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Pitchfork's 50 best ambient albums of all time

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Comments

  • Some strange omissions but its a respectable list and nice read. How a list like this can exist without Pan American is beyond me, though.

  • @Masanga Thanks, made interesting reading. A wide variety of music here, Id heard of a few but but not to many..Im defo going to dig a bit deeper into this world

  • It is a list made by an American website. But still, I count 24 American artists. Definitely dominant but a lot of Brittish, German and Scandinavians on the list. So certainly an Anglo heavy list but no Anglo-American. Not sure why any of that is relevant though since it's hard for me to argue with any of the choices on the list. Are there any non-Anglo ambient artist that you think are glaring omissions? I love ambient so I'm always happy to have some new suggestions to check out

  • Yes, I was counting the Brits and the Americans together (who make up nine of the top 10). I'd personally reverse the proportion of German and American artists, but then my top 50 would probably all be by Mathias Grassow…

  • surprised Hiroshi Yoshimura didn't make the list.
    I guess this was before the re-examining of Japanese ambient works. I'm glad to see that so many great artists are getting the attention they deserve.

    Yoshio Ojima, Toshifumi Hinata, Inoyamaland.. and many more greats.

    lots of great stuff to be found here

  • edited September 2018

    ... and to be honest, to lump some of these artists in under the ambient umbrella is just naive (lamonte young, terry riley, pauline oliveros, jon hassell, laurie spiegel to name a few obvious ones.) These are all examples of people who created music to be very actively listened to, not at all intended for ambience. Not to be pedantic, but it's just not ambient music.

    Satie, Eno, Deuter.. yeah.. intentional ambient music. But just because something CAN be listened to passively doesn't make it ambient music. I would be sad to find beethoven or ravi shankar in the Ambient section, but sadly, a lot of great music intended for very active listening is becoming wallpaper.

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  • @Max23 said:

    @palm said: These are all examples of people who created music to be very actively listened to, not at all intended for ambience. Not to be pedantic, but it's just not ambient music.

    I dont know, there are two kinds of ambient music I guess
    a) something like a wallpaper kind of music that just doodles in the background
    b) something that is emotional
    I prefer "b"

    I don't know what that means.

    all I'm sayin is that if one can lump anything that can be listened to as background music as "ambient" then the word loses all meaning. Not that different than labelling Gauguin as "hotel art" because you find a bad repro in the lobby of a Ramada Inn. Intention matters.

    just because someone finds the music of lamont young, or throbbing gristle, or chuck berry, or abba to be the perfect background as they're doing the dishes, does not make any of those "ambient music"

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  • What about these people?
    :zoviet france:

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  • @Max23 said:

    @palm said:

    @Max23 said:

    @palm said: These are all examples of people who created music to be very actively listened to, not at all intended for ambience. Not to be pedantic, but it's just not ambient music.

    I dont know, there are two kinds of ambient music I guess
    a) something like a wallpaper kind of music that just doodles in the background
    b) something that is emotional
    I prefer "b"

    I don't know what that means.

    all I'm sayin is that if one can lump anything that can be listened to as background music as "ambient" then the word loses all meaning. Not that different than labelling Gauguin as "hotel art" because you find a bad repro in the lobby of a Ramada Inn. Intention matters.

    just because someone finds the music of lamont young, or throbbing gristle, or chuck berry, or abba to be the perfect background as they're doing the dishes, does not make any of those "ambient music"

    ^^
    I meant music for airports

    vs. this

    something like elevator music (muzak) vs. something that is catchy and takes you on a trip

    yeah, you're entitled to your own tastes, personally I find the Eno to be the less cheesy of the two you posted there. Not my favorite Eno by a longshot, but it's a classic for sure. But this has nothing to do with the point I was trying to make. It's not a matter of taste, I'm only saying that the pitchfork list misses the mark and lumps things that are not ambient works in with those that are.

  • @u0421793 said:
    What about these people?
    :zoviet france:

    Yes, I LOVE Zoviet France.

  • edited September 2018

    @palm said:

    @Max23 said:

    @palm said:

    @Max23 said:

    @palm said: These are all examples of people who created music to be very actively listened to, not at all intended for ambience. Not to be pedantic, but it's just not ambient music.

