Rozeta XOX with Patterning 2 or ElasticDrums in AUM guidance

I realize that people have inquired about this before, but was unable to find a working solution. I would like to trigger Patterning 2 with Rozeta X0X; none of the routing that I have tried give me a positive results. Are there any video examples already in existence?

Comments

  • edited October 2018

    Add Rozetta xox as instrument on AUM channel 1, add patterning 2 as IAA instrument on channel 2. Go to AUM midi matrix/routing screen and link xox to patterning 2.

    Press play on AUM transport, go to xox and open AU window and click star icon, choose patterning 2. Then you can check if working by just clicking the randomise option in xox and you should hear drums.

  • This was completely unhelpful.

  • Hold my beer...

  • Go easy on them, they’ve been trying that method for 6 months.

  • @Beathoven said:
    Go easy on them, they’ve been trying that method for 6 months.

    He's completely lost in a world of x's and o's still looking for help to come back to this dimension

  • .... But everyone is completely unhelpful there...

  • edited April 30

    As far as I know, I couldn't get it to work properly because Rozeta triggers the pads in Patterning 2, which for some reason do not have the choke group behavior attached to them, so hi hats are ruined. I emailed the dev and got a response months back, but I never checked to see if it got fixed because I had a hard enough time getting Rozeta to trigger it in the first place due to the weird MIDI input selection behavior on the pads screen in Patterning.

    I've got a 'screw it, move on' mentality about that kind of thing these days, because it's a tiny deal that probably literally 15 or less people have encountered in earnest (and half if lucky wrote to the dev), so it's just better not to waste more time on it. Before you know it, another 10-15 minutes have gone by and you're still at square one.

  • I just wish devs would go the whole hog and adopt auv3. I’d be happily pay for an upgrade - it’s baffling that more don’t make the move, especially when there’s must be money in it. I can only think the work involved is onerous. But, again, I’d happily pay a bit more for the pleasure.

  • @audio_DT said:
    I just wish devs would go the whole hog and adopt auv3. I’d be happily pay for an upgrade - it’s baffling that more don’t make the move, especially when there’s must be money in it. I can only think the work involved is onerous. But, again, I’d happily pay a bit more for the pleasure.

    If you knew how hard it was to adapt old code to AUv3, you would be less mystified. There is a a reason that there are so many apps that haven't been converted -- especially apps like Patterning.

    For those of you that are mystified, here is something to think about: the AudioKit Pro folks are totally devoted to making AUv3 happen and don't have to weigh profit potential -- and it is taking them quite a while.

    I know at least one dev, thoroughly committed to implementing AUv3 and got very far in the process (I think he though he was 95% of the way done) only to realize that the last 5% wasn't do-able without essentially throwing away what he had written and re-architecting -- not quite from scratch but pretty much.

  • Plus, not one dime from existing customers unless they make it a new app. If they do make it a new they get a bunch of pissed off existing customers.

    Sure maybe it helps attract some new customers, but subtract the ones who would buy it anyway, and I think developers come up with a very low chance of recovering the time investment vs. spending that same time developing completely new apps.

  • Plus not all apps need to be AU.

  • @espiegel123 said:

    @audio_DT said:
    I just wish devs would go the whole hog and adopt auv3. I’d be happily pay for an upgrade - it’s baffling that more don’t make the move, especially when there’s must be money in it. I can only think the work involved is onerous. But, again, I’d happily pay a bit more for the pleasure.

    If you knew how hard it was to adapt old code to AUv3, you would be less mystified. There is a a reason that there are so many apps that haven't been converted -- especially apps like Patterning.

    For those of you that are mystified, here is something to think about: the AudioKit Pro folks are totally devoted to making AUv3 happen and don't have to weigh profit potential -- and it is taking them quite a while.

    I know at least one dev, thoroughly committed to implementing AUv3 and got very far in the process (I think he though he was 95% of the way done) only to realize that the last 5% wasn't do-able without essentially throwing away what he had written and re-architecting -- not quite from scratch but pretty much.

