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Korg Gadget and External Midi Transport Control
Has anyone figured out how to get it working yet?
Comments
Not yet, but hope to find out.
From another thread...
Maybe somebody who owns nanoKONTROLStudio can use it with something like the MidiVision app to see if that data is exposed when using the transport buttons?
I pushed the buttons on my nanoKONTROLStudio and ran them through the MIDI monitor in Midiflow and here's the CC numbers that came out:
Play 041
Stop 042
Record 045
Cycle 046
|< 047
Wheel 110
Tracks
Mute 048 - 055
Solo 032-039
Rec Enable 064 - 071
Select 080 - 087
Pan 016 - 023
Faders 000 - 007
Move Tracks
Left 058
Right 059
Hope this helps!
OOOOH! Sure it helps !!!
Will try tonight with my nanokontrol2 (the usb one)
oh my god. if you figure out the messages required please post here. would love to reprogram my remote zero to do gadget transport controls. i'm pretty sure the gadgets listen to the same cc messages so its not just the cc. we need to figure out what channel its listening on.
your right, and setting up the channel on the nanokontrol2 is kind of a pain in the a...
might not be that simple, hope that ill figure that out ^^
Hey @Reid
Thanks for Checking this.
I thought they would have been MMC commands rather than CC numbers.
Do the nanoKONTROLStudio buttons control your transport in Gadget? Did you have to do any setup?
Thanks again.
I don't have a nanoKONTROLStudio... but...
I'm concerned that what you are seeing is the nanoKONTROLStudio working in non-'Gadget native mode' - but just working as a standard midi controller.
I can imagine that those are the default ccs that are sent from the controls if the nanoKONTROLStudio is not connected to Gadget (but used to drive, say, another iOS daw). And no doubt you can choose what channel you send on.
My guess is that there is some kind of 'native' mode that it uses and sends MMC commands (or something special) when it knows it's connected (native mode?) to Gadget.
One way to test that i'm wrong (I hope I am) would be to simply direct the midi as:
nanoKONTROLStudio > MidiFlow > Gadget
then check that Gagdet transport is indeed responding (and again check the messages being sent by using MidiFlow's monitoring).
My sususpion is that it's not that simple (because normal midi ccs and midi channels are surely used to control the playing the gadgets themselves) - but I hope i'm wrong.
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Not sure if this helps the cause, but the "other settings" for Gadget has some native mode toggles ...
Yep. @brice that would support my hypothesis - maybe...
My remote zero can be programmed to send program changes,cc whatever. I just need someone to disect the messages in native mode lol.
@ MF 2000 Unfortunately that is my suspicion too. Korg doesn't expose it's transport controls to Midi learn so I doubt they would have it controlled by a CC# that could be overwritten by the user. Certainly appreciate @Reid's report on what his controller was using however. All puzzle pieces are useful.
Yep. Theres a 'native mode' between the old NanoPad2 and iElectribe too. It's pretty clever - irrespective of how you have the NanoPad set up it seems to send a message to the NanoPad and changes all it's messages. So iElectribe and NanoPad are commuicating back and forth between each other. I suspect the same will be the case here.
I'm not sure how you could intercept that and figure out what messages are being sent - unless you can somehow get 'native mode' to run through Midiflow...
That's exactly what I did. nanoKONTROL set as Input Keyboard and Gadget as destination.
I just did it again and I stopped and started Gadget's transport and adjusted the faders while watching the above numbers go by. I don't see why the other stuff wouldn't work in the same way.
Yes, I have nanoKONTROL set as running in native mode in settings. If I have bluetooth turned on, when I open Gadget, it gives me a message that it has seen both the nanoKONTROL and nanoKEY immediately. Then I just have to go in the settings and connect them. It pairs them in seconds. You don't have to pair them through the iOS seettings. So no setup @SpookyZoo It just works. It runs all the things I put in my comment flawlessly.
If you want to run the nanoKONTROL for anything besides Gadget, then you have to turn it on while holding some buttons. For example,if you want to run Auria, you'll need HUI, so you set it up like you would for Pro Tools, by holding down "Scene" and "Rewind" buttons when you turn it on. People who have old nanos are familiar with how this works. There are different button combinations for Live, Sonar, Digital Performer, etc. Logic/Garageband needs special software. (On the other hand, pairing nanoKEY with bluetooth is nearly the same as using a USB connection; it runs most of my synth apps once I've done that)
@Matt_Fletcher_2000 I just got Midiflow today, but it seems to me that all anybody would need to do is buy midiflow and the IAP "Controller Remapping" Then just turn whatever button, slider, or knob you want on your controller and then remap the CC to something on my list. When done, hit the "save as" button to save it as a preset.
