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Apple goes rotten

Over the past week I have become less and less impressed with Apple, and would like to share my experience as a warning.

As some members here may recall from other threads, where parts of the story has come up, I need to return my iPad Pro 10.5, which I've owned since shortly after launch in June 2017. A device which I have looked after better than some people treat their children!

At first all was well, then the problems began;

  1. The iPad would turn itself off randomly. Events that triggered this included;

Being slow with the fingerprint reader.
Shutting the case.
Opening the case.
Leaving the iPad on-charge.
Switching apps.

  1. Before the event above, the iPad would sometimes lose all touch screen ability.
  • Both 1 & 2 meant that the only way out was a forced restart.
  1. The iPad randomly loses its Net connection, and will not automatically pick up on known networks.

  2. When using the software keyboard, iPad often loses its place and continues typing in the middle of a previous paragraph.

Eventually, these problems became too frequent, so I contacted Apple, expecting first class service, 'cause I'd paid top dollar, and because Apple pride themselves on reliability.

Instead, I found a bunch of obsequious on-line 'chat' personnel, who thought calling me by my first name made them my friends, while making sure I was forced to jump through hoops.

I'd thought it would be a simple matter to arrange for Apple to send me a new iPad, and arrange for collection of the faulty one. But the only option on offer was to return it for inspection. Only then would it either be repaired or replaced. They would decide which. So apparently what I thought was my right to insist that faulty goods were replaced is not certain.

I tried explaining that at this time I have seriously tricky medical issues, almost died in March, and that my iPad was a lifeline to the world. I was given a personal e-mail address from an American called Everett, who told me he would 'take ownership' whatever the fuck that means, and ensure all was well. If I had more questions, all I needed to do was ask. So I did ask, twice, and both e-mails were ignored. But I did get some follow up claptrap asking if I'd received excellent service!

Lastly, the courier packaging Apple sent was from UPS, whose website will not allow me to arrange for home collection. So my other half has to deliver it to the nearest collection point, in town.

All of the above has left me with a very bad impression. I feel like Apple don't really give a shit, and are doing the bare minimum required by law. If they'd been interested, I'm sure they could have chosen to help me out and make an exception. But it wasn't to be, they have my money, and I have their faulty flagship product.

At this point, it is likely to be the last hardware I buy from Apple, as I no longer feel I can trust either their quality control or after sales service. If I bought another device, I'd probably be better of getting a refurbished model from Hoxton Macs.

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Comments

  • edited August 2017

    That sucks

    Here in Denmark, Apple has been giving out refurbished phones as replacements, claiming they were new, which is a violation of danish consumer law. It took 2 court cases (city and then appeal in national court) before they got the message

    However, it seems par for the course for companies of that size. Also, the experience when dealing with support seems to be very dependant on the person who happens to handle your case

    I wouldn't expect any better from Microsoft and their data mining makes Apple seem like saints. Same with Google. Samsung is in all kinds of trouble in Korea because of bribery, Lenovo preinstalls actual spyware in the bios so even a format won't get rid of it and the list goes on and on

    I pretty much always expect giant corporations are out to screw me if they can get away with it. That way i'm rarely disappointed

  • tjatja
    edited August 2017

    I always hated Apple because of their behavior and stance ;-)
    Also, they cannot fix the simplest bugs or add the most basic features.
    No device I ever had had a working Hotspot, for example.
    It constantly get's disconnected and is not able to reconnect at all.
    And such things are manyyyyyyy

    Still, I prefer iOS over Android - both because of OS and hardware.
    But that does not mean that I like Apple

  • In my dealings with Apple I took my MacBook to an Apple store to have the screen replaced and picked it up 2 hours later. I'm not expecting that level of service every time but I know I would never get it from any other manufacturer.

  • I've only ever had to deal with them when I had a faulty screen in my 2nd gen. Macbook Air (one half of the screen was darker than the other). They replaced the screen promptly without asking questions, and within 48 hours I had my laptop back. They were polite and the service was smooth and as one would expect from a premium brand.

  • I have no complains yet.