    I dont know, there are two kinds of ambient music I guess
    a) something like a wallpaper kind of music that just doodles in the background
    b) something that is emotional
    I prefer "b"

    I don't know what that means.

    all I'm sayin is that if one can lump anything that can be listened to as background music as "ambient" then the word loses all meaning. Not that different than labelling Gauguin as "hotel art" because you find a bad repro in the lobby of a Ramada Inn. Intention matters.

    just because someone finds the music of lamont young, or throbbing gristle, or chuck berry, or abba to be the perfect background as they're doing the dishes, does not make any of those "ambient music"

    ^^
    I meant music for airports

    vs. this

    something like elevator music (muzak) vs. something that is catchy and takes you on a trip

    found this comment pretty funny because what you seem to dislike about classic ambient music is precisely what ambient composers set out to do (and music for airports is about the most classic ambient work you could have chosen. and no, it's not elevator music, it was literally composed for an airport). It was originally designed to NOT be listened to closely. It was designed to NOT be catchy. To not take you on a trip or distract your senses. Eric Satie's Furniture music, Yoshimura's music for interior spaces, Eno's music for airports, these were an answer to Muzak, and an answer to the earworms of Pop music of the 20th century (which a bit ironically Satie and Eno both had massive influences in the world of pop)

    yes, it's a matter of taste. but intention is key here. And yes, there's a lot of music that rides the line of ambient/not ambient. But then we have to agree that there is music that is decidedly not ambient, lest the word lose its meaning. To reiterate: just because you can listen to Slayer in the background doesn't make them Ambient musicians. intention intention intention.

  • @palm said:

    @u0421793 said:
    What about these people?
    :zoviet france:

    Yes, I LOVE Zoviet France.

    the grandaddies, and Ben’s been doing it quite probably since 78 or before. ie: when Eno ‘coined’ (sic) the term,
    there was a pre ZF thing called Asburd with A McKenzie of Hafler Trio.
    ZF & Hafler Trio , especially Chris Watson era h30 is my kind of ‘ambient’ sound.
    Eno is kind of ‘pop’ ambient, I think someone posted Robert Ashleys Automatic Writing yt link in this thread or elsewhere.. that and a lot of other stuff pre-date the term.. those 69-79 ‘ Environments ‘ LPs,someone else linked to, are key... the whole story behind them is great.. the guy Irv was recording sea sounds for a Tony Conrad film and thought the recordings had commercial potential as ‘ a relaxing aid’ Mr Conrad poopooed the idea and opted out of partnership in it, but Irv went ahead and set up a successful business around it .. 11 LPs released, I have all 11, no idea why?? more clutter..
    i have a feeling of deja vu around this thread?? have we been here before?

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  • edited October 2018

    @RockySmalls said:

    @palm said:

    @u0421793 said:
    What about these people?
    :zoviet france:

    Yes, I LOVE Zoviet France.

    the grandaddies, and Ben’s been doing it quite probably since 78 or before. ie: when Eno ‘coined’ (sic) the term,
    there was a pre ZF thing called Asburd with A McKenzie of Hafler Trio.
    ZF & Hafler Trio , especially Chris Watson era h30 is my kind of ‘ambient’ sound.
    Eno is kind of ‘pop’ ambient, I think someone posted Robert Ashleys Automatic Writing yt link in this thread or elsewhere.. that and a lot of other stuff pre-date the term.. those 69-79 ‘ Environments ‘ LPs,someone else linked to, are key... the whole story behind them is great.. the guy Irv was recording sea sounds for a Tony Conrad film and thought the recordings had commercial potential as ‘ a relaxing aid’ Mr Conrad poopooed the idea and opted out of partnership in it, but Irv went ahead and set up a successful business around it .. 11 LPs released, I have all 11, no idea why?? more clutter..
    i have a feeling of deja vu around this thread?? have we been here before?

    ha! Tony Conrad was such a badass. One of my musical heroes for sure. I can see why he didn't want to be involved with that series (even though I've owned most of them over the years as well and love them). His aims were certainly not for passive (or easy) listening.

    more ambient grandaddies:

    http://www.openculture.com/2018/04/hear-the-very-first-pieces-of-ambient-music-erik-saties-furniture-music-circa-1917.html

  • @palm said:

    @RockySmalls said:

    @palm said:

    @u0421793 said:
    What about these people?
    :zoviet france:

    Yes, I LOVE Zoviet France.

    the grandaddies, and Ben’s been doing it quite probably since 78 or before. ie: when Eno ‘coined’ (sic) the term,
    there was a pre ZF thing called Asburd with A McKenzie of Hafler Trio.
    ZF & Hafler Trio , especially Chris Watson era h30 is my kind of ‘ambient’ sound.
    Eno is kind of ‘pop’ ambient, I think someone posted Robert Ashleys Automatic Writing yt link in this thread or elsewhere.. that and a lot of other stuff pre-date the term.. those 69-79 ‘ Environments ‘ LPs,someone else linked to, are key... the whole story behind them is great.. the guy Irv was recording sea sounds for a Tony Conrad film and thought the recordings had commercial potential as ‘ a relaxing aid’ Mr Conrad poopooed the idea and opted out of partnership in it, but Irv went ahead and set up a successful business around it .. 11 LPs released, I have all 11, no idea why?? more clutter..
    i have a feeling of deja vu around this thread?? have we been here before?

