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Cubasis: Rendered Audio is always a bit too long

2

Comments

  • tjatja

    Then, i imported this WAV file into Cubasis:

    And then I made a new mixdown in Cubasis, with interesting result ...

  • tjatja

    The resulting file from Cubasis was again longer!!!

    And you can see, that something was added at the end!

    So, we now know what happens:

    As suspected Cubasis adds a small silence at the end of the WAV!

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @tja said:
    @Telefunky The baseline of what you wrote is, that shit happens and that we need to accept small differences. Right?

    I could live with that, if i knew that a bit of silence was added at the beginning or at the end, so that i could crop the right thing.

    As much as i dislike that BeatMaker does not know how long the track is, at least it can cut cleanly after the given number of bars!

    I will try to use this, to determine what is the right way to crop the Cubasis result.
    And then I repeat the same for Auria, which seems to be a bit too short.

    I need this to be able to compare rendering results, as this would be done by comparing the Spectrum graphically.

    To figure out where the added length is is simple. Create two bars and on each beat have a short note with good transients and little decay (like a rimshot) and follow that with sixteenth notes (also sounds without much decay like a closed hat). Render that. If silence is added in front, it will be visually obvious when you look at the waveform.

  • tjatja

    @espiegel123 said:

    @tja said:
    @Telefunky The baseline of what you wrote is, that shit happens and that we need to accept small differences. Right?

    I could live with that, if i knew that a bit of silence was added at the beginning or at the end, so that i could crop the right thing.

    As much as i dislike that BeatMaker does not know how long the track is, at least it can cut cleanly after the given number of bars!

    I will try to use this, to determine what is the right way to crop the Cubasis result.
    And then I repeat the same for Auria, which seems to be a bit too short.

    I need this to be able to compare rendering results, as this would be done by comparing the Spectrum graphically.

    To figure out where the added length is is simple. Create two bars and on each beat have a short note with good transients and little decay (like a rimshot) and follow that with sixteenth notes (also sounds without much decay like a closed hat). Render that. If silence is added in front, it will be visually obvious when you look at the waveform.

    That was not needed.
    As you can easily see in the graphic, the silence was added at the end!

    I proved that by cutting that part manually, so that the samples was exact 2 seconds again:

    This is exactly as the original BeatMaker 3 file!

    Cubasis adds a little silence.

    This is a bug to me, @LFS

  • tjatja

    And as i will show in my later topic, there are some little rendering differences as well, even if Cubasis just used a sample from BeatMaker 3!

  • oat_phippsoat_phipps

    Pardon me, I've wandered into the wrong thread

  • tjatja

    To show that more clear:

    1) Original BeatMaker file
    2) Slightly longer rendering from Cubasis, using the above file from BeatMaker!
    3) Cropped Cubasis file to 2.000 seconds as the BeatMaker original

  • AlexBAlexB

    @Samu said:

    And it won't be a 'perfect loop' unless the excess is mixed into the beginning of the file :)
    (This is one feature I love in LogicPro X, it creates 'perfect loops' by mixing in the decaying notes, in practice it saves the 'second pass' of a loop).

    Hey,how do you that in Logic Pro X?

  • tjatja
    edited July 2018

    And to show that this is a Cubasis problem, i repeated the same with Auria Pro:

    The same BeatMaker original WAV imported into Auria Pro and then exported over mixdown to AudioShare resulted in a clean 2.000 seconds file!

  • SamuSamu

    @AlexB said:

    @Samu said:

    And it won't be a 'perfect loop' unless the excess is mixed into the beginning of the file :)
    (This is one feature I love in LogicPro X, it creates 'perfect loops' by mixing in the decaying notes, in practice it saves the 'second pass' of a loop).

    Hey,how do you that in Logic Pro X?

    Select an audio-event and press Command+B(File->Boucnce->Project or Section).

    Select 'Realtime' and 'Bounce 2nd Cycle Pass'.

  • MobileMusicMobileMusic

    I had silence at the end of song issue on the excessive side:

    https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=183&t=136375

  • tjatja

    I added myself to that topic, as it is quite similar and @LFS is not as often in our forum ;)

  • RUST( i )KRUST( i )K

    @tja said:
    Whatever I try, the length of rendered audio from MIDI patterns in Cubasis, always seems to be a bit too long.

    For example, 8 bars of MIDI create 16.011 seconds of Audio.

    This seems always be the case.

    And I am not sure if this is just a small piece of audio before the recording, after the recording or if the recording was stretched a bit.

    Anyway, this is not good!