  • I had to replace my iPad Air 2 times and had some trouble with macOS updates (which i solved myself at the end).
    In general i find their support the best from all brands i ever bought.
    The thing is that wherever you bought an apple device you can get help very fast....normally.
    But where Apple seems to drift away more and more are the premium prices and removing useful things or messing up software.
    Of course iOS and especially iPhones are now their focus which is not good (my opinion) for pro apps and macOS/OSX.
    They will make iOS slowly into an macOS touch to replace the macbooks. Then we wait 10 years more before we realize that iOS and tablets never can replace a notebook (if you really need one).
    The app store should never be the only place to get software but that's where Apple want us to be.
    I realized that iOS is not the right thing for me as workstation but macOS might die too in the future.
    But i'm not bound to a brand...if things get really bad i switch in a heartbeat to the next soultaker >:)
    IPhones are great but not sure if i buy another one since i use it more and more just as smartphone and not for music creation and there are cheaper ones which are as good. I just bought 3-4 apps this year instead of maybe 30-40 like the previous years.
    IPads are still the best tablets but i still think i'm not a tablet friend at all and the latest bugs in soft- and/or hardware sounds not accetable.
    A new Macbook Pro is still on my list at the top but it's so damn expensive at nearly 3 grands.
    So at the end i agree a bit with the topic but still love Logic Pro X and my plug-ins which runs all on my macbook and so i will go with Apple at least for some more months or even years.

  • This probably won't help you in the US but I have had 3 new logic boards in my 2011 17" MacBook Pro. They fail because of the solder of the onboard graphics chip, or so I understand. The first two were replaced under the product recall that Apple had for MBPs of that vintage when they acknowledged the fault. The last was replaced after that recall had finished.

    By then I felt I was out of luck, but my nearest authorised service provider told me that they would get it replaced for me under the UK Sale of Goods Act which states that a product must be repaired or replaced if it fails within 6 years due to a design fault at manufacturing time. I paid them for an hour's labour but the logic board came from Apple. They are over £600 if you want to buy one I am told.

    They are likely refurbs given the age of the machine but it all happened without protest from Apple. I reckon that is pretty good.

    [Building on that experience I had an argument with Olympus about a well know fault in a camera 3.5 years old which I won and they refunded the not inconsiderable repair bill that I had paid to get it fixed quickly.]

    Your mileage clearly varied. Maybe I will be in the same situation if Apple don't fix the latency and multiple AU problem with my 12.9 in a reasonable timescale. It is 50 miles to my nearest service provider on slow roads :(

  • I've found that getting an appointment and going in an Apple Store results in problems being sorted very quickly. Went in a few weeks ago as my phone was eligible for a battery replacement and went away with a 'new' (probably refurbished) phone. Pretty good service.

  • When my 3GS iPhone home button started playing up, I made the three hour round trip to Cardiff Apple Store. They said they could fix it, but as it was three weeks over the 12 month warranty, I'd have to pay £95 for the repair. I thought this was a bit mean, declined, and used the on-screen button until it died completely a year later. A year or so later I discovered they actually had a legal duty to repair it free of charge, even though it was out of warranty, as it was a hardware fault. So they conned me basically.

    On the plus side the two refunded purchases I did: MacBook Pro suffering bruises from fuckwit courier, and iMac with graphic card issues, went smoothly.

  • @jn2002dk said:
    That sucks

    I pretty much always expect giant corporations are out to screw me if they can get away with it. That way i'm rarely disappointed

    Oh, fir sure, they are all anti the little guy. I have no illusions regarding Microsoft, either. I'm just much more familiar with how to 'adjust' their products.

  • @Mark B said:
    In my dealings with Apple I took my MacBook to an Apple store to have the screen replaced and picked it up 2 hours later. I'm not expecting that level of service every time but I know I would never get it from any other manufacturer.

    Are you a relative of Mr Cook. ;)

  • @brambos said:

    They were polite and the service was smooth and as one would expect from a premium brand.

    Yeah, but you are Brambos!

  • My iPad4 reboot every time I try to update more than three apps at once. Or reboot with no reason at all.

    And I can't do anything since I want to stay on iOS 9.X

  • @Artefact2001 said:
    I've found that getting an appointment and going in an Apple Store results in problems being sorted very quickly.

    >

    I explained to them that until my health improves, I'm not leaving the house much. But that didn't cut any ice. They can't even organise a return with a courier that collects.

  • @MonzoPro said:
    A year or so later I discovered they actually had a legal duty to repair it free of charge, even though it was out of warranty, as it was a hardware fault. So they conned me basically.

    On the plus side the two refunded purchases I did: MacBook Pro suffering bruises from fuckwit courier, and iMac with graphic card issues, went smoothly.

    Some you win, some you lose. I suppose what your experience proves is that, when they choose, Apple can get it right. Bad luck for me that this time, all they want to do is the minimum the jaw requires,

  • edited August 2017

    Oops, accidental double post.

