PSA: Don't update to iOS 12.4 if you use apps in AB output slot or IAA apps that use the mic.
https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/34030/urgent-psa-hold-off-updating-to-ios-12-4-if-you-use-apps-in-output-slot-in-audiobus

Loopy (HD) / AUM Best Practices?

I recently realized that Loopy (HD) together with AUM is the right approach for an agile jamming/song sketching setup for me. It lets me work up some bits and record precisely-timed loops that I can drop into BeatHawk or the like and also record non-looped bits. I find it more convenient than working in a DAW.

Oftentimes, I am using Bias AMP or ToneStack as an input to bring in my guitar.

Here is my question. What is the best way to set up AUM and Loopy so that I can send from an AUM bus to Loopy to use as an input.

I have something that works, but I have a feeling that there is a more elegant way to do it. I am using AB3, but I have seen a couple of people mention that you don't need AB3 -- that AUM can send to Loopy. But I haven't figured out how to make it work without using AB3. I have seen a reference somewhere to being able to choose AUM as the audio input source in Loopy (I have tried non-HD and HD) but have not been able to figure out how to do that.

Any help?

What I currently am doing is:

IN AB3:

  • Add AUM as an audio source with Loopy HD connected as the destination
  • Add Loopy HD as an audio source with AUM as the destination

IN AUM

  • I set up Mix Bus A with the destination "1: Loopy HD" from the IAA/AudioBus Output destination popup
  • I create sends to Mix Bus A for any channels that I want to record in Loopy.

That works, but it is a lot more involved than what I have a few people mention. (It also gives me pause that I have an AUM to Loopy lane in AB3 and a Loopy to AUM lane. While I haven't experienced feedback, it seems like a possibility)

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Comments

  • edited November 2018

    Your setup is correct. You need AB to record something else than mic in Loopy. AUM is not absolutely needed, you can do your routing in AB, but if you want flexible busses you will need it, waiting for AB to have that planned feature. Also, AUM is needed if you want to record your whole live session with better audio quality than Loopy AAC session recording. As you have two lanes in AB, you need (if not added automatically) to also set AB/Loopy as as input in AUM, and you will be able to record it at higher quality format in AUM. If you don’t record in AUM, and only export loops from Loopy, you don’t need second lane. AB/AUM/Loopy is a great trio, use it all the time, this is pure iOS modular music stuff.

  • @Janosax : thanks. I am scratching my head about a tip someone gave elsewhere about sending from AUM to Loopy without using AB3.

    I was also wondering if I had overlooked some option to record audio in a non-compressed format in Loopy.

    Related question: is there a way to record audio into an AU instance of Beathawk in AUM?

  • As I always was wondering for what Loopy could be used, I tried to rebuild this setup.

    But I am still confused.

    Loopy can be added as "combined" or as a single track when adding as audio source.
    I understand the single track version, and assume that you can just choose the track within Loopy, when using "combined".

    But you would normally add some sequencer like Xequence as MIDI source in AB, point it to a Synths, which is then both MIDI target and Audio source.

    But then, how to continue?

    Could you possibly post your complete AudioBus preset?

  • @tja

    Here is what things look like in AB3 in a quick and dirty session that I whipped up

    Here are the first few channels in AUM. To send a channel to Loopy for recording, add a send to Mix Bus A from the instrument as I have done. If you plan and switching between instruments, you can set them all up to send to mix bus A and simply flick to the left on any node that you don’t want to send.

    Here are the rest of the channels. The Loopy inputs in this set are from Loop 1and then Loop 2. This lets me control the volume independently.

    I hope that made sense.

    Also, I have Loopy set to IAA sync rather than Ableton and I start playback by clicking on the AB3 play button in the palette. Loopy/AUM and SoftDrummer are using Ableton Link..but as I think about it maybe they should use IAA, too.

    If someone spots a better way to do this, please let me know.

  • I feel like apr matrix should let you record directly to loopy but I haven't tried it, as you can record perfectly timed loops within AUM

  • What method do you use to record perfectly time loops within AUM? I know how to do it by trimming after recording in AudioShare. Is there another method?

    @reasOne said:
    I feel like apr matrix should let you record directly to loopy but I haven't tried it, as you can record perfectly timed loops within AUM

  • Many thanks, @espiegel123

    Sadly, I still don't get it.

    The two Loopy instances on the last image, how did you add them?
    They are not from AudioBus, did you just add them as IAA Apps?
    The tracks are not numbered, also not in Loopy.