    Patterning 2 was a great opportunity to be compatible with AU from scratch but the developer chose not to. I don’t have any data other than my own but I hardly ever use it because it is not AU. I am glad others are finding a fit for it in their workflow as it is an excellent app.

    Don’t forget, it is not an all or nothing decision. Sugar Bytes have demonstrated that apps can be converted to AU and also be stand alone. Best of both worlds.

  • @gusgranite said:

    Don’t forget, it is not an all or nothing decision. Sugar Bytes have demonstrated that apps can be converted to AU and also be stand alone. Best of both worlds.

    Higher maintenance burden though.

  • @wim said:

    @gusgranite said:

    Don’t forget, it is not an all or nothing decision. Sugar Bytes have demonstrated that apps can be converted to AU and also be stand alone. Best of both worlds.

    Higher maintenance burden though.

    And Sugar Bytes came from making AUs and VSTs on computers, so their original ports to iOS were, no doubt, using a code base that was easy to adapt back to AUv3.

    A lot of the original developers on iOS used frameworks that don't have an easy path to Audio Units and would require a complete, low-level rewrite.

  • @gusgranite : because some developers have done this doesn't change the fact that porting from an existing stable codebase can be an enormous amount of work -- I think that people who haven't had to do this sort of thing don't realize. On top of that, the amount of income added for doing that work is probably a lot less than you might imagine.

    I am not saying that it can't be done, but I think people tend to vastly underestimate both the amount of work required and the the payoff for doing that work. Saying that Patterning 2 was an opportunity to do the AU from scratch ignores that the dev was able to leverage/repurpose existing Patterning 1 code.

  • @wim said:

    @gusgranite said:

    Don’t forget, it is not an all or nothing decision. Sugar Bytes have demonstrated that apps can be converted to AU and also be stand alone. Best of both worlds.

    Higher maintenance burden though.

    I agree. You know what I recommend if I have to choose one 😉

  • edited May 1

    @aplourde @espiegel123 I agree that it is effort. I’ve worked in and around development for many years so I get it, I honestly do. But it can also be said that it is a part of programming. Staying current. Staying compatible. Staying relevant. For the developers that find that difficult or too time consuming because it is more of a hobby than a profession then hopefully initiatives like AudioKit will help them, once that nut is cracked.

    There are enough AU apps now though to satisfy that workflow so I don’t think anyone is missing out. It’s just a few of my favourites that I would still selfishly love to see make the jump.

  • Being AU probably makes a lot less of a difference than you imagine. I know that there are quite a few people here that don't buy any non-AU apps. But there are far more that users that are AU agnostic.

    Devs that aren't rushing to make their apps AU aren't necessarily unserious or hobbyists.

    There are plenty of serious developers and technology companies that choose to take their time adopting new technologies.

  • @espiegel123 said:
    Being AU probably makes a lot less of a difference than you imagine. I know that there are quite a few people here that don't buy any non-AU apps. But there are far more that users that are AU agnostic.

    I think you are almost certainly wrong on this point. I have nothing to support it, but I have a good nose for these kind of things, so I bet I’m right. I can say that I have bought several apps I didn’t consider before because they had come out with AU versions, but then again, I can’t say I’m a typical user. Time will tell, but I believe the tide has changed irrevocably. Sure there will always be apps that only make sense standalone. But fewer than it may seem.

    @gusgranite said:
    ... Staying current. Staying compatible. Staying relevant. ...

    This. It’s a challenge to keep up with the times, and it takes a long time to change course. Developers (I can say this as I have been...) can all too easily work in a vacuum and not sense market shifts until they get passed by.

  • @espiegel123 said:
    Being AU probably makes a lot less of a difference than you imagine. I know that there are quite a few people here that don't buy any non-AU apps. But there are far more that users that are AU agnostic.

    Devs that aren't rushing to make their apps AU aren't necessarily unserious or hobbyists.

    There are plenty of serious developers and technology companies that choose to take their time adopting new technologies.