    ha! Tony Conrad was such a badass. One of my musical heroes for sure. I can see why he didn't want to be involved with that series (even though I've owned most of them over the years as well and love them). His aims were certainly not for passive (or easy) listening.

    more ambient grandaddies:

    http://www.openculture.com/2018/04/hear-the-very-first-pieces-of-ambient-music-erik-saties-furniture-music-circa-1917.html

    ah Tod! so weird to see clips of that projected doc (sic) of him suffering alzhiemers in later years,, they played him some of his own music and he perked up saying “ this is interesting! who composed this?? “
    it was heartbreaking ..but I can’t help wishing i could experience my own stuff without any prior memory of it too!
    They never got enough money to do the full doc , strange they haven’t kickstartered it or summink..
    good stuff, great stuff...

  • @palm said:

    @RockySmalls said:

    @palm said:

    @u0421793 said:
    What about these people?
    :zoviet france:

    Yes, I LOVE Zoviet France.

    the grandaddies, and Ben’s been doing it quite probably since 78 or before. ie: when Eno ‘coined’ (sic) the term,
    there was a pre ZF thing called Asburd with A McKenzie of Hafler Trio.
    ZF & Hafler Trio , especially Chris Watson era h30 is my kind of ‘ambient’ sound.
    Eno is kind of ‘pop’ ambient, I think someone posted Robert Ashleys Automatic Writing yt link in this thread or elsewhere.. that and a lot of other stuff pre-date the term.. those 69-79 ‘ Environments ‘ LPs,someone else linked to, are key... the whole story behind them is great.. the guy Irv was recording sea sounds for a Tony Conrad film and thought the recordings had commercial potential as ‘ a relaxing aid’ Mr Conrad poopooed the idea and opted out of partnership in it, but Irv went ahead and set up a successful business around it .. 11 LPs released, I have all 11, no idea why?? more clutter..
    i have a feeling of deja vu around this thread?? have we been here before?

    ha! Tony Conrad was such a badass. One of my musical heroes for sure.

    i love Mr Conrad too, but perhaps a little more for his films than the music. I put him on here in manchester in the 90’s , a string trio piece with his then girlfriend and jim o’rourke playing the other fiddles.. tried to chat with him backstage about ‘ the flicker ‘ etc but every time i asked him a question about film his girlfriend butted in with banal comments like “ do you get Roseanne over here in the UK? “ ?!?! wtflip?
    the music was totally earbending.. and seemed never to be going to stop.. so... a bit like ambient music in that 2nd aspect ;-)

  • edited October 2018
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • edited October 2018

    @RockySmalls said:

    @palm said:

    @RockySmalls said:

    @palm said:

    @u0421793 said:
    What about these people?
    :zoviet france:

    Yes, I LOVE Zoviet France.

    the grandaddies, and Ben’s been doing it quite probably since 78 or before. ie: when Eno ‘coined’ (sic) the term,
    there was a pre ZF thing called Asburd with A McKenzie of Hafler Trio.
    ZF & Hafler Trio , especially Chris Watson era h30 is my kind of ‘ambient’ sound.
    Eno is kind of ‘pop’ ambient, I think someone posted Robert Ashleys Automatic Writing yt link in this thread or elsewhere.. that and a lot of other stuff pre-date the term.. those 69-79 ‘ Environments ‘ LPs,someone else linked to, are key... the whole story behind them is great.. the guy Irv was recording sea sounds for a Tony Conrad film and thought the recordings had commercial potential as ‘ a relaxing aid’ Mr Conrad poopooed the idea and opted out of partnership in it, but Irv went ahead and set up a successful business around it .. 11 LPs released, I have all 11, no idea why?? more clutter..
    i have a feeling of deja vu around this thread?? have we been here before?

    ha! Tony Conrad was such a badass. One of my musical heroes for sure.

    i love Mr Conrad too, but perhaps a little more for his films than the music. I put him on here in manchester in the 90’s , a string trio piece with his then girlfriend and jim o’rourke playing the other fiddles.. tried to chat with him backstage about ‘ the flicker ‘ etc but every time i asked him a question about film his girlfriend butted in with banal comments like “ do you get Roseanne over here in the UK? “ ?!?! wtflip?
    the music was totally earbending.. and seemed never to be going to stop.. so... a bit like ambient music in that 2nd aspect ;-)

    lol, yeah that sounds about right. I mean, he was a key player in the theater of eternal music, so the whole 'toying with duration' thing is certainly intentional. Personally I love his music, even more so than his films. Four Violins is one of my all time favorite pieces of music. and it's anything but ambient music. still boggles that it was made in 1964!