    I tried to build this myself, but your preset would have been better, of course:

    Audiobus preset 'AUM_Loopy':
    http://preset.audiob.us/UZcZAczXEPoyeQy

    Here, I added 2 Loopy instances manually using track 1 and 2 and named the AUM channels accordingly.
    But still, I got an incoming Loopy from AudioBus as my first channel, which you do not seem to have.

    And you record in Loopy, not AUM, which according to @Janosax will be AAC, not WAV (right?)

    I still don't get, which role Loopy plays in this.
    You wrote, that you want to record Loops and then use them in BeatHawk.
    Would it not be more easy to drop Loopy altogether and just record the perfect Loops in AUM? This would also be of better quality, if I correctly understood.

    Forgive my dumbness

  • @espiegel123 said:
    What method do you use to record perfectly time loops within AUM? I know how to do it by trimming after recording in AudioShare. Is there another method?

    @reasOne said:
    I feel like apr matrix should let you record directly to loopy but I haven't tried it, as you can record perfectly timed loops within AUM

    Did not read this before I wrote.

    You can just record in AUM, which saves into AudioShare and the options for the recording can be reach on the upper left and then a menu:

  • I had posted similar question in AUM forum also but looks like there is no native AUM Looper app yet .
    I also ended up in a simple consulated wiring with Audiobus as the pipe from aum to loopy and back...
    Wonder when we get a simple Loop player as a target for aum

  • edited November 2018

    I use Audiobus with loopy hd. And here’s my short tutorial video which explains how to do it.

  • @tja: yes you can record in AUM and easily access your recordings and add them as file players. I do that quite often, but that is different from the use-case, I am talking about.

    When set up as I have described, you can have a nice looping session, recording perfectly timed loops on the fly that playback as soon as they finish.

    @tja said:

    @espiegel123 said:
    What method do you use to record perfectly time loops within AUM? I know how to do it by trimming after recording in AudioShare. Is there another method?

    @reasOne said:
    I feel like apr matrix should let you record directly to loopy but I haven't tried it, as you can record perfectly timed loops within AUM

    Did not read this before I wrote.

    You can just record in AUM, which saves into AudioShare and the options for the recording can be reach on the upper left and then a menu:

  • @espiegel123 I understand and would like to try this myself.

    Any chance to get your AudioBus preset?
    Pleaseee

  • edited November 2018

    @tja

    Loopy session recording uses AAC format, but loop recording uses 44.1 kHz 16 bits. So AUM is better mostly for Loopy session/live gigging audio recording. This is the main purpose of Loopy if you want to use it for production: making some loops/music material in realtime. It will let you make multiple loops playing at the same time like if it was a mini DAW. AUM allows for recording loops, but you need to load each time each loop in a file player node to listen to your whole production. And Loopy allows for easiest recording process via touchscreen, or you can even uses a pedalboard/midi controller for advanced triggering via midi learn. Only thing missing is multi loop export, as you have to export each 44.1/16 loop individually. And 12 loops is not a lot for a full song. So it’s more a live tool than a production tool, but it all depends on your needs. Blocswave is also ideal for that purpose with more slots and multi export, but it’s less reliable than before since iOS 12 and no midi control.

    Edit: Here is an AB preset. I use AB beta and AUM beta, so perhaps this will not open correctly, let me know. With this preset, you need to keep Loopy monitoring settings off, and Ruismaker Noir in AUM can be replaced by anything else.

    Audiobus preset 'Loopy AUM': http://preset.audiob.us/pU3nTRig1LXFsnz

  • @tja said:
    @espiegel123 I understand and would like to try this myself.

    Any chance to get your AudioBus preset?
    Pleaseee

    @tja ; if you still need the AB3 preset , let me know and I will post it when I have my iPad available again which will be later today. In answer to your questions. In AUM, when you choose Loopy as a source, you can choose any of Loopy's dials (tracks) as a source or Loopy's stereo output. For a bus, you can choose Loopy as s destination if you have AUM connected to Loopy in AB3.

    @Janosax : those are good points. In my case I am using this set-up for quick-and-dirty demo stage workouts. So a few loops suffice for me. Most of what I am working up will get recorded. Though it is such a friendly flow, some of these loops may end up being used. I am sometimes recording the Loopy send bus so that I have a non-aac version of the audio should I want it.

  • @espiegel123 said:

    @tja said:
    @espiegel123 I understand and would like to try this myself.

