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Ploytec PL2 Hardware Synth - Controller/App Suggestions?

Question for the iOS/AudioBus experts out there...

I received a Ploytec PL2 hardware synthesizer as a birthday gift. It's basically a little mini sound-module that you plug either a 5-pin MIDI cable (black version) or USB MIDI signal (white version) into, and then it outputs sound through a mono RCA jack. It's somewhat limited in scope, but is capable of some gritty sounds with its dual oscillator setup and unique waveform options.

http://www.ploytec.com/pl2/pl2s_full.jpg

The tricky thing about it is how the editing and patch creation work. All of the synth parameters (even things like volume, decay, waveform, etc.) are assigned to various MIDI CC numbers. There is an iPad editor specifically for the PL2 - it works, but I'm wondering how I would go about controlling these items with a more robust sequencer app (ModStep?), or perhaps even a synth/MIDI controller with MIDI out. (I attached a picture of the command list below for reference)

QUESTION: What iOS app, or MIDI controller would you recommend to control the PL2? Also, does anyone have one that could give me some tips on how they use it?

I have a good assortment of DAW's and Sequencers (MTS, ModStep, Genome, ChordPolyPad), endless iOS synths, and a few hardware keyboards with MIDI out (Korg microKORG XL+, CME XKey 37, Akai MPK Mini 1 USB). Thanks for the help - I LOVE the idea of this little synth, but am still pretty new to MIDI and not sure how best to use it.

http://i725.photobucket.com/albums/ww253/StormJH1/Guitar Gear/65CF2694-31B3-4855-B849-4BB8A7265D79_zpseu0aspyg.jpg

Comments

  • Nice! I've been eyeing the PL2 for a bit. Look forward to any impressions you share.

    Think any old sequencer with CC support will do. Just depends on what you're used to. I'm assuming the control app sends MIDI out. Just route that to your sequencer of choice and tweak away, recording the CCs as you go. You may need to involve something like MIDI Flow to get the app to speak to both your sequencer and the hardware port, depending on how the control app works.

  • It occurs to me you could buy 12 of these for the same price as the new behringer thing and probably end up with a much more interesting synth (once you worked out the MIDI routing). :)

  • Thanks @syrupcore ! I guess the problem I'm having is that the only controller I have that is at all "CC friendly" is the MPK Mini 1, which has the 8 pads and 8 knobs in addition to 25 keys, but it's a USB controller. So I can use it into the CCK as USB, or I can use my MIDI interface for the 5-pin MIDI Out connection to the PL2, but not both at the same time. :neutral:

    All I really want to be able to do is change through the presets with a button or knob on my controller, and then I can set those up in advance with the editor. In addition to that, I think output volume is an absolute must, as well maybe a filter cutoff/resonance, and ADSR. 8 parameters should easily be enough. I tried to do it in ModStep last night, but I couldn't even get the MIDI Out to work because the U.I. is so weird in that app. Later that night, I read the online manual and found that there was a whole "IO" button on the bottom right of the screen I had missed. Modstep actually has a template for the CC mappings of the PL2, but I think your only choice is to control them with X/Y pads, not knobs or sliders. I'll try it again tonight, hopefully.

    If you do a Google search, there's a couple of vendors selling the PL2 and Leukos for $77 right now. I just thought that was a pretty good deal, even if it's more just something to play with right now until I figure it out better.

    Is the PL2 super-useful to someone who already has a new-ish iPad with a solid MIDI keyboard and a collection of great iOS synths? Probably not. Especially if you're tied to the editor screen to be able to use it. But I got the black one because if I can figure out how to set it up with a few controls, it's pretty neat to have something this small you could load with up to 64 presets, is powered by a MIDI cable and could be plugged directly into a mixer.

  • @StormJH1 said:
    Thanks @syrupcore ! I guess the problem I'm having is that the only controller I have that is at all "CC friendly" is the MPK Mini 1, which has the 8 pads and 8 knobs in addition to 25 keys, but it's a USB controller. So I can use it into the CCK as USB, or I can use my MIDI interface for the 5-pin MIDI Out connection to the PL2, but not both at the same time. :neutral:

    Sounds like you need a USB hub. With a hub in place you should be able to plug both the MPK and MIDI interface into your CCK at the same time. Then you can go MPK->Hub->CCK->iPad. With the MIDI interface also in the hub, you can point the MIDI from the MPK at your interface which will drive the PL2.

    All I really want to be able to do is change through the presets with a button or knob on my controller, and then I can set those up in advance with the editor. In addition to that, I think output volume is an absolute must, as well maybe a filter cutoff/resonance, and ADSR. 8 parameters should easily be enough.