  • I've had pretty good luck with Apple stuff so far---I was never an Apple user before about 2012, so I don't have the firsthand historical perspective of Apple products and services some people have. I buy the extra "Apple Care" they offer. They've sorted a few minor things out quickly and nicely. It sounds like they're not set up to be very flexible, though. Hopefully, you can get your problem resolved without more grief.

  • @lnikj said:
    This probably won't help you in the US but I have had 3 new logic boards in my 2011 17" MacBook Pro. They fail because of the solder of the onboard graphics chip, or so I understand. The first two were replaced under the product recall that Apple had for MBPs of that vintage when they acknowledged the fault. The last was replaced after that recall had finished.

    By then I felt I was out of luck, but my nearest authorised service provider told me that they would get it replaced for me under the UK Sale of Goods Act which states that a product must be repaired or replaced if it fails within 6 years due to a design fault at manufacturing time. I paid them for an hour's labour but the logic board came from Apple. They are over £600 if you want to buy one I am told.

    They are likely refurbs given the age of the machine but it all happened without protest from Apple. I reckon that is pretty good.

    [Building on that experience I had an argument with Olympus about a well know fault in a camera 3.5 years old which I won and they refunded the not inconsiderable repair bill that I had paid to get it fixed quickly.]

    Your mileage clearly varied. Maybe I will be in the same situation if Apple don't fix the latency and multiple AU problem with my 12.9 in a reasonable timescale. It is 50 miles to my nearest service provider on slow roads :(

    Top advice for anyone in the U.K. Forget that 12 months guaranteed s££t, doesn't affect your Statutory Rights is the important bit.

  • First, I had the exact same problem you had with my 2017 iPad pro 12.9. I had dropped it about 6 inches and didn't yet have a good protective case and it hit on the top right on the on/off switch. The clengarance between the switch button and the aluminum case around it is really tight on the new pros IMHO. In any case my switch got jammed down a bit right on the edge of activating. My iPad would turn off just from tapping my or jiggling my case! When I started getting the full turn off option I knew it had to be the switch. I used my fingernails to pull it out and the problems stopped. However, if I use the switch it gets stuck again. I was waiting until school started so I could go to a less crowded apple store to get it permanently fixed.

    As to support from Apple, there is a reason its been consistently rated #1 for years, everyone else sucks way worse smh. I have been using Apple stuff for over 15 years now, and between work and home I've probably gone through 20-30, computers, phones and iPads. I've never had an issue with support and every product but a 10 year old laptop still works fine. Both time I had to ship in a laptop (work laptop disk drives SMH and I was not allowed to fix it myself) I got them back either nest day or the day after. Since Apple stores popped up everywhere the turn around is much faster. Most of the visits were for me dropping and banging things up. I was a full time traveling consultant before the event described below.

    Oh wait, I'd completely forgotten but I don't remember much other than hospital events during that period of my life. I'd (my wife drove there) put a maxed out 17 inch laptop for repairs at an Apple store; I had spilled a big Coke on it FM, and they only wanted ~$500 to repair the $3500 laptop. However, I was getting cancel treatment, 100+ days of home based chemo that really screwed my over followed by 40+ days full time in the Hospital followed by 60+ days of recovering enough not be 100% confined to a wheelchair. During this period they said I left my laptop there too long and it was theirs now! Honestly I only called them twice because other things were way more important.

  • I feel for you @Zen210507 , I've had shitty & wonderful experiences with companies and will communicate the experience to friends/family (which ALL companies no matter the size MUST realize is their best (or wo6 go û6advertisement: word of mouth). Some companies inevitably become so mammoth that the dissenting voices don't get the traction they once did in the public arena. Apple is so ubiquitous that a few awful online reviews just don't hold the weight they might of previously.

    But as the comments here in this thread show, face to face custom service especially in Apple's case, is considerably more fruitful and it's worth the hassle, even if it's a few towns away to the nearest mall with an Apple Store.

  • @JRSIV said:
    I feel for you @Zen210507 , I've had shitty & wonderful experiences with companies and will communicate the experience to friends/family (which ALL companies no matter the size MUST realize is their best (or wo6 go û6advertisement: word of mouth). Some companies inevitably become so mammoth that the dissenting voices don't get the traction they once did in the public arena. Apple is so ubiquitous that a few awful online reviews just don't hold the weight they might of previously.