    Any chance to get your AudioBus preset?
    Pleaseee

    @tja ; if you still need the AB3 preset , let me know and I will post it when I have my iPad available again which will be later today. In answer to your questions. In AUM, when you choose Loopy as a source, you can choose any of Loopy's dials (tracks) as a source or Loopy's stereo output. For a bus, you can choose Loopy as s destination if you have AUM connected to Loopy in AB3.

    @Janosax : those are good points. In my case I am using this set-up for quick-and-dirty demo stage workouts. So a few loops suffice for me. Most of what I am working up will get recorded. Though it is such a friendly flow, some of these loops may end up being used. I am sometimes recording the Loopy send bus so that I have a non-aac version of the audio should I want it.

    Loopy rocks. I will ask @Michael for multi loop export.

  • It would be a dream to have loopy as an
    aum output (stright, clean and simple)

  • @breilly said:
    It would be a dream to have loopy as an
    aum output (stright, clean and simple)

    Using the setup shown above, Loopy is an AUM output if used with AB3.

  • I find GTL more suitable for this purpose (from song composition loop based tool to routing into it as looper) but not multiple dedicated outputs, etc but @jmarshallgtl is aware and even considering do it AUv3.

    Input channel has AUv3/IAA/Audiobus support.

    Maybe worth a look...

  • @espiegel123 said:

    @breilly said:
    It would be a dream to have loopy as an
    aum output (stright, clean and simple)

    Using the setup shown above, Loopy is an AUM output if used with AB3.

    Oh thx but Im speaking of using it without ab3.
    I don’t enjoy all the extra routing involved using aum AND ab3; awaiting an easier way.

  • It just seems like Loopy and AB were meant for each other. <3

  • edited November 2018

    @TheDubbyLabby said:
    I find GTL more suitable for this purpose (from song composition loop based tool to routing into it as looper) but not multiple dedicated outputs, etc but @jmarshallgtl is aware and even considering do it AUv3.

    Input channel has AUv3/IAA/Audiobus support.

    Maybe worth a look...

    This is where Loopy and Audiobus integration comes in. I don’t believe we’ll ever see Loopy exposing its inputs to AUM’s output nodes. What @Janosax has suggested in terms of monitoring does away with cumulative latency of running audio via AUM as well as Audiobus. I’m super fussy about latency and this totally works for me. With state saving they are a pretty good combo actually and reasonably stable.

  • I barely use AB/IAA and few AUv3 but for me the perfect solution will be AUv3 GTL looper as I suggested at GTL forum... meanwhile I will go the monolithic route with just LoopyHD and external mixer with external hardware.

    To do it inside the iPad ATM the AUM/AB3 approach is the only way we have... maybe @Michael could put some light almost in the ideas he’s considering for Loopy MasterPiece or maybe @j_liljedahl is considering add some kind of loop recorder as insert...

  • edited November 2018

    maybe @Michael could put some light almost in the ideas he’s considering for Loopy MasterPiece or maybe @j_liljedahl is considering add some kind of loop recorder as insert...

    ...or maybe @Michael should focus on Audiobus masterpiece instead and think of even further Loopy integration where Loopy is basically baked into Audiobus. This way Loopy Pro (masterpiece) ideas are more likely to come true instead of something that might have been the Holy Grail but is in real terms very far away.

  • @supadom said:
    maybe @Michael could put some light almost in the ideas he’s considering for Loopy MasterPiece or maybe @j_liljedahl is considering add some kind of loop recorder as insert...

    ...or maybe @Michael should focus on Audiobus masterpiece instead and think of even further Loopy integration where Loopy is basically baked into Audiobus. This way Loopy Pro (masterpiece) ideas are more likely to come true instead of something that might have been the Holy Grail but is in real terms very far away.

    Puts on Angela Lansbury face, gets popcorn etc.

  • What might not be obvious about how cool the AB3/AUM/Loopy combo is, is that from the AB3 palette, you can change the number of measures of the next loop to record AND it automatically advances Loopy to the next slot when you record.

    I'll post some more screenshots for those that aren't sure what I am talking about when I post the AB3 doc.

    To be honest, now that I have figured this all out, I don't lust after a looper inside of AUM. Loopy is so solid, and I only need to use up one channel in AUM for up to 12 loops except for those cases where I really want a separate mixer channel for each loop.

  • edited November 2018

    @supadom said:

    @TheDubbyLabby said:
    I find GTL more suitable for this purpose (from song composition loop based tool to routing into it as looper) but not multiple dedicated outputs, etc but @jmarshallgtl is aware and even considering do it AUv3.