But I don't know for sure. I just got it. But I am going to do my own experiments with this cool IAP, and I'll write about them.
As for the question of MIDI channel, I just remapped the signal from the nanoKONTROL to a few different channels with no change in response from Gadget. So I believe Gadget is receiving on OMNI.
The problem with this is that I made templates for most of the gadgets in modstep. And a lot of the midi cc you have listed are used by the gadgets as well. So clearly just sending the midi cc ain't working. For example I'm pretty sure CC 42,45,47,50,51,53..... Are used by Amsterdam for reverse,pan,tune,eg mode, eg time, reverse...... Which would conflict with what you posted above. And even when sending those midi cc nothing happens in the transport controls. Only the gadget gets affected. If gadget was listening on omni none of the gadgets would work with multi channel midi.
Interesting.
I still don't quite see how the NanoKontrol would control Gadget's transport and faders with those CCs because they are used to control parameters inside gadgets too.
Maybe it's controlling Gadget via MMCs in native mode and also sending midi CCs?
Or it's also sending something else to Gadget so those CCs are interpreted differently?
But I want to believe.
Precisely what I'm thinking. It probably explains why changing channel has no effect.
Hopefully we'll get to the bottom of this
@Reid the thing to try, if you wouldn't mind, would be to switch native mode off in the iOS settings that @brice posted.
Then try exactly the same thing.
I would guess that MidiFlow would pick up the same CCs from the NanoKontrolStudio but if you send them through on to Gadget then Gadget's transport and faders etc. won't respond.
Matt, this is effectively the same sort of relationship that Native Instruments has with its S-series MIDI controllers and their software component, Komplete Kontrol? In this case proprietary Korg controller and software it's able to speak to (Gadget)? Reason I ask is that in the documentation for KK, it states that the hardware (controller) "switches to MIDI mode when....." Which begs the question, what mode was it in prior to switching? Whatever that mode was, or its protocol, it certainly provides an awful lot of communication between the hardware and software components. I know that in Logic the NI hardware used to use the Mackie Control Surface protocol for communication. I know nothing of that protocol, if it's MIDI based, or....? Just wondering if perhaps the proprietary nature of NANO/GADGET communication is utilizing something other than MMC/CC data for at least the transport operations. Shit, now I'm in this caper!
Sadly, you are correct, Matt. I tried running Gadget from my old nanoKONTROL using Midiflow and it didn't work.
Something else is going on. The cc info I'm getting from midiflow doesn't tell the whole story. But if it is sending out those cc's, then why doesn't it get in the way with Amsterdam?
@Matt_Fletcher_2000 Oh sorry, Matt. I didn't try your test yet.... I will do so soon.
I got distracted actually playing music.
I was wondering that too. Possibly because Gadget knows not to listen to CCs from the NanoKontrolStudio if it's locked into native mode with it. Ie it no longer sees it as a midi controller.
I sent a message to KORG via Twitter (they follow me, and are usually pretty quick to answer). If they provide any info, I'll be sure to share it here.
@Matt_Fletcher_2000 When nanoKONTROL isn't in Native Mode it doesn't work.
I can understand why Korg wouldn't advertise the transport control data. We're all gonna have to buy a nanoKONTROL at the end of this!
I think that even if you could sniff the messages being sent from nKS to Gadget in native mode, and even if it is some proprietary non standard SysEx stuff, could somehow program those same messages into another controller... It still wouldn't work. My guess is Gadget has to know its talking to nKS for those messages to work.
It seems that the only non-proprietary external transport control Gadget responds to is AudioBus? Maybe AudioBus 3, with its upcoming MIDI capability will offer a solution.
Received an answer, short and sweet. Not possible to control the transport controls in Gadget via the nanoKEYStudio.
It does look like they've locked that up. Most likely, as @SpookyZoo said, to the encourage the purchase of the nanoKONTROLStudio.
If AB3 allows MIDI mapping for its transport control, and Korg doesn't intentionally break the AB transport that now works fine, then that will be a workable solution.
I do want to point out that if you are considering a nanoKONTROL...
it also can control Auria Pro wirelessly
and can be used as a controller with 8 knobs, 8 faders, a scroll wheel, and 44 buttons on Gadgets and any music app that takes MIDI learn.
Plus, if you use the software, you can program 6 Scenes as you like.
https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/14365/nanokontrol-studio-control-auria-pro-wirelessly-remap-8-knobs-8-sliders-wheel-44-buttons#latest
I'd the midi channel show up ?? If the mixer is controlled by midi it's gotta be on a separate channel so a user mapping couldn't interfere with the messages. Idky they didn't just include the mixer in the midi mapping capabilities on gadget.