    Oh absolutely. The creators of these apps are way more skilled and talented than myself!! I expect many developers just don’t have the time or maybe they are just not that concerned with marketing, hype, sales etc. I think the Elastic Drums / EFX developers said they primarily make apps for themselves to play live so they did not feel the need for AU. Good for them. I wish I could get off my backside and make something creative for myself.

  • Thanks for all of the input. I will no longer use Patterning 2 or ElasticDrums

  • @DWP510 said:
    Thanks for all of the input. I will no longer use Patterning 2 or ElasticDrums

    Hahaha
    Glad to see things finally worked out.

    FWIW I think part of the issue with making Patterning an AU is that the UI really doesn't lend itself to scaling, and as far as it being a selling point, well... If you look at the charts it seems pretty obvious the pro market is not who you cater too if you want to move units. I'd go so far as to say it very well might hurt app sales for certain types of music based apps.

    Seems like the biggest market after the "musical games" that the app store is always pushing is probably teens who want to make "beats", which is why iMaschine and FL studio are still top sellers despite the former being way over due for an update and the latter being fairly awful from what I've heard.

  • @DWP510 said:
    Thanks for all of the input. I will no longer use Patterning 2 or ElasticDrums

    Then you’re missing out on two great drum machines!

    To be honest I’m not sure why you want to trigger from XOX as the sequencers in ED and P2 are more powerful for unlocking the capabilities of their respective sound engines. Unless you're running XOX and the internal sequencers in tandem; that could be useful for polyrhythmic / polymetric creation.

    That said, if you want to control ED or P2 from XOX, here's what you need to do:

    Elastic Drums
    In XOX, press the star button and set the keymap to Elastic Drums. This will send the BD on note 36, SD on 37, etc.

    NOTE: if you have changed the MIDI mappings in Elastic Drums, you will have to manually set these note triggers in XOX to match what you set in ED. The mapping XOX sets is the default setting in ED.

    Press the MIDI button and set the Output channel to whatever you want to use (in MIDI convention, drums have historically been mapped to Ch 10)

    In Elastic Drums press the Tools button and set the MIDI In channel to whatever you set for XOX (or you can use OMNI, which will respond to any MIDI channel)
    Set the Note in to "On" on the Elastic Drums row (Theoretically you could set this to "No port / IAA, AB3 Midi" and route through IAA MIDI, but that doesn't seem to work.)

    In AUM go to the MIDI routing page - this is the S-curved arrow in the top right corner - DON'T USE the MIDI Sources in the three line "hamburger" icon next to Elastic Drums, go to the full routing page.
    In the MIDI Routing page, connect XOX to the Elastic Drums Virtual input - NOT the Inter-App Audio input


    Patterning 2
    In XOX, press the star button and set the keymap to Patterning 2

    NOTE: by default, Patterning 2 doesn't have any mappings set with a New file. If you have created or loaded a file with alternative mappings for the note triggers, you'll have to set XOX to those mappings.

    Press the MIDI button and set the Output channel to whatever you want to use (in MIDI convention, drums have historically been mapped to Ch 10)

    In Patterning 2, you have to create the MIDI mappings for the triggers, there aren't any by default in a New file. Fortunately there's a shortcut: Go to the Record page, press the MIDI button and set the values you want. You should keep the Port to Patterning 2, but you have to set the channel to whatever you have in XOX. Now click "Generate"

    In AUM go to the MIDI routing page - this is the S-curved arrow in the top right corner - and connect XOX to the Patterning 2 Port

  • @aplourde said:

    @DWP510 said:
    Thanks for all of the input. I will no longer use Patterning 2 or ElasticDrums

    Then you’re missing out on two great drum machines!

    To be honest I’m not sure why you want to trigger from XOX as the sequencers in ED and P2 are more powerful for unlocking the capabilities of their respective sound engines. Unless you're running XOX and the internal sequencers in tandem; that could be useful for polyrhythmic / polymetric creation.

    That said, if you want to control ED or P2 from XOX, here's what you need to do:

    Elastic Drums
    In XOX, press the star button and set the keymap to Elastic Drums. This will send the BD on note 36, SD on 37, etc.