    But as the comments here in this thread show, face to face custom service especially in Apple's case, is considerably more fruitful and it's worth the hassle, even if it's a few towns away to the nearest mall with an Apple Store.

    Opposite for me - online/phone returns were fine, but staff at the store gave me the brush-off, when they should have fixed my device.

  • edited August 2017

    I've never had any problems with Apple hardware and anytime I needed a software troubleshooting/refund all went pretty smoothly.

    N.B I'm not an associate or relative of Mr Cook.

  • @BigDawgsByte said:
    During this period they said I left my laptop there too long and it was theirs now! Honestly I only called them twice because other things were way more important.

    Using my partner's iPad Air 2 as my Pro is now in the post.

    Very sorry to read of your troubles, and hope you are making better progress now?

    As for Apple in person, yes I'd agree that if you are capable of getting in to a store they are better. Probably because an irate customer banging husband fist on the desk, looses tons of sakes.

    But if like you back then, and me at present, it's not possible to visit in person, the level of interest flatlines.

  • @lovadamusic said:

    It sounds like they're not set up to be very flexible, though. Hopefully, you can get your problem resolved without more grief.

    Thanks. I think it will get sorted. It's just that a little humanity and consideration would've been appreciated.

    I'm moaning about poor service here, but I'm the type of fellow who would've been equally quick to report outstanding service...had it happened.

  • @Zen210507 said:

    I'm moaning about poor service here, but I'm the type of fellow who would've been equally quick to report outstanding service...had it happened.

    I think that's the case with many so-called 'moaners' (like me), we're also the first to jump in, praise and recommend a product or service to others if it's good.

  • @MonzoPro said:

    @Zen210507 said:

    I think that's the case with many so-called 'moaners' (like me), we're also the first to jump in, praise and recommend a product or service to others if it's good.

    Yep. For me, this kind of imperative began when I was a book reviewer. I wanted to tell people about great books. Some authors' made that easy, others no so much. ;)

    With apps, I love to find something new and innovative, and take seriously the TestFlight stuff I do. 'Cause I want to help what is already a great idea, become super smooth by the time it gets released.

    Apple and Amazon both use a horrible 'chummy' approach, faux personal but disingenuous. In my recent issue with the forces of Amazon, I found that attempting to get to Jeff Bezos does produce a reply from a slightly higher ranking employee, pretending to give a shit and represent the great man. But if that doesn't work, they refer mail to what I am convinced are AI Bots of some kind.

  • @MonzoPro said:

    @JRSIV said:
    I feel for you @Zen210507 , I've had shitty & wonderful experiences with companies and will communicate the experience to friends/family (which ALL companies no matter the size MUST realize is their best (or wo6 go û6advertisement: word of mouth). Some companies inevitably become so mammoth that the dissenting voices don't get the traction they once did in the public arena. Apple is so ubiquitous that a few awful online reviews just don't hold the weight they might of previously.

    But as the comments here in this thread show, face to face custom service especially in Apple's case, is considerably more fruitful and it's worth the hassle, even if it's a few towns away to the nearest mall with an Apple Store.

    Opposite for me - online/phone returns were fine, but staff at the store gave me the brush-off, when they should have fixed my device.

    @MonzoPro Understood, exceptions & differences abound in life. But let me cut through to the point my post was trying to say nicely:

    When you're face to face with someone it's alot harder for them to feed you bullshit. For me sometimes the sqeaky wheel is true and the "more flies with honey" cliche isn't. You have to be a dick sometimes.

    Not saying to drop F bombs every other word or uproot tables (although my wife always busts my chops because that's my go-to missive under my breath to her, "Whatta I gotta do uproot some tables?!"), but showing some fire in person and firmly refusing incompetent horseshit to me most often works over the "Umm, okay..." trail off of defeat.

  • I've been using Apple products going back a couple decades, and I've always had a positive experience with Apple's support and warranty services. I once got a little steamed at a "Genius" visit, but as soon as they sensed the frustration, they over compensated and ultimately it was a great experience. There's a reason why I keep paying the higher prices for Apple products, and half of that reason is my own experience with stellar customer support.

    Oh, and no... I'm not pals with Mr. Cook either :)

    Hope your situation works out well for you though.

  • @skiphunt said:
    Hope your situation works out well for you though.

    Me too. In fact, I would be astonished if I didn't get a replacement.

    But the damage has been done, and short of doing something spectacularly nice, the only purchases I'll be making from Apple will be App Store stuff.

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