    I got a chance to see him present some of his early films and videos a couple of years before he died. The ones with Mike Kelly were great. And his public access TV stuff, oh man! so funny.

  • @palm said:

    @RockySmalls said:

    @palm said:

    @RockySmalls said:

    @palm said:

    @u0421793 said:
    What about these people?
    :zoviet france:

    Yes, I LOVE Zoviet France.

    the grandaddies, and Ben’s been doing it quite probably since 78 or before. ie: when Eno ‘coined’ (sic) the term,
    there was a pre ZF thing called Asburd with A McKenzie of Hafler Trio.
    ZF & Hafler Trio , especially Chris Watson era h30 is my kind of ‘ambient’ sound.
    Eno is kind of ‘pop’ ambient, I think someone posted Robert Ashleys Automatic Writing yt link in this thread or elsewhere.. that and a lot of other stuff pre-date the term.. those 69-79 ‘ Environments ‘ LPs,someone else linked to, are key... the whole story behind them is great.. the guy Irv was recording sea sounds for a Tony Conrad film and thought the recordings had commercial potential as ‘ a relaxing aid’ Mr Conrad poopooed the idea and opted out of partnership in it, but Irv went ahead and set up a successful business around it .. 11 LPs released, I have all 11, no idea why?? more clutter..
    i have a feeling of deja vu around this thread?? have we been here before?

    ha! Tony Conrad was such a badass. One of my musical heroes for sure.

    i love Mr Conrad too, but perhaps a little more for his films than the music. I put him on here in manchester in the 90’s , a string trio piece with his then girlfriend and jim o’rourke playing the other fiddles.. tried to chat with him backstage about ‘ the flicker ‘ etc but every time i asked him a question about film his girlfriend butted in with banal comments like “ do you get Roseanne over here in the UK? “ ?!?! wtflip?
    the music was totally earbending.. and seemed never to be going to stop.. so... a bit like ambient music in that 2nd aspect ;-)

    lol, yeah that sounds about right. I mean, he was a key player in the theater of eternal music, so the whole 'toying with duration' thing is certainly intentional. Personally I love his music, even more so than his films. Four Violins is one of my all time favorite pieces of music. and it's anything but ambient music. still boggles that it was made in 1964!

    I got a chance to see him present some of his early films and videos a couple of years before he died. The ones with Mike Kelly were great. And his public access TV stuff, oh man! so funny.

    ah.. I must check out the Mike Kelly collabs... ‘bored’ by Destroy All Monsters was one of my fave 7 inchers in the late 70’s , i think i still have it somewhere?
    weird that Mr Kelly killed himself just when he seemed, finally, to start being taken seriously by the international art scene!? perhaps the ultimate in self-negating ‘Punk’ actions? no sell out? or couldn't face all those wanky art openings ahead of him?

  • @Max23 said:

    ooh - great to hear this live. I listen to a lot of Henke while writing. Textures and grit, but not demanding my full attention, perfect.

  • @Max23 said:

    Oh my, I love this. Thank you.

  • @Max23 said:
    @palm
    I like to play music for airports at the time time with selected ambient works 2 (apex twin). makes an interesting piece of music ^^

    A favorite stoney household pastime in the 90s was watching "The Cook, the Thief, His Wife & Her Lover" with the sound muted while playing Music for Airports.

  • @palm said:
    ... and to be honest, to lump some of these artists in under the ambient umbrella is just naive (lamonte young, terry riley, pauline oliveros, jon hassell, laurie spiegel to name a few obvious ones.) These are all examples of people who created music to be very actively listened to, not at all intended for ambience. Not to be pedantic, but it's just not ambient music.

    Satie, Eno, Deuter.. yeah.. intentional ambient music. But just because something CAN be listened to passively doesn't make it ambient music. I would be sad to find beethoven or ravi shankar in the Ambient section, but sadly, a lot of great music intended for very active listening is becoming wallpaper.

    It's a good point. Think coming up with an agreed upon genre definition for a "best 50 of" anything is basically impossible, especially with a nebulous and/or personal genre like ambient. In this case though, I'm gonna give Pitchfork credit/points for describing how they described the genre to the music critics they polled at the top of the article. Don't think you could really do much more.

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