    NOTE: if you have changed the MIDI mappings in Elastic Drums, you will have to manually set these note triggers in XOX to match what you set in ED. The mapping XOX sets is the default setting in ED.

    Press the MIDI button and set the Output channel to whatever you want to use (in MIDI convention, drums have historically been mapped to Ch 10)

    In Elastic Drums press the Tools button and set the MIDI In channel to whatever you set for XOX (or you can use OMNI, which will respond to any MIDI channel)
    Set the Note in to "On" on the Elastic Drums row (Theoretically you could set this to "No port / IAA, AB3 Midi" and route through IAA MIDI, but that doesn't seem to work.)

    In AUM go to the MIDI routing page - this is the S-curved arrow in the top right corner - DON'T USE the MIDI Sources in the three line "hamburger" icon next to Elastic Drums, go to the full routing page.
    In the MIDI Routing page, connect XOX to the Elastic Drums Virtual input - NOT the Inter-App Audio input


    Patterning 2
    In XOX, press the star button and set the keymap to Patterning 2

    NOTE: by default, Patterning 2 doesn't have any mappings set with a New file. If you have created or loaded a file with alternative mappings for the note triggers, you'll have to set XOX to those mappings.

    Press the MIDI button and set the Output channel to whatever you want to use (in MIDI convention, drums have historically been mapped to Ch 10)

    In Patterning 2, you have to create the MIDI mappings for the triggers, there aren't any by default in a New file. Fortunately there's a shortcut: Go to the Record page, press the MIDI button and set the values you want. You should keep the Port to Patterning 2, but you have to set the channel to whatever you have in XOX. Now click "Generate"

    In AUM go to the MIDI routing page - this is the S-curved arrow in the top right corner - and connect XOX to the Patterning 2 Port
    ![](https://forum.audiob.us/uploads/editor/23/

    Thank you so much! I knew there had to be possible way, since both Rozeta midi rhythm sequencers have a mappings for them. Patterning 2 and elastic drums happen to be the drum machines I know the best and have spent the most time importing sounds into. I haven’t been that happy with any of the iOS AUv3 sampling drum machines.

    I like MV08 and I am interested in Axon2, as far as drum machines without sample import. I understand that beathawk has sample import, but haven’t found a quick and easy way to import.

  • @espiegel123 said:
    Being AU probably makes a lot less of a difference than you imagine. I know that there are quite a few people here that don't buy any non-AU apps. But there are far more that users that are AU agnostic.

    Devs that aren't rushing to make their apps AU aren't necessarily unserious or hobbyists.

    There are plenty of serious developers and technology companies that choose to take their time adopting new technologies.

    Agree. I don't know what's typical, but I buy an app because it's purported to work and does something I can use. That includes many non-AU apps.

    I'm not sure what market AB Forum represents, but it probably attracts more users who work strictly with modular and relatively complex iOS set ups. Does this accurately represent the larger market out there? I doubt it. There are many possible use cases where AUv3 doesn't play a critical, relevant or advantageous role. But this must also depend on the app in question. And as @aplourde so nicely explained, there are ways to get more out of an app than what is the typical use.

    I think a developer would be more likely to know what's best for their app, how it's selling, and the amount of work they want to put into it. Personally, I feel good about supporting a well-functioning non-AU app, just as encouragement to the dev that making something useful is still a valuable contribution to the iOS music-making platform. Patterning 2 is one of many that fits that description.

  • I think certain apps lend themselves to being standalone (when they have sequencers, song modes etc for example) but for sound generation I would prefer Auv3 every time.

    I like apps like ruismaker Noir where you can use it standalone but it works very nicely as an au with or without its sequencer.

    That gives you the best of both worlds.

    Having said that I am much (much) more likely to purchase a sound generator if it’s both universal and auv3. I never use apps like Noir standalone.

    The only apps I use that are IaA are apps I bought a long time ago. Aum has given DM2 and ielectribe a new lease of life for me, but also every time I use them I wish they were auv3 instead.

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