    I don't own an MPK but is there editor software for it so that you can set what each of the knobs is sending? I can see from images that it has a program change mode so you should be covered there. I also see Pad Bank 1 and Pad Bank 2 buttons. Does that also create a separate bank for the knobs? If so, you'll have 16 covered.

    Also, several of the CC addressable controls on the PL2 are binary (on/off) controls—the ones that say 64-127 on the list are saying 'if you send CC n with a value anywhere between 64-127, this control will be set to ON'. You might be able to set the MPKs pads to transmit CCs to control those sorts of parameters instead of note on/off, I'm not sure.

  • edited August 2016

    @syrupcore said:

    @StormJH1 said:
    Thanks @syrupcore ! I guess the problem I'm having is that the only controller I have that is at all "CC friendly" is the MPK Mini 1, which has the 8 pads and 8 knobs in addition to 25 keys, but it's a USB controller. So I can use it into the CCK as USB, or I can use my MIDI interface for the 5-pin MIDI Out connection to the PL2, but not both at the same time. :neutral:

    Sounds like you need a USB hub. With a hub in place you should be able to plug both the MPK and MIDI interface into your CCK at the same time. Then you can go MPK->Hub->CCK->iPad. With the MIDI interface also in the hub, you can point the MIDI from the MPK at your interface which will drive the PL2.

    That was literally occuring to me as I wrote my response! Do you have a recommendation for a powered USB hub that would work with iPad Pro? I've had this $16 Plugable one on my wish list for awhile, but it's USB 2.0 and the Pro does support 3.0.

    https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005P2BY5I/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=117D2V4KRBGLD&coliid=I15BJ8WL1IGCS5&psc=1

    AmazonBasics makes one for 3.0 that's the same price, but the adapter is only 5V, so I don't think it could charge the iPad.

    https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-Port-2-5A-power-adapter/dp/B00DQFGH80/ref=sr_1_9?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1470776655&sr=1-9&keywords=usb+3.0+splitter

    Ideally, I'd be looking for a hub that has 2-4 USB ports, is powered by at least the 12.5 watts or whatever the included iPad charger offers, and is $30 or less. Well, being able to charge the iPad while using external devices is more of an added benefit - my understanding is that I need a powered hub to some degree because the iPad itself probably can't supply enough power to run the MIDI interface AND a keyboard at the same time (or would smoke the battery if it did).

    Thanks @syrupcore ! Being able to use MIDI USB controllers with other gear that uses traditional MIDI connections would be a nice option to have (especially with the PL2).

  • Sorry, no specific USB hub recommendations. Buy local so you can return it if it doesn't work? That's what I wound up doing anyway. Worked fine so...

  • @syrupcore said:
    Sorry, no specific USB hub recommendations. Buy local so you can return it if it doesn't work? That's what I wound up doing anyway. Worked fine so...

    Actually, I may need that USB3.0 to Lightning Cable in concert with a USB powered hub if I wanted to charge the iPad AND receive data through the CCK. I'm not sure that running a powered USB connection into the old version of the CCK actually charges the iPad (does it?).

    Anyway, got a bit off topic here, but really appreciate the help. I'll definitely be looking for a good hub to try this out on, and will post back with findings on how easy or hard it is to set up the PL2 with a controller.

  • As a controller app check out TC-Data, it's easy to enter the CCs from your list once you get the idea how TC handles touches and movement.
    http://www.bitshapesoftware.com/instruments/tc-data/
    Advice: select a very simple patch that basically just triggers notes, the add 1 control item and assign various 'actions' to become familiar with it.
    It may look confusing at first, but it's well thought out an d not complicated at all.

    cheers, Tom

  • Or you could route Lemur, TB Midi etc to your DAW, record the movements, even modulate them in some of the controller apps, if you like a sound you've created save the DAW state and you can then reload, recreate it again.

  • edited August 2016

    Thanks for the suggestions, @Telefunky and @knewspeak . Those apps look awesome for more advance MIDI/CC control. But I'm not really looking for automation or anything crazy - I literally just need a control surface that I can tie to perhaps 5-10 basic parameters.

    Basically, I need a MIDI keyboard (to play notes, obviously), a few CC parameters for volume and so on, and a way to do program changes to cycle through the presets, which is the one thing I have yet to figure out, even with ModStep.

    On another thread, I discussed how midiSTEPs might be another option for sequencing the PL2, though it offers only 3 CC parameters at one time, and they are programmed by step. So not really ideal for this.

