both of them, then go to settings and scroll down to where it has options for Bluetooth: Central and Peripheral. Then you choose to advertise on your iPhone and receive on your iPad.

    Once the connection is made you just use the midi router to make the iPhone send to the device you wish to control. If you want to control more than one, you csn send to Midi Control and that routes it into AUM, so you would just select AUM as the source for each synth etc.

    It works fine using the built in keyboard, but i recommend trying something like KB-1, Xequence Keys AU, or Sound Prizm, really anythimg that sends midi will work. Hopefully this helps, I can post pics later if it’s too confusing.

  • @reinerspass said:
    @audio_DT

    Excellent, thanks. I’m also experiencing issues in AUM. I built a full drum pattern and then added bass, etc. I was happy. I then opened AUM to continue the session and octachron is there still, but every note has disappeared. In addition, when I try to recall the pattern via a preset, octachron crashes completely. Good luck with the fixes - it’s a wonderful app, so I’m happy to wait on you getting the little bugs Squashed.

    Sorry for that, hope to fix these preset problems really soon!

    @ElectroHead

    As for requests: Triggerless triggers would be sweet (ability to send ccs without triggering note on). Really useful for modulating longer hits.

    Its on my list! :)

    Anybody tested with Octachron with HW drum modules yet?

    Ive used Octachron in AUM to trigger my MFB Tanzmaus and works like a charm :) Also did change its various parameters via CC was really a lot of fun, Ive started making a little jam video, I might upload that soon if youre interested :)

    Cheers, Markus

    This app is really nice... Has huge potential considering how good it is at launch. Been sequencing my Nord drum 2. Really cool to be able to sequence cc’s.

    Idea for you... for each track’s mod sequences, please have the ability to set each mod track to different length separate from main track length.

    So a hihat note track could be 14 steps, velocity could be 10, and a cc track could be 7. That would really allow basic patterns to never get boring sounding.

    Make sense?

  • edited May 2019

    @reinerspass Apoligies if this has already been mentioned but running 2 instances of Octachron in AUM.

    I’m having trouble getting the second instance to run in song mode.

    I made sure each pattern has a least 1 repetition as am aware if you have a zero pattern repetition it stops the song mode.

    I’m triggering BS-16 in one using the GM mapping and EG909 in the other using the EG909 built in mapping.

    I’m also using blank patterns to chop between both instrument sounds but cannot get the EG909 to run in song mode.

    What am I doing wrong?

  • @Carnbot said:
    Swing is there but is it working?
    Didn't hear a difference but only had chance for a quick look.

    Regarding swing, what do the options: 50 - 100% mean? What if I want no swing?
    And what’s swing grid?
    Thanks in advance

  • @tiantong said:

    @Carnbot said:
    Swing is there but is it working?
    Didn't hear a difference but only had chance for a quick look.

    Regarding swing, what do the options: 50 - 100% mean? What if I want no swing?
    And what’s swing grid?
    Thanks in advance

    I’m not sure tbh, I haven’t got this part working yet, and when I tried just now it broke song mode.
    I guess the swing grid makes sense as the time divisions. But currently nothing changes for me.

  • @Thardus said:
    @audio_DT

    To use another device with AUM, you just need to open AUM on both of them, then go to settings and scroll down to where it has options for Bluetooth: Central and Peripheral. Then you choose to advertise on your iPhone and receive on your iPad.

    Once the connection is made you just use the midi router to make the iPhone send to the device you wish to control. If you want to control more than one, you csn send to Midi Control and that routes it into AUM, so you would just select AUM as the source for each synth etc.

    It works fine using the built in keyboard, but i recommend trying something like KB-1, Xequence Keys AU, or Sound Prizm, really anythimg that sends midi will work. Hopefully this helps, I can post pics later if it’s too confusing.

    Thanks. I did get it working in the end, and tried it with KB-1, which worked amazingly well. I did it on my iPhone but I’ve got a 2012/13 iPad (the very first retina one) that I haven’t even charged up in donkeys years, and I really fancy using that, if possible. I just have to find the charger first...

  • edited May 2019

    So a hihat note track could be 14 steps, velocity could be 10, and a cc track could be 7. That would really allow basic patterns to never get boring sounding.

    Make sense?

    It already does this, no? I’m pretty sure I’ve done that - nice for generating polyrhythms, etc. I agree that it’s a great app, and just the thing I’ve been looking for for drums. Once the little bugs are squashed, this thing will rule the iOS midi drum units - alongside Rosetta. C0me to think of it, I’ve not tried using Rosetta rhythm and piping the midi notes into octachron. Don’t even know if this is possible, but am off to try it...

    Edit: to change row length, just long press the bottom left square bit and select ‘row length’

  • @audio_DT said:

    So a hihat note track could be 14 steps, velocity could be 10, and a cc track could be 7. That would really allow basic patterns to never get boring sounding.

    Make sense?

    It already does this, no? I’m pretty sure I’ve done that - nice for generating polyrhythms, etc. I agree that it’s a great app, and just the thing I’ve been looking for for drums. Once the little bugs are squashed, this thing will rule the iOS midi drum units - alongside Rosetta. C0me to think of it, I’ve not tried using Rosetta rhythm and piping the midi notes into octachron. Don’t even know if this is possible, but am off to try it...

  • @Carnbot said:

    @tiantong said:

    @Carnbot said:
    Swing is there but is it working?
    Didn't hear a difference but only had chance for a quick look.

    Regarding swing, what do the options: 50 - 100% mean? What if I want no swing?
    And what’s swing grid?
    Thanks in advance

    I’m not sure tbh, I haven’t got this part working yet, and when I tried just now it broke song mode.
    I guess the swing grid makes sense as the time divisions. But currently nothing changes for me.

    Looking forward to hearing more about this

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