    Any trick to prevent this?

    Or is this a bug, @LFS

    Auria?

    LOL

    Kidding I use Cubasis .

    Dealt with this for years.....

  • tjatja

    @RUST( i )K said:

    @tja said:
    Whatever I try, the length of rendered audio from MIDI patterns in Cubasis, always seems to be a bit too long.

    For example, 8 bars of MIDI create 16.011 seconds of Audio.

    This seems always be the case.

    And I am not sure if this is just a small piece of audio before the recording, after the recording or if the recording was stretched a bit.

    Anyway, this is not good!

    Any trick to prevent this?

    Or is this a bug, @LFS

    Auria?

    LOL

    Kidding I use Cubasis .

    Dealt with this for years.....

    Yep, at Cubasis it is repeatable, even with a WAV file.

    With Auria Pro, I am not sure, that may have been with my MIDI tests - will try again.

  • cblomertcblomert

    Cubasis probably does not cut the audio file after the right amount of samples but after the whole last buffer of 64/128/256 samples finished.
    Maybe it's worth to write them an email about it, should be a pretty easy fix.

  • SamuSamu

    @cblomert said:
    Cubasis probably does not cut the audio file after the right amount of samples but after the whole last buffer of 64/128/256 samples finished.
    Maybe it's worth to write them an email about it, should be a pretty easy fix.

    Or we'll just tag @LFS and in due time he'll see this here too ;)

  • tjatja

    @cblomert said:
    Cubasis probably does not cut the audio file after the right amount of samples but after the whole last buffer of 64/128/256 samples finished.
    Maybe it's worth to write them an email about it, should be a pretty easy fix.

    Thanks for the suggestion!

    I am going to add that to the topic in the Cubasis forum!

  • anicktanickt

    Sorry but I just have to say it...
    I can’t help but be amused at all this concern over .011 seconds of audio. :D

  • SamuSamu

    @anickt said:
    Sorry but I just have to say it...
    I can’t help but be amused at all this concern over .011 seconds of audio. :D

    Ditto, but it can be quite 'annoying' if the intent is to create loops that well, loop properly without too many glitches :)

  • tjatja

    @Samu said:

    @anickt said:
    Sorry but I just have to say it...
    I can’t help but be amused at all this concern over .011 seconds of audio. :D

    Ditto, but it can be quite 'annoying' if the intent is to create loops that well, loop properly without too many glitches :)

    Yes, and also, when you want to graphically compare the spectrum.
    :)

  • LFSLFS
    edited July 2018

    Hi all, We‘ll look at the issue to evaluate a possible fix. Best Lars

  • tjatja

    @LFS said:
    Hi all, We‘ll look at the issue to evaluate a possible fix. Best Lars

    Thanks a big bunch!!! :) :) :)

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User]

    I’m enjoying Cubasis more and more each day! It’s now my starting point for any music creativity! That copy track feature really revolutionary man! Thanks Cubasis!

  • anicktanickt

    @tja said:

    @Samu said:

    @anickt said:
    Sorry but I just have to say it...
    I can’t help but be amused at all this concern over .011 seconds of audio. :D

    Ditto, but it can be quite 'annoying' if the intent is to create loops that well, loop properly without too many glitches :)

    Yes, and also, when you want to graphically compare the spectrum.
    :)

    ;)

  • gsm909gsm909

    @LFS , please add LINK 😀

  • mrcanistermrcanister

    So could this also be connected with the clock jitter when Cubasis is looping?
    Two dirty birdies with one stone??

  • wimwim

    @gsm909 said:
    @LFS , please add LINK 😀

    You realize that real-time audio timestretch would be required to do this, right? That’s a tall order.

  • theconnactictheconnactic

    Real-time audio timestretch would be only the basic requirement - Auria already has it, and yet there’s no sign of link being in the road map afaik.

  • wimwim

    Yes, very difficult for DAW developers to think of themselves as being a tempo slave. Except for BM3, they always want to be the master.

  • alexwasashrimpalexwasashrimp

    Sorry for reviving an old thread with a question that isn't really relevant, but I'm trying to figure out what am I doing wrong in Cubasis 3 LE and I don't think my newbie question deserves a separate thread. And googling "cubasis mixdown too long" led me here.
    My track is 90 seconds long, but if I enable tails in the mixdown, it becomes exactly 3 minutes long. It's a single audio track with Tape Cassette 2 and MBC being the only effects applied. I'm quite new to it all (I'm a hardware guy), is there anything that I'm doing wrong?

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