    I did order a $16 USB powered USB hub, just to own in general, but so that I can try to plug in a USB keyboard with CC knobs while I'm also using the MIDI interface to the PL2. Thanks for the suggestions!

  • @StormJH1 said:
    Thanks for the suggestions, @Telefunky and @knewspeak . Those apps look awesome for more advance MIDI/CC control. But I'm not really looking for automation or anything crazy - I literally just need a control surface that I can tie to perhaps 5-10 basic parameters.

    seriously - you entirely miss the point:
    TC-Data is THE app to complement your new toys, it fits perfectly
    simply ignore all the fancy, surrealistic graphic stuff, it can do extremely simple things in a nice way that's not available elsewhere.
    The app saves you the keyboard: it can tap notes from the surface in countless scales or sequences, whatever you prefer.
    If you extend your tap (that triggered the note) by some movement, then this movement is used to generate one or more controllers (as in the list of the Ploytek) and the change in movement can be used to alter the control. It's really simple.

    cheers, Tom

  • @Telefunky said:

    @StormJH1 said:
    Thanks for the suggestions, @Telefunky and @knewspeak . Those apps look awesome for more advance MIDI/CC control. But I'm not really looking for automation or anything crazy - I literally just need a control surface that I can tie to perhaps 5-10 basic parameters.

    seriously - you entirely miss the point:
    TC-Data is THE app to complement your new toys, it fits perfectly
    simply ignore all the fancy, surrealistic graphic stuff, it can do extremely simple things in a nice way that's not available elsewhere.
    The app saves you the keyboard: it can tap notes from the surface in countless scales or sequences, whatever you prefer.
    If you extend your tap (that triggered the note) by some movement, then this movement is used to generate one or more controllers (as in the list of the Ploytek) and the change in movement can be used to alter the control. It's really simple.

    cheers, Tom

    Thanks, i will definitely give it a look. I've heard good things in the past.

  • a cool feature of TC Data is the screen option 'show message list', which displays the midi stream dimmed in the left part of the screen.
    Helpful for tweaking komplex parameters or to check if you picked the proper CC at all, note on/off etc. If all is set up one can disable output, iirc it's set to on as default.

  • @Telefunky said:
    a cool feature of TC Data is the screen option 'show message list', which displays the midi stream dimmed in the left part of the screen.
    Helpful for tweaking komplex parameters or to check if you picked the proper CC at all, note on/off etc. If all is set up one can disable output, iirc it's set to on as default.

    That would be particularly useful for the PL2 - since the CC's literally replace the most basic of knobs and switches you would have on a hardware synth. I know there are other apps that could display this as well, though I'm sure it's done more sexily in TC-Data.

  • edited August 2016

    that's exactly the point with TC11 and TC Data: the great graphic can be very distracting.
    In fact I totally underestimated the app because the bling bling was as fancy as it seemed wierd. One HAS to read the description... then it all makes sense.
    It really helps to focus on just a couple of aspects one at a time to develope some sensitivity to what the graphic represents.
    Most examples I've seen were just arbitrary tippi di tapp tapps.

  • edited September 2018

    Hey! Bumping my own necro-thread here because there's been some changes/updates to the Ploytec PL2, which tangentially relate to iOS/mobile music.

    Ploytec released the video above showing off a controller map that allows you to control many (most?) of the major control changes on the PL2. This is significant because: (a) The UNO Synth is an affordable analog synth that seems to have sold reasonably well and would attract to the same consumer base as the PL2; (b) The UNO Synth supplies MIDI power and allows for a battery-powered control option; and (c) The PL2 is basically worthless until you map out a MIDI controller of some kind and control it by DIN MIDI.

    What's really cool about this is that you can combine sounds from UNO Synth and the PL2 using the Audio Mix In jack, for some really thick layered sounds. And it provides a basic arpeggiator and sequencer to use with the PL2. Also, changes you make with the controls of the UNO synth are auto-saved by the PL2, at least for the 32 user presets, so you can plug in and use them elsewhere.

    However, I tried to get this to work, and had quite a bit of trouble. Basically, I can get the PL2 to work using the iPad editor and one of the older firmware versions (2.0). But the iPad editor is old and does not even have the newer firmware versions (2.1 and 2.5). It also does not have the ability to remap the controller, which is necessary to set it up properly with the UNO Synth. The PC editor has all of these things, but for some reason, when I update the firmware on PC, I can't even get sound out of the thing anymore until I revert back.

    Basically this is a cry for help, but I feel like 8 people own these things across the U.S., and maybe 38 worldwide. That's probably an exaggeration, but...

    Anyone actually have one of these PL2's that could help me troubleshoot?

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