    Input channel has AUv3/IAA/Audiobus support.

    Maybe worth a look...

    This is where Loopy and Audiobus integration comes in. I don’t believe we’ll ever see Loopy exposing its inputs to AUM’s output nodes. What @Janosax has suggested in terms of monitoring does away with cumulative latency of running audio via AUM as well as Audiobus. I’m super fussy about latency and this totally works for me. With state saving they are a pretty good combo actually and reasonably stable.

    That also allows to have different sources in AUM and quickly switch between them or make sub mixes, set what is recorded in Loopy... super flexible. It’s also possible to send individual Loopy outputs to AUM for live control with midi knobs/faders app/hardware controller. But you’re right, monitoring lowest latency is even more important and that setup allow for that.

    BTW, a cool thing iPhone allows for that iPad don’t :p is ability to run both Loopy HD and Loopy for a total of 24 loops and extra main outputs mixing (especially stereo wideness with nice AUM effect node). You can use Loopy HD for instrumental loops triggering and Loopy for live recordings with individual loops predefined pan settings for example. Super powerful live looping and premixing capabilities!!

  • @TheDubbyLabby said:
    I barely use AB/IAA and few AUv3 but for me the perfect solution will be AUv3 GTL looper as I suggested at GTL forum... meanwhile I will go the monolithic route with just LoopyHD and external mixer with external hardware.

    To do it inside the iPad ATM the AUM/AB3 approach is the only way we have... maybe @Michael could put some light almost in the ideas he’s considering for Loopy MasterPiece or maybe @j_liljedahl is considering add some kind of loop recorder as insert...

    +1 would luv to hear about this myself

  • @Janosax said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @tja said:
    @espiegel123 I understand and would like to try this myself.

    Any chance to get your AudioBus preset?
    Pleaseee

    @tja ; if you still need the AB3 preset , let me know and I will post it when I have my iPad available again which will be later today. In answer to your questions. In AUM, when you choose Loopy as a source, you can choose any of Loopy's dials (tracks) as a source or Loopy's stereo output. For a bus, you can choose Loopy as s destination if you have AUM connected to Loopy in AB3.

    @Janosax : those are good points. In my case I am using this set-up for quick-and-dirty demo stage workouts. So a few loops suffice for me. Most of what I am working up will get recorded. Though it is such a friendly flow, some of these loops may end up being used. I am sometimes recording the Loopy send bus so that I have a non-aac version of the audio should I want it.

    Loopy rocks. I will ask @Michael for multi loop export.

    Been a while but I think when you export a Loopy session for itunes backup it creates a ZIP with 12 WAV files and the session XML. If we could just get that ZIP file into Audioshare (eg), don't think we'd need a separate multi-loop export.

  • @syrupcore said:

    @Janosax said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @tja said:
    @espiegel123 I understand and would like to try this myself.

    Any chance to get your AudioBus preset?
    Pleaseee

    @tja ; if you still need the AB3 preset , let me know and I will post it when I have my iPad available again which will be later today. In answer to your questions. In AUM, when you choose Loopy as a source, you can choose any of Loopy's dials (tracks) as a source or Loopy's stereo output. For a bus, you can choose Loopy as s destination if you have AUM connected to Loopy in AB3.

    @Janosax : those are good points. In my case I am using this set-up for quick-and-dirty demo stage workouts. So a few loops suffice for me. Most of what I am working up will get recorded. Though it is such a friendly flow, some of these loops may end up being used. I am sometimes recording the Loopy send bus so that I have a non-aac version of the audio should I want it.

    Loopy rocks. I will ask @Michael for multi loop export.

    Been a while but I think when you export a Loopy session for itunes backup it creates a ZIP with 12 WAV files and the session XML. If we could just get that ZIP file into Audioshare (eg), don't think we'd need a separate multi-loop export.

    Didn’t knew that, cool!! How do you proceed? Yes that could be the easiest option for @michael :)

  • @Janosax Sorry, I was off (but close). Said it had been a while. :) If you connect your iPad to iTunes and go to File Sharing->LoopyHD all of your sessions are there in folders. The folders consist of an XML file with the session data (bpm, track offsets, etc) and a "Media" folder with your loops (aif format, not wav). I think I was conflating an old request/wish (export as zip). So I guess that's still a wish! Considering LoopyHD's age, I somehow doubt changing its internal storage mechanism to FILES.app would be a trivial undertaking but I reckon that'd be the cleanest path forward.

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